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The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube
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I've been taking a closer look at 3T bikes and the amount of BS I see is too much. 3T claims that their Exploring bike is "aero" even though it has a huge box shaped downtube, not even any effort at faking a "kamn tail" where the tube is still suppose to taper at least to some degree. Instead we get a square box that is somehow "aero". Pure marketing.




http://road.cc/...exploro-ltd-frameset

And don't even get me started about their so called aero seat post ad seat tube. Bernoulli is spinning in it's turbulence!
Last edited by: Hybridlete: Sep 7, 17 11:52
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Maybe like Zipp, they have discovered the amazing aerodynamics of biomimicry, this time emulating the airflow of a hammerhead shark............
Last edited by: SBRcanuck: Sep 7, 17 11:49
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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I dont know, the variable here is what does a 700x35mm knobby tire do to the air? Does it disrupt it enough that there's no use in trying to reattach the air? That's what they're saying.

Only the windtunnel knows....

Want: 58cm Cervelo Soloist. PM me if you have one to sell

Vintage Cervelo: A Resource
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [jeremyb] [ In reply to ]
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jeremyb wrote:
I dont know, the variable here is what does a 700x35mm knobby tire do to the air? Does it disrupt it enough that there's no use in trying to reattach the air? That's what they're saying.

Only the windtunnel knows....

Yeah, right. Let's make the downtube a blunt box shape with no taper and make it 3X the size of the widest tire you can fit on the thing and still call it aero! It's a brick. It looks like a brick, quacks like a brick, and moves through the air like a brick.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Look at some other photos, leading edge of that downtube isnt square.... show me a more aero cyclocross bike...

https://twohubs.blogspot.com/2016/12/3t-exploro-team-shimano-dura-ace-r9100.html













Want: 58cm Cervelo Soloist. PM me if you have one to sell

Vintage Cervelo: A Resource
Last edited by: jeremyb: Sep 7, 17 12:22
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [jeremyb] [ In reply to ]
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This guys whole MO is Knee jerk.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Also, the downtube is not the leading edge of the bike.

jens: This is aero-shaming. And it's not OK.
Murphy'sLaw: We shame because we care.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
And don't even get me started about their so called aero seat post ad seat tube. Bernoulli is spinning in it's turbulence!

I'm beginning to think you don't understand turbulence or its impact on aerodynamics. What does a turbulent wake do to cause drag, in your opinion?
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [jeremyb] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wasn't suggested the leading edge was square, but rather observing that the trailing edge was. The shape of the trailing edge turns out to be rather crucial for aerodynamics, though many find that unintuitive. I was under the impression that the squared-off 3T tubes were what are called Kamm tails, which can be aerodynamically beneficial, but in fact they do appear to be surprisingly square.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [niccolo] [ In reply to ]
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i can't be sure, but i think the OP is referring to the exploro. i believe i'm having dinner with the half-owner of 3T at interbike. i'll let him know he doesn't know anything about aerodynamics, which means he probably didn't when he designed all cervelo's bikes up thru the P5 when he founded and owned that company.


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Can you ask him why they aren't marketing the Exploro as the most aero Tri bike ever? Just look at how wide those wheels and how truncated those tubes are! It's to next evolution of aero! At what point did they stop trying and just start mocking athlete stupidity?
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
Can you ask him why they aren't marketing the Exploro as the most aero Tri bike ever? Just look at how wide those wheels and how truncated those tubes are! It's to next evolution of aero! At what point did they stop trying and just start mocking athlete stupidity?

i can't be sure, and i can't speak for them, but i suspect they're not marketing the exploro as the most aero tri bike ever because the exploro is a gravel plus bike. i think the idea was to make an all-rounder as aero as is practicable while retaining all the imperatives that attack to a bike of that style. how well they succeeded i don't know because i haven't tested the bike for its aerodynamic qualities.

cervelo made pretty contained and moderate aero claims about its P5X, only referring to its performance compared to its existing P5. the company and the bike got roundly ridiculed often in the most ungentlemanly terms, by folks who were beyond certain the bike was an aero dog. and then we found out it is very possible the most aero bike you can buy for triathlon.

so, sometimes companies make silly claims. sometimes they don't. i think the folks behind the exploro have a track record that stands up.

but don't let that get in the way of a good old fashioned roast!


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [ahhchon] [ In reply to ]
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ahhchon wrote:
why do ya'll keep responded to this troll?


Because after saying "Giro Advantage 2" and "latex tubes" 1,000 times one looks for a little spice in their ST life ;)

jens: This is aero-shaming. And it's not OK.
Murphy'sLaw: We shame because we care.
Last edited by: GreenPlease: Sep 7, 17 19:09
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [ahhchon] [ In reply to ]
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ahhchon wrote:
why do ya'll keep responded to this troll?

At least he isn't talking about girly legs.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
Can you ask him why they aren't marketing the Exploro as the most aero Tri bike ever? Just look at how wide those wheels and how truncated those tubes are! It's to next evolution of aero! At what point did they stop trying and just start mocking athlete stupidity?

If Slowman invented the tri bike, the guy behind the 3T bike perfected the TT and tri bike and probably has more more victories from riders using his aero bikes than any other company in the past couple decades... but carry on, sir. Personally, I would defer to his design judgement more than just about anyone else.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerard_Vroomen
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [wetswimmer99] [ In reply to ]
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wetswimmer99 wrote:
If Slowman invented the tri bike, the guy behind the 3T bike perfected the TT and tri bike and probably has more more victories from riders using his aero bikes than any other company in the past couple decades... but carry on, sir. Personally, I would defer to his design judgement more than just about anyone else.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerard_Vroomen

When was the last time a Cervelo bike even won a TT? Cervelo hasn't been relevant in time trials since forever now.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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There are a couple of National TT champions riding on Cervelo, male and female.

Just sayin'...
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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I'm the first to agree that there's a hell of a lot of marketing nonsense thrown around by the bike industry, and especially in relation to aerodynamics, but you sir, are not helping.
You know a very little and wield it as though it were an all conquering sword.

The reality is quite different and in my opinion you've become quite tiresome very quickly. Go back to the thread linked below, which you bailed out of after making a fool of yourself and prove you can actually make a valid argument, defend it or concede your errors when you're wrong. If you can't do that, I reckon you're wasting everyone's time.


Giant Goes There: Says Their Disc Brakes Are More Aero Than Calipers
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
...i'll let him know he doesn't know anything about aerodynamics, which means he probably didn't when he designed all cervelo's bikes up thru the P5 when he founded and owned that company.

That's why he hired Damon... ;)

All joking aside, why would anyone care about the aerodynamics of a gravel / all-around bike??
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:
All joking aside, why would anyone care about the aerodynamics of a gravel / all-around bike??

Because it moves through the air...?
:-)

Damon Rinard
Engineering Manager,
CSG Road Engineering Department
Cannondale & GT Bicycles
(ex-Cervelo, ex-Trek, ex-Velomax, ex-Kestrel)
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [damon_rinard] [ In reply to ]
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Who invited you?! :)

Hopefully they are using ufo chain lube for the extra watt.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:
...All joking aside, why would anyone care about the aerodynamics of a gravel / all-around bike??
Well if it's an "all-around bike" then everything may be relevant at one time or another. No?
Surely much of the attraction of this type of bike is that you can use it off-road, on road, wherever. So it's not irrelevant.

And the idea that aerodynamics is irrelevant at certain speeds is wrong anyway. It would be fair to say that in low speed cases it probably shouldn't be a priority but that doesn;t necessarily mean one shouldn't care.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the aero test data yet:

https://www.3t.bike/...O/realfast-graph.jpg

So:
They gave it 40mm wide knobbly tyres instead of 28mm mostly slick road tyres
They added 2 x750ml bottles
They added mud rather than it being clean

And it was STILL more aero than the base frame. It would be nice if they told us what the base frame was, but taken at face value it seems reasonably impressive.
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Re: The 3T Exploring Bike Claims To Be Aero With a Box Shaped Downtube [Ai_1] [ In reply to ]
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Ai_1 wrote:
SBRcanuck wrote:
...All joking aside, why would anyone care about the aerodynamics of a gravel / all-around bike??

....

And the idea that aerodynamics is irrelevant at certain speeds is wrong anyway. It would be fair to say that in low speed cases it probably shouldn't be a priority but that doesn;t necessarily mean one shouldn't care.

I'm not arguing that.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding what this bike will be used for. My point was, for situations where someone is using an 'all around' bike, do they care about saving watts?

Carry on. :)
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