Sounds like an awful experience....

Maybe your friend is tensing up involuntarily because of inexperience or something deeper, like the not so irrational fear of being crashed by riders of unknown abilities?

My friend just couldn't put his health/life into hands of people who he only met randomly once or twice a week....with unknown skillz and riding pedigree.

As my friend couldn't find a group to ride more with consistently that was also containing only predictable and reliable riders, he is now happy riding without a group.

I am 62 and have not experienced anything like this.
It sounds psychological??? I am not dismissing any real fear. I know a lot of triathletes that can or will not ride near a group of cyclists. Has he crashed at high speeds or when in a group?

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Team Zoot So Cal

There are several things to check before deciding that anyone with shaky handling is a nutcase (in order of likelihood)
1. Bike fit - saddle too far forward or too much reach leading to too much weight on the hands - creates arm and shoulder tension. Any nervousness or external inputs will be magnified by this
2. Weight distribution on the bike - too much weight on the front wheel (usually related to 1. but doesn't have to be) will make the bike shaky
3. Loose headset. Always worth checking the basics.
4. Frame too stiff, frame too flexy, tyres too hard - anything that increases input from the road or magnifies oscillation

If none of these apply I'd suggest riding in smaller groups to get confidence back. But from the sound of it - something is wrong so the rider is entered a nasty feedback loop and will not gain confidence until that is sorted.

I'm not going anywhere near a group of people let alone one guy I kinda know at 35 mph.

Good points. Do wonder about the other riders and seemingly following them blindly... When I'm right on the back of a jersey and all I can see is jersey, it's disorienting and I tense up even though I'm telling myself, relax you did this years ago. I do get better as the ride goes; yet, at new levels of speed/thrills it can come back.

It does make riding alone seem like a piece of cake and more enjoyable. All of the focus is on myself, not others and I can see what's ahead of me.

My friend is about ready to just ride alone or with one other person and stick to triathlons and time trials. Here he was hoping that once a week riding through most of the year would take care of it.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

He used to crash a lot as a junior/Cat 3 while racing/training. Has not crashed in a long while. His balance is not that great with some inner ear issues. Promises himself that the "next" crash will probably be it for him and road cycling (the older he gets).

He might just ride alone or with just one other rider. It's humbling and others in the group can see how twitchy he's on the bike at times.

About the only thing he will miss out on is some socialization and surges where he's lucky to stay on a wheel and not go off the back.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

Appreciate your list. Will take it to someone much more expert than me to see if any of these are the case that would magnify the psychological. Have a bike fit in mind for the coming year. What doesn't make a lot of sense is why isn't the physical bike the problem when riding alone at similar speeds and roads. So I'm kind of bummed that it's probably 25% or less physical and 100% or more mental.

Thank you for your suggestion too.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

Is it possible to just hang on the back of the group? I did this for a while for different reasons and for many months. The group wanted me to ride with them so we all agreed that during the rotation I was on the back for the full ride and opened up a hole when the lead cyclist came off the front in the rotation. Worked out well for that period of time.

The other thing that is potentially dangerous going to solo cycling is the potential on not holding a tight line at the edge of pavement when the violating driver get too close. That happened to me a few weeks ago when a semi truck came back over too soon and for about half the length of the trailer it was less than 2 feet from my shoulder and I had no more room on the pavement. Had I not been able to hold the straightest of lines no telling what would have happened.

Not related to the OP's friend, but some of the comments here made me think of this piece I wrote some years ago:


Staying Up: Avoiding Crashes in Bike Races and Group Rides

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http://www.jt10000.com/

Good points made. This one in particular could help me. Fourth, whenever riding, keep a broad focus and stay aware of what’s going on around you. Don’t stare at the rider in front of you but instead look further ahead. The faster you’re going, the further ahead your focus should be.

Later, you write about know your limits. True. Many crashes happen when people are riding at their limits. I may stop watching TdeF and cycling coverage as the crashers I see there are not helping my state of mind.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

Did try being the "sweeper" at the back today. And either I was too tired from 3 1/2 hours from the day before or because I couldn't see down the road, I felt worn out after 30 minutes.

Was thinking about riding behind the B group, more than a few lengths and getting in a workout that way. It also helps if I ride at the front of the group in top three. It helps if I pick a good rider's wheel that I know and like - obviously someone better than me at this - and strive to stay on that wheel.

When riding alone I choose courses even if they are only 3-8 miles of length that I repeat. So I am riding just a few courses where it seems like the local traffic gets used to me on the road.

Would like to make some progress rather than manage a decline. Maybe progress would be the best rider at the front of the C group rather than the nervous rider in the A/B group?

Dang, it's frustrating being uncomfortable in a pack of riders.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

I took a drafting clinic last season that really helped me get comfortable in a group (I don't have the same level of experience as your friend). By the end of the session, we were riding several wide (in a huge parking lot) passing a bike pump from rider to rider, riding leaning into the person next to us, riding with an arm over someone's shoulder, etc. Also did plenty of practicing on individual bike handling, as well as riding in an echelon. It was really worthwhile.

I am very comfortable in my group, but I know that if I were to get into a Cat 3+ group I would no doubt be uncomfortable and they would be frustrated. There are always different degrees of experience it seems. I was talking to a friend not too long ago who is a very solid Cat 3 and he was telling me of a ride that he got a fairly good scolding from some Cat 2 and 1's in a training ride for not holding a good pace while he was on the front for a few moments. I think that shook up his confidence a little. So I suppose it can happen in those upper ranks even when some seem above our level.

I had a fairly bad crash in 2007 racing down a mountain. That really got to me mentally I could not shake it and it still impacts me today. I went from being one of the fastest descenders to probably one of the slowest in my group. I have become a little better again, but once those thoughts that cause anxiety are allowed it is hard to shake them.

I remember a number of years ago in the TDF one of the guys asked Bobke what was the best attribute of a pro cyclist. His response, "A short memory." These guys have bad moments and we will have bad moments with enough time on the road. Do we let them get to us or do we just get back on the bike like it never happened. I know my memory is not short enough in many cases.

Have you cycled in a group consistently for many years or is this something you began recently or after a long break? If it's the latter, I think it's probably just a matter of getting comfortable riding in the group, which realistically is more difficult when our physical skills start to decline a bit. I like your idea of being the alpha in the C group until you build your confidence. If it is the former, I feel for you and I'm already thinking at 58 about how I'll deal with it when the time comes that I can no longer ride with my younger friends.

Ride more with the same people is my suggestion. I’m a pretty good bike handler, but being around a group can be rough because it’s no longer about me being able to ride well it’s about everyone else riding well.

It’s one of the main reasons I really don’t do bike races. I just don’t have enough confidence that everyone else isn’t going to screwup. But if you’re riding with the same group, as you ride more you should get more confidence they know what they are doing, so you don’t need to worry about it as much.

These are good suggestions. Also consider your vision (how is it?) and your functional balance. Riding rollers indoors does wonders for balance and handling.

Classic Fear/Avoidance behavior. Anxiety and stress disorder related to trauma, but why this has occurred recently is the larger question? Not sure from your op if he crashed recently, or many years ago. Has he been riding for years, or just recently gotten back?

Anxiety is a very cruel syndrome: a smell, a physical sensation or even light can trigger a panic attack decades later.

Perhaps a close friend or family member has also had a trauma, or passed away. Mortality anxiety.

Can't ignore visual perception disorders, even if not already wearing prescription. Go see a Doc.

Empathy for your bud, be a good friend and talk to him, I'm sure he doesn't understand his behavior either and it is upsetting to him.

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Anne Barnes
ABBikefit, Ltd
FIST/SICI/FIST DOWN DEEP
X/Y Coordinator
abbikefit@gmail.com

I feel ya. It's been years since I did any regular group riding, and I like it that way just fine. More about time flexibility and routes than anything else. But even when I was racing 4 days a week (often with the Cat 1-2 peloton) and doing more group rides than solo, I found myself liking to inch over a bit to (1) see down the road a bit, and (2) have a little more escape route in the case of a tire overlap.

The last few years, when I do fondo type events now, where anyone can be there, it can get dicey and I tend to tense up a little with unpredictable speed changes and people who aren't used to fluidity in a group. When I'm with racers, I feel a lot more comfortable (even if I'm more over my head pace-wise) because there's a lot less twitchy riding. But there's nothing wrong with solo riding.

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
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I suspect the tensing up is the entire answer. It took me a couple years to keep my upper body and hands loose while riding in situations that I assumed would be difficult, such as a twisty descent on deep wheels in the wind. Ironically this made my bike super twitchy in these situations reinforcing my discomfort.

You need to really internalize that staying loose and relaxed will give you the greatest ability to control the bike in unexpected tricky situations. In a group you also have to have trust in the people you are riding with that they won't do anything stupid. If you follow the track of their wheel, you won't hit anything that they don't hit, so you can have a reasonable expectation that anything you will encounter will be fine. Also the group should be pointing out all obstacles that would be a problem.

If you do not trust the group then I don't blame you for being uncomfortable.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

The latter, after a long break of 40 years. Would ride by myself or one other rider during in the last 20 years. Started group riding in the last two years and in a new group, very shaky. With just one other person, not shaky.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

Riding with the same people does help. If several new people show up, I can go back to being twitchy on the start up.

Gripping the bars harder doesn't help. Surprisingly, gripping the bars near the stem helps; but, my hands aren't near the brake levers then.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

Riding rollers is a good suggestion. I used to years ago and know it can be a challenge. If I "conquered" the rollers, that might improve balance and confidence.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

He hadn't ridden in a group for almost 40 years. Would do tri's and train alone. Just started with group rides in last two years. On the first ride, they stopped to check to make certain that his quick release hubs were on tight, he was shaking so much at times.

Talk to him all the time and it only helps a little.

A new pair of glasses could help. The ones he rides with are scratchy bi or tri focals. Maybe if he didn't have bi or tri focals that would be one less thing his brain would have to process.

Some mortality anxiety. Want to enjoy retirement. Some good cycling friends have passed. One passed after a heart attack on a group ride (I wasn't there) yet Gabe was so strong that he could drop me at will when we rode together.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.