I called O'Malley out (see bottom) on claiming that the use of a sports-drink like Carb-Boom would be the same as supplementing with biologics which I clearly specified in my post (if you cared to actually read it).

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So where did he say that? Did he not say that dave was talking salt supplements from the description of the stuff he was taking (soda + chips + carb boom). So I'm not sure what your whole long winded response was needed for.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

He did clearly say so. Dave questioned why people would take salt supplements, when he got enough from normal food (he then later detailed what he took in races for the salt supplementation). All he said was when you take soda+chips+carbo boom (i'm assuming it's a gel?) you are supplementing for salt. He didn't imply that was illegal, didn't say it was wrong, made no mention of it. He simply said your part of the supplement club, that is pretty much every person that takes a gu/gel/power bar/energy drink, etc. And that's not implying you are suddenly close to toeing the line of breaking the rules.....that wasn't even a discussion point, which is why trail asked you if you were high when you made your reply to O'Malley. Your post was a tangent that was basically irrelevant to what dave and O'malley were discussing over, salt supplementation.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

So in one sentence you use the words, "in my opinion", indicating that you have no solid facts to back up your claim. In the next, you refer to this person as a, "clown". Seems like hasty judgement to me.

I've only race with and talked with Lucas once or twice, and have no other reason to support him besides that he seems like a nice guy. I'll let this play out before I go bashing the guy with no reason aside from the proclivity of many of the people on this forum to be negative.

What is ostarine? and why is is mixed with salts?

I have no idea why it is mixed with salts (disguise?) but this is on the web:

So what is Ostarine?
In the medical field, Enobosarm, also known as Ostarine, is used for treatment of muscle wasting and osteoporosis. Moreover, the drug is also known to help reduce degeneration during recovery times from serious surgery or similar conditions.

As a PED (performance enhancing drug), it can be used by athletes to increase physical stamina and fitness, not unlike anabolic steroids. Thus, it was banned by the World Anti-Doping Agency in January 2008.

Ostarine, which displaces calories from fat stores and feeds them to muscle tissue, is proven to considerably improve lean muscle mass and physical performance, and increase in tendon ability, bone strength, ligament health and collagen turn-over.

Users have cited that Ostarine, taken at their normal caloric levels, produced weight loss while still generating gains in strength and muscle mass. Moreover, the drug is also known to help reduce degeneration during recovery times from serious surgery or similar conditions.

Benefits of Ostarine as a PED

• Increased lean mass gains
• Better strength
• More endurance
• Joint healing abilities
• Anabolic (even at doses as low as 3 mg)

Per steroid.com, the side effects of Ostarine are limited yet one will likely experience similar but more mild pitfalls associated with taking the typical anabolic steroid.

Ostarine is a known performance-enhancing substance that's banned by WADA. It's not supposed to be mixed with salts. The existing conjecture on how it might happen is that in the manufacturing facility that packs pills they don't do a good job of cleaning out their equipment. So if they're running a batch of MegaMass Xploder for GNC and then switch to making salt pills for triathletes, they don't bother wiping down the equipment to remove all the ostarine that went into MegaMass Xploder.

Or the athletes are lying and they're not mixed at all. But it's certainly possible that some are telling the truth.

Athletes who lie, of which there are probably many, ruin it for those who might be telling the truth, because we've been conditioned to just laugh off claims of "tainted supplements."

Sorta funny, i was looking over espn and they were going line by line over Tom Brady's pseudoscience claims...ESPN 538 (which is kinda like their stats division of espn) did a article on Tom Brady's "health claims". He mentions hydration for why he doesn't get sunburn, etc and all the pseudoscience that he "claims" are helping him.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/tom-brady-is-drowning-in-his-own-junk-science-advice/?addata=espn:frontpage
One of them includes taking a TB12 (which is how on brand) electrolyte.

Here's an decription of it from the TB12 site:

TB12™ Electrolytes contain 72 ionic trace minerals in varying amounts as found in sea water, including sodium, potassium, magnesium, chloride, sulfate, calcium, silicon, selenium, phosphorus, iodine, chromium, manganese, iron, copper, molybdenum, zinc, & vanadium.

And yet only 17 ingredients are put on the package ingridents....so those other "trace minerals" are.......????


And not that I'm claiming any BS, more or less just that "you better know what your putting in your body" and if you took something like this and used in your defense, you'd be an idiot. An product makes claims of using 72 minerals and only names 17 of them....that's bad.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Probably because salt doesnt add any value to your life?

17 out of the 93 USADA sanctions in 2017 included athletes who had Ostarine in their systems. That seems like a pretty high percentage to me.

That's more positives than Testosterone, HGH, and Clenbuterol combined. Crazy.

https://www.usada.org/testing/results/sanctions/

According to USADA site, 17 athletes (across many sports) got popped for ostarine in 2017 - obviously a common PED given how little USADA actually tests...

Anyone know how many of those athletes are endurance athletes that got popped?

Well that is why independent sourcing of bottles is so important by the regulating bodies. This is frankly the same problem I had when I went on an original bash fest of SLF motion bearings. They were advertising their data when THEY sent the bearings into Friction Facts to be tested, where as in all the other testing, Friction Facts independently sourced the product. Not saying SLF necessary cooked the books, but the process allows for that.

If independent bottles are sourced and are contaminated then we know athletes aren't cooking the books or at least feel better about it.

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9 track and field
4 weightlifting
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1 cycling
1 sitting vollyball

That's what makes it difficult for me to buy into the contaminated supplement excuse. Over the past 2-3 years ostarine has become "fashionable" as a doping substance. And then suddenly a few triathletes who fall victim to contamination just happen to fall victim to the fashionable substance, not some other random thing.

I guess there could be correlations. Maybe the factories are so busy pumping out ostarine pills for track and UFC (and NFL/NBA) that it makes it more likely that they'll be doing a run of electrolyte pills immediately after.

Fair point, but given that this is supposedly an issue of single-batch contamination, as well as the time-delay in testing samples, it might be difficult to independently source samples from the appropriate batch.

Are manufacturers legally required to keep samples of every batch of product that they turn out?

in addition, there are known companies, at least in the weightlifting world, that tend to "contaminate" their products... why triathletes are suddenly flocking to these brands is suspicious IMO. Too cute by half.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

Which seems to be the case here. Lucky for him that he bought in bulk so Lucas was able to provide factory sealed containers to his lawyer who had it sent to a lab (at $500 per test). They found the product that was contaminated but it’s not public, which of course leads to all sorts of speculation. But he said it’s a common supplement and one a former world champ has used as well. So not some shady one from the Internet I will Be curious to see if the product is made public. It’s always “bothered” me when it isn’t as it would be nice to know so we could be made aware of potential contamination as well.

Yeah, contamination is a difficult buy for me too.

So the anti-doping administration was not targeting triathlon? What category does the tri guy who tested positive fall into, cycling?

That's a great suggestion if they are not required to.

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I think we should be requiring athletes to control what they put in their bodies. The supplement market is unregulated.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

I have certainly wondered if “accidental contamination” is pretty good for business...

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Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team

I think athletes should be held accountable too, but athletes do not have the ability to control the supply chain. If companies are putting ingredient in their products that are not on the label but should be that is a problem. Again, this is salt we are talking about, not "get jacked, guaranteed!!!"

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let's cut to the quick here, what the hell!?