It's a beautiful piece of kit, but they lost me when they dropped the thumb shifters. Groups are way, way too expensive today, Sram and Shimano included.

kind of agree, not liking no thumb shifters. I've got SR 12sp EPS on both my road and Tri bike and love it. Not that I am going to update my Tri bike but wonder if they are going to finally come out with hydraulic brakes for the time trial brake/shifters. I've seen some early photos leaked but nothing that looks like a finished product.

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Mike Plumb, TriPower MultiSports
Professional Running, Cycling and Multisport Coaching, F.I.S.T. Certified
http://www.tripower.org

Campy took the features that I like the least about Shimano and SRAM,incorporated them into a new half-baked group and raised the price to beyond crazy.

The lack of a power meter, satellite shifters and bigger chain rings are probably why AG2R hasn’t been seen testing the new components yet and the chance that they get around to making hydraulic TT levers is basically zero. As a long time time Campy user I am so disappointed.

I think the group is really ugly. Like, shockingly ugly. The derailleurs, esp the rear, are so chunky and the chainset doesn't wow me like red or DA.

Campy’s aesthetics peaked with their 50th Anniversary group. Even so, I’ve always been a fan of their product. I don’t like the move to smaller rings and 10t cogs, which seems to be a solution to a problem that hasn’t presented itself. The price is high, but all e-groups are overpriced these days.

The thumb shifter was ergonomically nice. I’ll miss it.

If not a little too valued :-)

Are you talking about the new WIRELESS "Super Record Wireless" by chance? 10t cog, carbon crank/Ti spindle & 165 cm to 175 cm length cranks? Your Subject just says "Campy Record" so not sure if this is the one you speak of...?

Yeah, that's what I meant. I think it's the only new Campy group out now, but nothing wrong with being more specific.

If I shall need to buy a brand new group, it will be a mix of third party parts (Sensah, Sunrace, Microshift, Tektro etc.)

Looking at the price of super groups now is eye watering. I usually pick up spare parts along the way when they are on a good sale. Don't see any point in going higher up the chain than Ultegra either.

I would never spend over $4k on a group, at that point you are better off looking for a new bike, swapping bits about and selling the bike if you want to keep your existing frame/bike excluding the group.

To be fair, Campsgnolo is using a freehun design perfect for reverse Spinal Tap marketing: “But my free hub could,go to 9!”

Re the thumb shifters: the fact is that they would be damned if they did and damned if they didn’t. A lot of people simply don’t get along with thumb shifters, particularly for shifting from the drops.

Not disagreeing on the price, though. Plus I suspect DA and Red will get discounted more than Super Record, or indeed than Campy groups in general.

Yeah, my thumb ligaments are still recovering from my one Campy test ride 20 years ago.

I was a Campy fan boy for lots and lots of year, and when I finally went to brifters, I chose Campagnolo, as I liked the idea of being able to slam into a big gear quickly, which Shimano didn't allow at the time. (I started on the track as a sprinter, and carried over my lack of climbing ability to the road, where iI also focused on sprinting.)

Over the years, I gradually drifted away from Campagnolo in favor of Sram, mostly because of availability and cost. These days, I still prefer mechanical shifting to electronic, so I've been using Microshift on a few of my bikes for the thumb shifter.

But then, I also prefer the heavy actuation of the old Campy Record brakes over the light action of today's systems. This, I guess, is the curse of starting racing before all of these changes arrived.

Given that this is my 43 season racing, I don't find much of a need to slam gears down all that often given my age. But hope is eternal.

Electric/wireless shifting technology has not matured, but it's already easy to see third-party manufacturers having an easy time replicating it. The difficulty with making a direct copy of mechanical shifters is you still need to produce small components to very tight tolerances, there's not a way to do that cheaply. Little servos, batteries, and buttons are pennies each. Like a lot of things, the only thing standing in the way of cheap electric shifting is patents.

You are completely right on this, plus the still relative newness of mechanical shifting also will inflate costs, too. I'm also a watch enthusiast. While I have several very beautiful high end mechanical watches, I know that a decent quartz movement will keep better time, and at a fraction of the cost.

I used the original eTap when it came out. It worked fine, but not enough better for me to move away from higher quality mechanical. I anticipate that I'll have to move to electronic full-time at some point in the future, but then I'll need to abandon my perfectly fine rim brakes ;)

I think that it's time for me to go outside and yell at some clouds now!

No he's not. For electronic shifting you also need to make tiny mechanical components to very tight tolerances. And completely waterproof to boot. It took over 20 years to get electronic shifting right. And I'm not sure how it's not "mature." When there's flawless Shimano 105 electronic that shifts at least as well as Dura-Ace mechanical ever did - arguably better - I'm calling that "mature."

Yes he is :)

Seriously, mechanical tolerances don't have to be too tight, as errors can be addressed at the firmware/software level. Waterproofing is less of an issue today, too. Heck, manufacturers could embed most of the circuit boards and other electronic bits in a blob of epoxy, as I don't believe that the current generation of electronic shifting is reparable at the hardware level.

I did use Mavic's original versions of electronic shifting--communication protocols and software is way better these days.

Yes, you still need to make tight tolerance components in electric groups, but less of them and looser tolerances with less strength. The ratcheting barrel assembly has a huge amount of torque coming in from the lever concentrated on a <1mm face, which needs to pull a cable repeatedly to within <0.1mm and also release it reliably by the same amount. It also needs to fit within a lever which has been getting smaller with every successive generation. The manufacturing for an 11sp mechanical shifter inside of a brake lever is an engineering marvel. Comparing the tolerance of metal parts on an electric groupset is an order of magnitude different.

Re: Mature technologies - Just because a new tech has surpassed an old tech doesn't mean it's matured. Automobile technology certainly didn't mature when it could go faster/further/better than a horse buggy. There are innovations available with electric shifting that were not possible with mechanical that haven't even been thought of yet.

Sometimes you turn around a bend and there's a climb you didn't expect staring at you, great feeling to just crank down on that thumb shifter and drop into low gear.

That said, last major $$$ I dropped on a road bike was in 2005 (Centaur). If the folks buying bikes don't want it, makers are gonna stop making it.

If I made Super Record, the goal would be a premium ultralight groupset that consumers would consider well worth a $5.4k price tag, world tour pro's would feel at a disadvantage not using, and performance/aero/weight-weenies would all list this as their must-have groupset.

- 13s All Road
- thumb shifter
- 2x and 1x capable
- Maintain 2023 Super Record shifting speed. Ronan of Escape Collective stated shifting was a touch faster than Shimano R9200 Dura-Ace.
- Ekar + THM aesthetic for parts. Typeface a mix of 2023 Super Record & Ekar typeface.
- Only rear derailleur battery/wireless receiver to avoid SRAM patent issues, with wire to front derailleur for 2x use. keeps weight down, also.
- Acquire the aero 3T Torno crankset. Update to use direct mount for chainrings & powermeter. 290g w/out powermeter spider or chainring(s).
- Acquire Power2Max as powermeter. Reduce NG Road spider weight from 152g to 120g (AXS is 161g). Rebrand as Campagolo - comes with groupset.
- All big 2x chainring and 1x chainrings are aero (Aerocoach Aten chainring).
- Unlike the Sram Red/xplr split, a single rear derailleur that can handle up to 42t cog. Rear derailleur is tucked out of the wind and shaped to be aero.
- 3 watt-conscious 13s cassette options: 11-25, 11-28, 11-32
- 2 wide-range 13s cassette options: 9-36, 9-42
- Drivetrain is advised as “wax only” and comes with small 'Campagnolo' crockpot and 2 pre-waxed chains for rotating.
- Reduce weight on brake calipers eying what Trickstuff, Intend BC and Hope are doing with their 2-pot calipers. Aim to exceed Campy's already class-leading road disc brake performance. Rotors with central carbon body.
- 1,900g total weight w/ 58/38t x 11-32t
- 1,770g total weight w/ 48t x 9-42t & no front derailleur (that's my preferred 1x gearing)

Not included in price or weight, optional. Seeking strong aftermarket strategy for these premium Super Record parts:
- Hyperon Wheels: 25mm ID, 45mm depth, 320g rim weight (NSW 353 rim is 341g), 3.9g carbon spokes (Light Bicycle Flyweight), 213g hubs (Extralite Cyber) for 1,040g wheelset
- 'Supertuck' Road Dropper: ultralight road dropper for legal supertucks. With a dropper, supertuck can be maintained around hairpins. Lever on post to keep weight down and rarity of using it makes that a safe/smart/light option. maybe find semi aero shape that fits in most road bike seattubes w/ a dozen inserts available to fit proprietary frame seattubes.
- Sell crankset aftermarket.
- Sell brake calipers/rotors aftermarket w/ Sram & Shimano compatibility.
- Sell Powermeter aftermarket with high compatibility (Power2Max already does this well).

Would leave Ekar as mechanical groupset, but phase it out in 3 years as Record and Chorus versions of Super Record are released, electric only. All resources to Super Record, Record, Chorus. don’t chase 105/Rival.

Campagnolo sticks to its tradition, that the name „record“ refers to the price.

As to the technology:
It is a step forward to not have to mount a battery somewhere and attach it with cables to the derailleurs.
But the sram solution of having the same battery in the front and rear is of course better.

I never liked the „small cogs / small chainrings“ solution of sram, but it seems that Campagnolo has copied this bad idea (generally
accepted it is that large/large has less friction than small/small).

Wait and see how they will embody the TT solution for the shifters: whether there comes a bloody blib box or not.

I don't understand what Campagnolo is thinking here:
- 12sp instead of 13sp. They already have a 13sp group, it would have made sense. A move to 13 is probably meaningless for most cyclists, but it would at least give Campy something to differentiate themselves on.
- Wholesale adoption of SRAM's gearing. I actually run AXS on one of my road bikes, the smaller chainring + 10 tooth cog thing actually works fine. However, people who buy SR are traditionalists who are going to want a 53. Also, this is just copying SRAM.
- Hideous looking. A critical part of Campagnolo's appeal is how it looks. This group looks like bulbous trash. Everything is too damned big and ugly. It may be the worst looking group on the market.
- Compromised wireless setup. SRAM patented the interchangeable batteries which is a great feature so Campy is stuck with two different batteries. So it's the worst of all worlds: not as streamlined as Dura Ace, not as convenient as SRAM.
- Apparently it shifts like crap.
- That price. Seriously, Red, DA were already irritatingly expensive and now SR says "hold my beer". The $15k off-the-rack road bike that looks like every other bike is the worst trend in modern cycling. I'm convinced everyone should just buy 105 Di2 or Rival AXS, which are still irritatingly expensive but somewhat more tolerable.