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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [HalfSpeed] [ In reply to ]
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I saw your 2x1000 workout and got motivated today up at the high desert pool, only it was 84 degrees. Can you say boiling lobster?? Took yesterday completely off and have a slight pull in groin, didn't know if it was running or breast related, it is breast stroke after todays trial swim..

So started your set, got hot, and punted to a different swim, broken 1650 after short warm up:

3x100s@1;40(1;22/20/18) 2x100 flutter kick@2;00(1;54/53)

Broken 1650p 1000@14;00/500@7;00/150 (12;54/6;21/1;48). 21;02 total time

150 kick/ 100 bk/fr
2400SCY
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Some great advice from Jason.

Id take a day off before as well.
I am just going to reinforce a couple points. Get your legs warmed up. Youll use them more than you think racing in a pool. So best to get them going as those big muscles will eat up reserves quickly if they are not ready to go.
And since i now put myself in this category i can say it.. i recommend to older swimmers (esp triathletes who compete) to, if possible, in the warm up pool do a building set of 50s, like 4-6 of them where that last 50 is VERY HARD. Not like spend your last energy hard, but def harder than say 500 pace. More like a fast 200 pace. and finish that within 2 min of your event. (so about 2 heats before yours, finish your last one)
Then pop out.
Youll be breathing hard and soaking wet. But as we age, we need to have the engine going. Too much downtime and its hard to go again. I personally have had massive success with this method, as well as many of my swimmers.
Its like pulling teeth to get them to do it.. but they almost universally have a better race with that warm up.
Basically I noticed over a few years of masters meet swimming that once i hit the warm down pool AFTER one of my races.. I kept wishing I could go do the event again.
And yes, DEF warmdown after a race. Dont chit chat. Get in and move!

Anyways, food for thought.
good luck!
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [140triguy] [ In reply to ]
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This lungfish has been mostly on land, but averaging 2.5 runs per week and 6 rides per week for the last 3 weeks. I'm down 6 lbs and dipped under 200 for the first time in a couple of years. Swim tonight!

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [daved] [ In reply to ]
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daved wrote:
Some great advice from Jason.

Id take a day off before as well.
I am just going to reinforce a couple points. Get your legs warmed up. Youll use them more than you think racing in a pool. So best to get them going as those big muscles will eat up reserves quickly if they are not ready to go.
And since i now put myself in this category i can say it.. i recommend to older swimmers (esp triathletes who compete) to, if possible, in the warm up pool do a building set of 50s, like 4-6 of them where that last 50 is VERY HARD. Not like spend your last energy hard, but def harder than say 500 pace. More like a fast 200 pace. and finish that within 2 min of your event. (so about 2 heats before yours, finish your last one)
Then pop out.
Youll be breathing hard and soaking wet. But as we age, we need to have the engine going. Too much downtime and its hard to go again. I personally have had massive success with this method, as well as many of my swimmers.
Its like pulling teeth to get them to do it.. but they almost universally have a better race with that warm up.
Basically I noticed over a few years of masters meet swimming that once i hit the warm down pool AFTER one of my races.. I kept wishing I could go do the event again.
And yes, DEF warmdown after a race. Dont chit chat. Get in and move!

Anyways, food for thought.
good luck!

Thanks for the advice on when to finish the warmup. This was the hardest part I found about fast mass swim starts in triathlon too. IF you have a warmup, you end up spending forever doing not much and standing around crammed into a small pen where you can't move your arms and legs. So Definitely agree that ending the warmup 2-3 min before my heat would be a great idea. I thnk on day 1 my first event is 100 fly and right after that is 400 IM. I have no idea the time in between, but I don't think it will be that much since I will be in one of the slower groups in the 100 fly so likely at the end and the 400IM there just won't be a ton of heats overall, but then again, it is probably 10 min between heats of 400 IM so that could drag out for a while. I am spending my week basically cruising overall and sprinting into each turn and working that phase and then come out hard and cruise. I think this will work some intensity, lots of rest and make me practice legal turns since when I swim on my own, I can do all kinds of cheater turns depending on the stroke (ex, sometimes when I swim back stroke, when I push off the wall, I just dolphin kick on my stomach because I prefer no water up my nose and I can go longer on my stomach since i don't need to exhale immediately through nose).
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Seeding runs slowest to fastest, so if you're in a slow* heat then you'll be seeded near the beginning. Once in a while guys will enter NT (no time) to get a slow heat in one event if they are due to swim the next, that extra 5-10 minutes can make a big difference.


*I'd prefer the phrase "not quite as quick" - you're still faster than 99% of the general population ;-)

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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looking forward to Dev's meet report..

meantime 4x400IM scy on 8:30,
7:18,19,20,21 a pattern emerges.. hm.

Sunday I was doing whitewater canoe drills which beat up the upper body a bit. Also tried the canoe roll for the first time in a decade or so, managed it but immediately cramped hard in both thighs..

Two months ago I had been swimming 4x a week for 10-12000yds, this set was 7:03,4,2,2
the swim fitness just vanishes..
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [doug in co] [ In reply to ]
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I'm looking forwrd to it too.

Tonight's masters swim was my best workout in the water in a while. Finished up practice with a set of 12x50 @ :60, every 3rd 50 fast. The idea was to get the times for the fast 50's and add them up to a 200 time, so kinda like a broken 200 but with more recovery than the way I would typically do a broken swim

fast ones were 33, 32, 31, and 30 - total 2:06 (SCM) Not bad for swimming once or twice a week ;-)

Also broke out the ankle band, can't remember the last time I wore one. It was nice because it forces me to lengthen out the stroke at the front to keep the legs at the surface without the buoy, and with the buoy it keeps me from unconsciously cheating.

I was on the bike at lunch today for an hour, with a set of low cadence intervals - 6 x 4mins at rpe 7-8 w/ 4 mins ez spin at 90 rpm - all the hard efforts in aero position.

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
Last edited by: JasoninHalifax: Mar 20, 18 17:26
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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Yesterday:

300 warmup
8x50 drill

all on 1:20 base interval:
2x400 (4:44-4:38)
3x300 (3:27-26-25)
4x200 (2:17-17-16-15)
5x100 (1:07-07-06-05-05)

3700 scy

http://tpks.ws/...URCZLMRVTP6NHJVAP56Q

-----
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [Optimal_Adrian] [ In reply to ]
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Optimal_Adrian wrote:
Yesterday:

300 warmup
8x50 drill

all on 1:20 base interval:
2x400 (4:44-4:38)
3x300 (3:27-26-25)
4x200 (2:17-17-16-15)
5x100 (1:07-07-06-05-05)

3700 scy

http://tpks.ws/...URCZLMRVTP6NHJVAP56Q




You are F.A.S.T

Had a similar workout

800m Warmup
4 x 50m @ 60sec

Main Set

1 x 400m @ 6:00 (5:29)
2 x 300m @ 4:30 ( 4:09 , 4:07)
3 x 200m @ 3:00 ( 2:45 ,2:43 ,2:44 )
4 x 100m @ 1:30 ( 1:18 - 1:21)
3 x 200m @ 3:00 ( 2:46,2:46, 2:47 )
2 x 300m @ 4:30 ( 4:12 ,4:16 )
1 x 400m @ 6:00 ( 5:44 )
4 x 50m @ 1:00 (:36 -:39)

Warm down
400m

Total 5200scm

The last 400 m bummed me out of an otherwise good set. Glenn's back tomorrow šŸ˜±

"Be your best cheerleader , not your worst critic.ā€
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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JasoninHalifax wrote:
I'm looking forwrd to it too.

Tonight's masters swim was my best workout in the water in a while. Finished up practice with a set of 12x50 @ :60, every 3rd 50 fast. The idea was to get the times for the fast 50's and add them up to a 200 time, so kinda like a broken 200 but with more recovery than the way I would typically do a broken swim

fast ones were 33, 32, 31, and 30 - total 2:06 (SCM) Not bad for swimming once or twice a week ;-)

Also broke out the ankle band, can't remember the last time I wore one. It was nice because it forces me to lengthen out the stroke at the front to keep the legs at the surface without the buoy, and with the buoy it keeps me from unconsciously cheating.

I was on the bike at lunch today for an hour, with a set of low cadence intervals - 6 x 4mins at rpe 7-8 w/ 4 mins ez spin at 90 rpm - all the hard efforts in aero position.
Nice work, Jason!
Do you think thatā€™s faster than usual? Or are you just holding onto your standard fitness with all the aerobic work with a modicum of swimming?
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [Trexlera] [ In reply to ]
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It's as fast as I was when I was doing 5-7 swims per week, but I'm a lot more inconsistent (performance wise). Last night we did a similar set (descending 1-3 on :55 rather than easy easy fast on :60) and best I could manage was 32 mid.

I think it's aerobic fitness from the run and the bike, losing a bit of weight has helped, and re-emphasizing technique using the band with a pull buoy. I have a feeling I was cheating (sub-consciously) quite a bit on pull sets.

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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1000 warmup (14:43)
3 x 500 @ :05 rest, snorkel (7:45s)
15 x 100 @ 1:30 (1:22-:24)
5 x 200 @ 3:00 as:
1, 3: buoy and paddles, breathe every 3rd, 2r/2l, left only, 2r/2l by 50
2, 4: paddles only, same breathing pattern
5: no equipment, same breathing pattern
3 x 200 with some kick, backstroke, breaststroke, and free

5600 long course meters

At 5400, I looked up and saw two really fit swimmers stretching out. I recognized one as Olympic gold medalist Kevin Cordes. After I finished, I introduced myself we talked for a few seconds. Nice guy, really tall. I'd have stayed and watched him and the other swimmer, former American record-holder Chuck Katis, work out, but I had to be back home soon. It's not everyday that I meet Olympians!

I never do breathing pattern work, but I changed it up today. When I need to go fast, I always revert back to right-side breathing, so I wanted to work left side for upcoming OWS.
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [140triguy] [ In reply to ]
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Yesterday: 7:00 AM, swam about 1900 yards in some very rough and cold (56 deg) ocean. This was a warm up for an afternoon race...
Drove down to Mission Bay, San Diego for this year's kickoff SwimRun event - a 15k race with 8 runs and 8 swims and done in teams of two (must stay together). Great crowd down there, lots of racers and quite a few I know. We met Lars there - the RD/Producer of the Casco Bay SwimRun, and also a kick-ass swimrunner, himself. Anyway, we started semi-easy, knowing it's gonna be well over an hour and after the first short run, we were mid-pack, but quickly swam through the crowds to move near the front. The second run was really long and we got passed by two all male teams, but we past a sibling coed team who looked pretty young. I said to my partner, they must be very fast swimmers. The second swim was short, but we got confirmation we were leading the Coed division. However, that young team passed us somewhere on a later swim and we diced back and forth through a few more swims and runs. Eventually, with a longer run, we pulled well enough ahead, we weren't too worried about the last short swim as the final run was pretty long, as well. Sure enough, we beat them by three minutes and were the eighth team overall. first coed team. In total, we got in 12,080 meters running and 2,620 meters swimming (maybe a little more as we swam off course a bit on one swim). Done in an hour and 46 minutes.

Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [HalfSpeed] [ In reply to ]
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HS, congrats on your win for the co-ed division.

I was in Salt Lake for spring break; no swimming, but a 40 mile run week and some rock climbing.
Yesterday I ran 5.4 mi and swam 250 yds
today I ran 1.4 miles, swam 150 yards, and then ran another 5 mi

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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Today's workout was fun

10x200m from flags to wall I did the format I'd do in 200 IM and tried to do that part pretty hard (at speed). From flag to flag swam freestyle, one length hard one length easy

So it looks like this...start fly, free from flag to flag, fly from flag to wall to flag, free easy, fly from flag to wall, into a back turn to flag, free to next flag, back to back turn and on back to flags, free to next flag, back to breast turn and pull out, free from flag to flag, breast to breast turn and pull out to flag, free flag to flag, breast to free turn and then freestyle for the last 50.

Hopefully I explained what I was trying to do...basically ingraining the turns so I don't have to think them out during an IM event, but an easier workout than 10x200 IM.

I ended the workout with 50 m sprints in fly and free on 90 seconds departure time (a bit more rest than work).

Dev
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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5000y @ 64:30 (4640 @ 60:00)
100 easy

5100 yards
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [140triguy] [ In reply to ]
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Bring out the mustard and beer cheese cuz my PT has turned me into a pretzel.
I'm pretty sore from the strength and stretching he has me doing so this morning's swim was fairly relaxed.
Still can't flip turn. Gonna ride bike at lunch.

1000s 14:40
400IM kick, reverse order
2x200IM w/fins
3x200p@3:00
100 cool


2500 sc yardages

Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [HalfSpeed] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
Bring out the mustard and beer cheese cuz my PT has turned me into a pretzel.

LOL. (But sorry you still can't flip turn :-( )

3.4 mi run in 30:20, 250 yd swim, 2.2 mi walk

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [HalfSpeed] [ In reply to ]
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Hey guys, I did an interesting 40 min workout.

I warmed up and then this was the main set

400m IM alternating sprinting 25m, easy 25m
200m Fly alternating spring 25m, easy 25m (as easy as it gets).
400m 50 fly/50 free alternating sprinting 25m full gas, recoverying during next 25

Mainly I want to work my turns when I am gassed and dying. I only timed the 200 fly and surprisingly I posted the same time (3:42) that I did in competition last weekend (I was so worried about DQ that I really went conservative as my left leg can get misaligned with my right due to disc)

I just came up with this crazy goal of getting my 200 fly down to 3:05 by 2020. That's when I move to 55-59 and this is the UN National Qual time for that age group....2 years to improve....and 6:32 for 400IM....so 2 years to take 30 seconds and 60 seconds off each. May as well try. The bar is high, but others can do it so it's possible with work and perseverence!
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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I left work early (nothing going on, waiting for source materials for next project) and ran 6.7 miles on trail in my new Hoka EVO Jawz. These shoes are the bomb. Super grippy. Part of my trail is nearly steep enough you need to scramble with your hands. The shoes never slipped. They should be great SwimRun shoes.
This morning's swim:
4x[500s/100 brk] last one was 6:34 (still open turns)
800IM kwf


3200 sc yardages

Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [HalfSpeed] [ In reply to ]
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HalfSpeed wrote:
I left work early (nothing going on, waiting for source materials for next project) and ran 6.7 miles on trail in my new Hoka EVO Jawz. These shoes are the bomb. Super grippy. Part of my trail is nearly steep enough you need to scramble with your hands. The shoes never slipped. They should be great SwimRun shoes.
This morning's swim:
4x[500s/100 brk] last one was 6:34 (still open turns)
800IM kwf


3200 sc yardages

How do you do breast stroke kick with fins. I assume they are stubby/shorty fins?

Dev
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
How do you do breast stroke kick with fins. I assume they are stubby/shorty fins?
Dev[/quote
If I'm simply kicking, I remove the fins for breaststroke. If I am swimming an IM with fins, I use a two-beat dolphin kick per stroke.
BTW: There are fins designed to aid in breaststroke kicking. No idea how good they are or even worthy of using.


Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [HalfSpeed] [ In reply to ]
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4.5 mi run w/ 3.2 mi ish @ 8:57 pace
625 yd swim
4.5 mi run w/ 4 mi @ 8:57 pace (might have tried to go faster but my blood sugar was low and I didn't have any gels)

swim:
150 w/u
50 kick
4 x 100 on 1:30
25 kick c/d

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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My last one of the month, last night (Friday):

1000 (14:45)
1000 snorkel (14:55)
10 x 100 @ 1:30 (1:23 avg)
100-200-300-400-400-300-200-100 @ 1:30 pace
300 c-d

5300m long course

I can't get to a pool today, and tomorrow starts the new month. I'll let Dr TC open that thread.
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Re: March Fish and Aquatic Mammal Thread [140triguy] [ In reply to ]
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140triguy wrote:
My last one of the month, last night (Friday):

1000 (14:45)
1000 snorkel (14:55)
10 x 100 @ 1:30 (1:23 avg)
100-200-300-400-400-300-200-100 @ 1:30 pace
300 c-d

5300m long course

I can't get to a pool today, and tomorrow starts the new month. I'll let Dr TC open that thread.

I think I should go to the local swim shop and get a snorkel. This will likely help isolate the suckiness in my freestyle associated with my bad disc that is further pronounced when I go to breath.

What is your breathing pattern? I assume you breath as often as running or biking when going hard?

I just looked at my log and I am at 294K of swimming for the year. I'll be at 297K after today, so just off 100K per month pace and I think that is pretty solid given all the slow breast and back stroke and kicking I have been doing! My meters per hour have dropped this year focusing on IM!
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