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Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX
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French pro Antony Costes had the 6th fastest bike split (4:14) at Ironman Texas. Was just ahead of Starky out of the water and was 2nd into T2. Had a bad run. Obviously, this may have had to do with pushing too hard on the bike, but may have been due to GI issues, injury, etc. Does anyone know the story of his run?
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [BGNole97] [ In reply to ]
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BGNole97 wrote:
French pro Antony Costes had the 6th fastest bike split (4:14) at Ironman Texas. Was just ahead of Starky out of the water and was 2nd into T2. Had a bad run. Obviously, this may have had to do with pushing too hard on the bike, but may have been due to GI issues, injury, etc. Does anyone know the story of his run?

Not sure in this case, but I'd say it's not clear that it was a "bad" run. Because it seems to be a relatively normal run for Anthony.

He rides a pretty weird position - very praying mantis. That apparently has a "super low CdA" according to another thread. But I'm always skeptical of these positions that are big outliers. I can't think of anyone who has a position like that who runs fast off of it. In fact, I can barely think of any other pro triathlete who has a position like that. That SHOULD BE a red flag if you're an athlete. Being a big outlier when there is a relatively clear norm is always a risk.

Beyond that, it's just not clear that he's figured out how to run a solid marathon in an Ironman. Whether that's preparation, position, pacing, injury, nutrition, or some combination of all of the above, I have no idea. But so far, he's basically shown he's a good swimmer who can ride fast but who seems to consistently struggle on the run.

He seems like he's quite smart - I believe he's actually a doctor (medical school graduate, though given his age wouldn't think he's practiced much). I hope he figures it out. But right now, the "weird" decisions he seems to be making about position/equipment are not anything I'd want to emulate.

"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
the "weird" decisions he seems to be making about position/equipment are not anything I'd want to emulate.

Isn't his position very similar to your former Dimond cohort TJ Tollakson's? He's had a fair amount of success with it.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [BGNole97] [ In reply to ]
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BGNole97 wrote:
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the "weird" decisions he seems to be making about position/equipment are not anything I'd want to emulate.


Isn't his position very similar to your former Dimond cohort TJ Tollakson's? He's had a fair amount of success with it.

Jesse Thomas as well I believe?
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
the "weird" decisions he seems to be making about position/equipment ...


position = weird, yes. But equipment? I guess, if weird = not being used by other pros. But, I'd use a different term, as "weird" implies unnatural. If "equipment" is specifically targeting the MORF bar, I'm not convinced the MORF bars are "weird" or unnatural, but rather pretty logical, possibly more natural than the current status quo, and I really hope to see them gain traction.

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Last edited by: milesthedog: Apr 24, 17 12:56
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [milesthedog] [ In reply to ]
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Any pictures?
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [ErickBar] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [ErickBar] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Jace] [ In reply to ]
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But, but, but......a trispoke on the front?!?!?! What's he thinking?????/pink

Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [BGNole97] [ In reply to ]
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I want to see how he has the front end set up. The bottle looks custom fit into the front.
Last edited by: BMANX: Apr 24, 17 13:59
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [BMANX] [ In reply to ]
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BMANX wrote:
I want to see how he has the front end set up. The bottle looks custom fit into the front.



Idk, does the taped on sides count as a fairing??


https://www.instagram.com/...v/?taken-by=morftech

Alex Arman

Strava
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Jace] [ In reply to ]
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Regardless of the position itself he has almost every aero base covered. Empires included, foot position, single arc ring, great wheel combo, great frame. Very very clean setup considering he's in an ironman.

What do we reckon he's putting out wattage wise? I'm going to stab at *only* 250.

Which for that time would be ace, but compared to Starkys ?320w is quite underpowered!
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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From my own testing, I can safely say that with the right morphology, that position can be *deadly* fast. Like so crazy fast you'd never *want* to ride any other way. It can also be pretty comfortable once you get the weight distribution right.

I have ridden in that position on a closed course early in the morning a few times with success. I've also ridden in training where I nearly found myself in a gutter. Under normal circumstances I would not ride that position with any people, cars, dogs, or moving air around me. The Morf bar may make transitioning to a stable position faster than a normal base bar, so perhaps it can solve the stability problem.

I definitely wouldn't try to run afterward though, even if I had the stones to ride the position in a tri.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [chicanery] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not sure I'm getting why this position would impact running so much?
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [doublea334] [ In reply to ]
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You mean cause of that? ;-) aaahhhmmm. Maybe.
"Fairings are prohibited. Any device added or blended into the structure that may decrease, or that has the effect of decreasing, resistance to air penetration, or that may artificially accelerate propulsion, such as a protective screen, fuselage form fairing or the like, is prohibited; (DSQ)"

I'm using the aero30 also and trying to figure out how to close the gap within the rules (use to put levers or similar inside), had it done before cockpit adjustment but now it's more difficult.

-shoki
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [shoki] [ In reply to ]
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Are fairings allowed if they serve a purpose? Say a gel holder on the front?
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [chicanery] [ In reply to ]
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chicanery wrote:
From my own testing, I can safely say that with the right morphology, that position can be *deadly* fast. Like so crazy fast you'd never *want* to ride any other way. It can also be pretty comfortable once you get the weight distribution right.

I have ridden in that position on a closed course early in the morning a few times with success. I've also ridden in training where I nearly found myself in a gutter. Under normal circumstances I would not ride that position with any people, cars, dogs, or moving air around me. The Morf bar may make transitioning to a stable position faster than a normal base bar, so perhaps it can solve the stability problem.

I definitely wouldn't try to run afterward though, even if I had the stones to ride the position in a tri.

From riding an early version of the MORF, I can tell you it's a total game-changer in how one transitions from aero to basebar. I was riding it in a mantis position as well.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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Rappstar wrote:

He rides a pretty weird position - very praying mantis. That apparently has a "super low CdA" according to another thread. But I'm always skeptical of these positions that are big outliers. I can't think of anyone who has a position like that who runs fast off of it. In fact, I can barely think of any other pro triathlete who has a position like that. That SHOULD BE a red flag if you're an athlete. Being a big outlier when there is a relatively clear norm is always a risk.

TJ Tollakson? Jesse Thomas? Floyd Landis? Also, if you go over to http://www.timetriallingforum.co.uk/ you'll see a lot of fast guys are running as close to a mantis position as the UCI will allow.

I think a lot of people don't try or test a mantis position because the equipment isn't readily available to do so. You have to hack your way to a mantis position if you have any sort of integrated modern superbike (P5, Speed Concept, Plasma, etc) or a cockpit where the extensions aren't clip-ons. Even when you do hack your way to a mantis position via flipping some ski bends, you don't get a lot of choice for reach or elevation which makes it difficult to tune the position. For myself, personally, a mantis position would be impossible if it weren't for the plug-in extension on my Speed Concept because my forearms are too long to use ski bends flipped on a normal base bar.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Tom_Hughes] [ In reply to ]
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Tom_Hughes wrote:
I'm not sure I'm getting why this position would impact running so much?
Me neither. Then again when I read the subject line of the OP I thought MORF bars where a new form of IM nutrition.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Tom_Hughes] [ In reply to ]
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Tom_Hughes wrote:
Regardless of the position itself he has almost every aero base covered. Empires included, foot position, single arc ring, great wheel combo, great frame. Very very clean setup considering he's in an ironman.

What do we reckon he's putting out wattage wise? I'm going to stab at *only* 250.

Which for that time would be ace, but compared to Starkys ?320w is quite underpowered!

He has an ARC ring, trying to get one myself but backordered for weeks and weeks.


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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [shoki] [ In reply to ]
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shoki wrote:
You mean cause of that? ;-) aaahhhmmm. Maybe.
"Fairings are prohibited. Any device added or blended into the structure that may decrease, or that has the effect of decreasing, resistance to air penetration, or that may artificially accelerate propulsion, such as a protective screen, fuselage form fairing or the like, is prohibited; (DSQ)"

I'm using the aero30 also and trying to figure out how to close the gap within the rules (use to put levers or similar inside), had it done before cockpit adjustment but now it's more difficult.

We made sure to check with the chief judge on this prior to the race. They cleared it ahead of time. The bottle is an Aero30.

Thanks,
Frank

http://www.morf-tech.com
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [BGNole97] [ In reply to ]
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Just wanted to give a big shout out to Antony, he did a spectacular job on the bike leg. He had some nutrition issues on the run unfortunately. He has been an absolute pleasure to work with, and he and Mathilde are some of the nicest people you would run across. I think we will see great things from him, and there is more efficiency to come!!!

Thanks,
Frank

http://www.morf-tech.com
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Thomas Gerlach] [ In reply to ]
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As with all the non-round rings I still doubt the evidence or lack of it shall we say.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [Tom_Hughes] [ In reply to ]
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Tom_Hughes wrote:
What do we reckon he's putting out wattage wise? I'm going to stab at *only* 250.

Maybe less believe it or not. Maybe closer to 230w.
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Re: Pro Antony Costes rides 4:14 using MORF bars at IMTX [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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GreenPlease wrote:
Rappstar wrote:

He rides a pretty weird position - very praying mantis. That apparently has a "super low CdA" according to another thread. But I'm always skeptical of these positions that are big outliers. I can't think of anyone who has a position like that who runs fast off of it. In fact, I can barely think of any other pro triathlete who has a position like that. That SHOULD BE a red flag if you're an athlete. Being a big outlier when there is a relatively clear norm is always a risk.


TJ Tollakson? Jesse Thomas? Floyd Landis? Also, if you go over to http://www.timetriallingforum.co.uk/ you'll see a lot of fast guys are running as close to a mantis position as the UCI will allow.

I think a lot of people don't try or test a mantis position because the equipment isn't readily available to do so. You have to hack your way to a mantis position if you have any sort of integrated modern superbike (P5, Speed Concept, Plasma, etc) or a cockpit where the extensions aren't clip-ons. Even when you do hack your way to a mantis position via flipping some ski bends, you don't get a lot of choice for reach or elevation which makes it difficult to tune the position. For myself, personally, a mantis position would be impossible if it weren't for the plug-in extension on my Speed Concept because my forearms are too long to use ski bends flipped on a normal base bar.

How do you feel on the run - posture and pace-wise - after a few hours in the mantis position?
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