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Packs at World's 70.3
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From where I sat in the race----
I saw 3 good packs in the last 20 miles of ride.
Obviously cheating and being an ass I told them about it, but was ignored.
Cool thing was, I also saw a course marshal close by handing out a fair number of penalties
Made me happy.

Team Zoot So Cal
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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it didn't seem too bad (MOP M30-34 here). a few cheaters and no one in the penalty tent but it was pretty staggered, at least at that point in the race.
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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I started in a middle wave.
Three good packs of 20. I have heard and seen worse. Finished bike around noon.

Team Zoot So Cal
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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I had the (dis)pleasure of starting I the last wave. I only saw 2, maybe 3 packs at most - far less than I have seen at other WCs. I saw people at each of the penalty tents and my friends both saw people in front of them getting cards. Overall, I think it was successful in breaking up the packs by having the climb early and spacing the waves well. Kudos for the best I have seen thus far.
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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I too saw the packs in the last 20 miles (M 55-59) and was glad when a saw a number of them in the penalty tent. I thought they did a really good job breaking people up on what could have been a very dense bike course.

David
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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jkhayc wrote:
it didn't seem too bad (MOP M30-34 here). a few cheaters and no one in the penalty tent but it was pretty staggered, at least at that point in the race.

If you are self-identifying as "MOP", I'm never getting in a pool, throwing a leg over a bike, or lacing up a pair of shoes ever again.

/kj

http://kjmcawesome.tumblr.com/
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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You are way too late. This thread started more than a month before the race was even held.

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slowtwitch_Forums_C1/Triathlon_Forum_F1/Terrible_sportsmanship_at_the_2017_70.3_Worlds_in_Chattanooga_--_so_much_DRAFTING_P6381732/?search_string=drafting%20at%2070%203%20wc%20chattanooga#p6381732
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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I think it was as good as they were going to get, was still way better then Kona.

Edit: I would honestly prefer to go to none "World Championship" races as you can still "race your own race" at those, but the experience makes it worth it at the "World Championships."

2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz
Last edited by: BBLOEHR: Sep 11, 17 14:29
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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Ironman is draft legal (in reality). Has been for many years.
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [kjmcawesome] [ In reply to ]
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kjmcawesome wrote:
jkhayc wrote:
it didn't seem too bad (MOP M30-34 here). a few cheaters and no one in the penalty tent but it was pretty staggered, at least at that point in the race.


If you are self-identifying as "MOP", I'm never getting in a pool, throwing a leg over a bike, or lacing up a pair of shoes ever again.

He pushed 180 watts yesterday. I would characterize that as squarely in the middle of the pack.
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [NordicSkier] [ In reply to ]
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NordicSkier wrote:
Ironman is draft legal (in reality). Has been for many years.

Yep, since the beginning

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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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i was in the first agree group mop and i saw one pack, but in general the officiating was great. i saw the marshals a lout and i saw folks in the penalty tent.

2018 Races: IM Santa Rosa, Vineman Monte Rio, Lake Tahoe 70.3
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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I was "MOP" in M35-39 (as in I finished right in the middle of the AG at this race).

From my perspective I saw three draft packs over the last 20 miles. A good 20-30 people in each one all blow past me. It took actual effort on my part to fall off the back of those the draft was THAT strong. I wasn't moving slow either averaging over 23mph over the last 28 miles (after the descent) and those guys had to have been hauling over 30. Bunch of cheaters. Ugh.

I do have to pose one large gripe though with the Ironman motos. They had a media guy on Nassar the whole race, and when he passed my me around mile 18 or so his moto got IN MY WAY to get video on Nassar. Literally this moto was rolling along right next to the guy and holding up faster bike traffic, and eventually was holding up slower bike traffic as the road started climbing. I passed this "peloton" that the moto forced on us and when it passed again I told the guy he was straight up interfering with the race. He gave me some snotty comment about it being my job to tell him to get out of the way. Fuck that guy. He was driving dangerously and impeding the race. I plan to complain to Ironman about this one.
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [david] [ In reply to ]
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On a different topic, I found it frustrating sitting behind cars and trucks on the long downhill. I am a good descender and I had a mile or so of just sitting and having many catch up.
A few crossed the double yellow to go around the trucks. I think the roads in Georgia should have been closed.

Team Zoot So Cal
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [BBLOEHR] [ In reply to ]
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Brendan, I'm not as fast as you but I found the regrouping of the draft packs for the last 25 miles to be fairly tough. I only saw one rider in the penalty tents for the entire time. This is despite seeing several riders sucking wheels for miles. I passed them but it cost me a lot to stay in front. They should have sent us up lookout on the way back. That would have been amazing! If they are going to make us swim upstream and climb 1000 feet on the run, then give us 6000+ climbing on the bike.
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [sperris] [ In reply to ]
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sperris wrote:
Brendan, I'm not as fast as you but I found the regrouping of the draft packs for the last 25 miles to be fairly tough. I only saw one rider in the penalty tents for the entire time. This is despite seeing several riders sucking wheels for miles. I passed them but it cost me a lot to stay in front. They should have sent us up lookout on the way back. That would have been amazing! If they are going to make us swim upstream and climb 1000 feet on the run, then give us 6000+ climbing on the bike.


Totally, yes I did feel that, I tried to drop a group of 10-15 guys multiple times but ended up spending a good bit of time leading them out along with Tyler Pate (not sure what his name is on here but i know he is here on ST). I could drop the group for a mile or so but they would bring me back. I would then sit behind Tyler at what seemed like a legal distance back but then someone would just pass me and move in front of me forcing me to either fall back more or move back up to the front to stay legal. But once again I still think it was better then Kona. It also might have been worse behind me, IDK.

2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [g_lev] [ In reply to ]
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g_lev wrote:
I was "MOP" in M35-39 (as in I finished right in the middle of the AG at this race).

From my perspective I saw three draft packs over the last 20 miles. A good 20-30 people in each one all blow past me. It took actual effort on my part to fall off the back of those the draft was THAT strong. I wasn't moving slow either averaging over 23mph over the last 28 miles (after the descent) and those guys had to have been hauling over 30. Bunch of cheaters. Ugh.

I do have to pose one large gripe though with the Ironman motos. They had a media guy on Nassar the whole race, and when he passed my me around mile 18 or so his moto got IN MY WAY to get video on Nassar. Literally this moto was rolling along right next to the guy and holding up faster bike traffic, and eventually was holding up slower bike traffic as the road started climbing. I passed this "peloton" that the moto forced on us and when it passed again I told the guy he was straight up interfering with the race. He gave me some snotty comment about it being my job to tell him to get out of the way. Fuck that guy. He was driving dangerously and impeding the race. I plan to complain to Ironman about this one.

I knew this would be on here! I will also be complaining. I'm in your age group and we must have been riding by each other. Started right about mile 18-20 for me as well. Nassar and his camera crew were unacceptable. First of all, his highness does not pull to the right. If you want to go around him, you must go into traffic and try to dodge his camera moto, who is swerving at other cyclist to miss the traffic coming at him. A Georgia State trooper actually yelled at him for this. I was able to sprint around and drop him a few times. I'd be hammering to pull away (same as above, those of us trying to get away were just leading him out), and then about a mile down the road I'd hear his disc a comin' with moto and pack of guys trying to get around them. We'd fall back, he'd block and bunch us up. A marshal gave out penalties to a few guys but it wasn't their fault. I argued for a guy in front of me that was penalized and told the marshal what was going on. When he asked who it was I said "that Prince Nassar guy and his crew (he had a guy on his team always riding about 15-20 yards behind, I'm assuming security)", marshal didn't respond and just rode away. I really am glad he's putting so much money into our sport. I was actually excited to be riding with him at first. I know some guys ride like that and don't even realize it, but the actions of his camera moto were completely unsafe. We are very lucky none of us were seriously injured or worse by his reckless driving. I have to commend the other guys who had to deal with this for 30+ miles. I saw some great bike handling skills and sportsmanship as we dealt with the situation. Ironman should never allow that to happen again. Had something bad happened, they would have had a lawsuit on their hands with about 20 witnesses.

On a positive note- Fantastic experience! Great course, amazing crowd support, awesome town. Had a blast!
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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I think they did a relatively good job with giving out penalties this year. On three separate occasions I was passed by a course marshal going the opposite way, but every time I waved and pointed to the draft pack that was nearby and they turned around to bust them.

Looking at the strava leader board for the world's course you can guess who drafted and who didn't based on the power profile. I weigh 168lbs then held ~270 watts and that was enough for a 2:30, but I'm seeing these guys going pro times between 2:15-2:20 on <240 watts then having killer runs. A friend of mine who had the fastest amateur bike split at a recent 70.3 held the same power he did then go just under 2:25 Sunday.

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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [BBLOEHR] [ In reply to ]
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I didn't see Prince Nasser or his entourage, so I can't speak of that. However, I do think all in all it was about as good as it could've gotten given everyone's abilities (from where I sat in the race). I didn't think it was too bad, as I saw way worse at an earlier 70.3 event I did this year (Gulf Coast). Brendan and I did connect on that initial climb. I believe we are both of similar abilities on the bike (265 FTP @ 132#). From there we both played fair trying to separate from a pack that formed behind us. I burned some matches trying to get some space on a few occasions, but it wasn't happening. We did have some Marshalls pass us occasion, but again I want to think those that were right there were all legal. I'd say we were probably towards the front of the M35-39 AG, so I can't speak of what was going on behind us. Also, I'd like to add that Brendan can descend like Froome.

J. Tyler Pate
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [JTPATE] [ In reply to ]
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Yea agreed it was as good as it was going to get. I still can't believe it did not put more time into people on that descent though :-(

2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [JTPATE] [ In reply to ]
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JTPATE wrote:
I didn't see Prince Nasser or his entourage, so I can't speak of that. However, I do think all in all it was about as good as it could've gotten given everyone's abilities (from where I sat in the race). I didn't think it was too bad, as I saw way worse at an earlier 70.3 event I did this year (Gulf Coast). Brendan and I did connect on that initial climb. I believe we are both of similar abilities on the bike (265 FTP @ 132#). From there we both played fair trying to separate from a pack that formed behind us. I burned some matches trying to get some space on a few occasions, but it wasn't happening. We did have some Marshalls pass us occasion, but again I want to think those that were right there were all legal. I'd say we were probably towards the front of the M35-39 AG, so I can't speak of what was going on behind us. Also, I'd like to add that Brendan can descend like Froome.

haha, i was really enjoying that athletes were referring to those two mild declines as ''descents.'' ;)
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [Karl] [ In reply to ]
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Agreed, I think having the course open to traffic really caused some of the packs to form as racers couldn't get around the cautious drivers. The marshals did a good job of breaking them up with some warnings before handing out penalties to those that didn't heed the warnings.

For being in the last wave to start, I thought the bike course wasn't too congested on any part of it. I wonder if having the men and women on separate days helped with the flow on the bike course...still the same number of racers each day but the range of speeds wasn't as broad?

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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [More Cowbell] [ In reply to ]
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More Cowbell wrote:
I thought the bike course wasn't too congested on any part of it. I wonder if having the men and women on separate days helped with the flow on the bike course...still the same number of racers each day but the range of speeds wasn't as broad?

Ironman has listed about 1,431 Female finishers and 2,380 Male finishers. I think the registered numbers were around 1,700 and 2,800 (4,500 total).

The bike course was not congested and I didn't see much drafting at the back of the race (us starting around 9:30).

Proud Member of Chris McDonald's 2018 Big Sexy Race Team "That which doesn't kill me, will only make me stronger"
Blog-Twitter-Instagram-Race Reports - 2018 Races: IM Florida 70.3, IM Raleigh 70.3, IM 70.3 World Championships - South Africa, IM North Carolina 70.3
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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lol, i think its fair to call them non technical descents ha

2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz
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Re: Packs at World's 70.3 [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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jkhayc wrote:

haha, i was really enjoying that athletes were referring to those two mild declines as ''descents.'' ;)

I call anything where I honestly spin out my 53x11 for more than a few seconds a real "descent". The one around mile 22 qualified, for sure, but I wouldn't call it in any way technical. It was an "easy" descent.

That said it ended up being rather difficult for me because some ass clown in a pickup truck got on the road ahead of me and was holding me to only 35-40mph going down. I have no idea how he was allowed onto the road but he absolutely got in my way. I made the decision to just stay behind him rather than cross the double yellow to pass him. A few people made the opposite choice and I saw one guy miss an oncoming car by mere inches going around the pickup. I decided the pickup truck holding me back was keeping me OUT of Price Nassar's peloton so letting him get a mile up the road ahead of me was a good thing for me. (Up to that point I was battling with his peloton and moto escort)
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