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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [sentania] [ In reply to ]
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All righty then...

I used 600-610 as a pad stack range since you mentioned going a little lower, and 475-485 for pad reach based on your Adamo-adjusted figure and your note about feeling a tad stretched. Ended up with three options for consideration:

1) Small + 100/10. Definitely on the low side for bar stack, requiring almost the full 50mm spacer stack for the extensions to get your pads in position. Upside: lots and lots of room to go lower on pads. Still, probably not the best choice if you spend lots of climbing time out of the saddle or on the bullhorns for "position fatigue" near the end of long course races.

2) Medium + 100/10. Now you're on the low end of the extension stack, resulting in a nice clean look. Can go as low as 590 on the pads. Bar is a little higher but the reach is getting out there, so the bullhorn position notes above apply again. Nominal pad position is spot-on, meaning you've got lots of fore-aft trim to play with.

3) Small + 100/45. Interesting idea. Highest bar stack of the three by a small margin, and likewise the shortest (relative) bar reach by a bit. At first glance the nominal pad reach seems short, but that's based on a centered mounting position - which leaves upwards of 25mm fore & aft play simply by changing which set of mount holes you use...never mind the ability to move the clamp itself along the extension. Near the bottom of the extension stack range again so another clean look, and room to go as low as 595 at the pads. The sizing chart shows a max saddle height of 730 with the shorter post (which is stock on this size frame), but that's based on a low-profile saddle @ ~40mm rails-to-top...your Adamo would more than cover the difference.

Wonder if your bar reach needs might be the deciding factor? If you measure/estimate it from BB to where the brake levers mount that's the figure to compare to the bar reach figures for each of the above: 670, 688 and 660 respectively.

Carl Matson
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [Carl] [ In reply to ]
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Hmmm google let me down on finding the reach for my visiontech basebars - but my pad to extension tip is roughly 390 (assuming my ST profile is correct!). Subtract 25 for that since my pads are setback from the basebar - we're @ 365.

I'd guess that the brake levers are roughly at the midway point of my extensions so 180 - putting me @ 680 as a from the hip guess.

Looks like all the options fall within a reasonable range of my off the hip guess.

The bar stack I'm using on my stack/reach spreadsheet is 35mm so that would put my bar stack @ 575


So to restate what you said to be sure I understand-

Option 1 offers the lowest possible pad stack, but to get the same stack that I'm at, I'm at the top of the mountain aerobar wise, but VERY low on the horns.

Option 2 can try a little lower than my current position, but not by a ton. Fore-aft on the pads is great, bar stack is low. Clean pad stack look.

Option 3 can hit current pad stack, and go a bit lower, but again not as much. Pad reach is doable, but will take some sliding around (same with option 1) - bar stack is the highest.


So really based on my fit coordinates - it sounds like a M is the safest bet to achieve my current position - but a small allows me to achieve my current position (with a clean look @ 100/45), but allows a lot of long term flexibility with that stem or the 100/10 stem - with the medium I'm sort of stuck with my current position - particulary in the pad reach department (in terms of being relative to everything).


Thanks for the time.

one last question - and I know it is a bit on the odd side. Any idea on the routability of a wired SRM cable within the frame - or would I need to be a goober and run it outside?

I ask because tomorrow I will likely walk out of my LBS with a P3 or a Speed concept - and the deciding factor really comes down to the PM stuff - I just can't swing the full on Wireless upgrade and still pull off the SC (at least not if I want to be married tomorrow night) - but I could swing the conversion from an [wired] Octalink SRM to a [wiared] DA SRM...


Team RACC | scottbowe.com

"no matt...your FTP is never high enough, there is always room for improvement." - jonnyo
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [sentania] [ In reply to ]
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You can disregard the questions about the SRM, just spoke with them in Colorado - and was told that you pretty much need to go with a wireless one to work.

Time to reopen the quarq or powertap discussions.

Still curious about any other feedback you have on my regurgitations of your thoughts.


Team RACC | scottbowe.com

"no matt...your FTP is never high enough, there is always room for improvement." - jonnyo
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Kurt Kinetic Problems? [ In reply to ]
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Anyone else notice that the SC frame won't fit in the Kurt Kinetic Road machine? On mine the NDS skewer cup does not fit in the little cavity - it presses up against the "fairing" that surrounds the skewer.

Gonna call Kurt today to try and find a solution.


Team RACC | scottbowe.com

"no matt...your FTP is never high enough, there is always room for improvement." - jonnyo
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Re: Kurt Kinetic Problems? [sentania] [ In reply to ]
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Anyone else notice that the SC frame won't fit in the Kurt Kinetic Road machine? On mine the NDS skewer cup does not fit in the little cavity - it presses up against the "fairing" that surrounds the skewer.

Gonna call Kurt today to try and find a solution.
_________________________

Sentania,

You have a Speed Concept, you don't need to train anymore. It's THAT fast.

Certainly you don't have to suffer on a trainer. You can even start swimming slower in races.
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [sentania] [ In reply to ]
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Sentania,

How tall are you and what is your inseam length?

I'm asking because I can give you (and everyone) my five cents worth of unsolicited opinion on what size to get. Of course, I will keep my opinions to myself if you don't care about them. I've owned my SC for almost a month now and ridden it for over 600 miles on varied terrain. All this time I have made multiple observations on the bike and made all possible adjustments (except for stem changes) that perhaps no one in ST has done.

Let me know...

P.

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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [paxfobiscum] [ In reply to ]
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What do you think of the bike so far?
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [paxfobiscum] [ In reply to ]
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I actually acted on Carl's advice above about sizing and went with a small. I'm able to hit my fit coordinates perfectly (see next paragrah)- i might need to add a spacer or two to the pads as I'm a touch lower then my current/old ride.

Right now it has the stock stem on it, but my LBS is getting me a 100/45 stem and swapping it - hopefully by next week - as the 60/45 stem puts the base bars a little tight and puts me at the maximum length for the extensions.

For the record I'm 5 ft. 10in, I'm not sure my exact inseam for some reason 83 cm from floor to crotch rings a bell.

The fit measurements posted just a couple posts earlier were 100% achievable on a Small w/ 60/45 stem; but puts the basebar reach to close for me; Small w/ 100/45 will be perfect and give me room to try a lot of different things.

I'd like to thank carl for the great fit advice, and my LBS Emery's for doing a great job of getting me on the bike and happy. Brent was a huge help - I was really struggling to get the bike set right in the store (I provisioned a little corner of their store to set the SC up and hop back and forth between my current bike and it and compare them) - and I called for help, and he took a whole 2 seconds to diagnose that I was misjudging the bottom bracket position for the reference point. A laser level and piece of tape later and everything panned out perfectly.


As a side note - I was "surprised" to see the stock cranks @ 170 - although that probably makes sense for that frame size. Given all the talk of crank length recently, I'm gonna give them a shot before I run out and buy a replacement 172.5.


Team RACC | scottbowe.com

"no matt...your FTP is never high enough, there is always room for improvement." - jonnyo
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Re: Kurt Kinetic Problems? [c.dan.jog] [ In reply to ]
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I just got off the phone with Kurt a few minutes ago.

They were not surprised in the slightest about the problem.

They said that they have a smaller OD cone cup that should solve the problem.

http://www.kurtkinetic.com/...-cone-p-91-l-en.html

I was further tickled pink by their refusal to let me buy the parts for the two Road machienes I own, and "insistance" that they will send them out to me at no charge.


I love those trainers.


Team RACC | scottbowe.com

"no matt...your FTP is never high enough, there is always room for improvement." - jonnyo
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Saris Thelma issues [ In reply to ]
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So another problem related to the Speed Concept.

I'm not sure if it's due to frame size (Small) or the frame in general, but yesterday I noticed that I was unable to put the speed concept on my Saris Thelma bike rack withou the downtube coming into a fairly solid contact with the front wheel support.

I know they make a smaller front wheel support for 650c wheels, and the like.

My plan is to investigate that route - and failing that I'm considering just taking a file to the Thelma and removing a couple cm of plastic to make room.


Anybody have any other thoughts on this combo?


Team RACC | scottbowe.com

"no matt...your FTP is never high enough, there is always room for improvement." - jonnyo
Last edited by: sentania: Jul 9, 10 6:44
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [bartturner] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
What do you think of the bike so far?

I'll respond to Sentania first and then get back to you....

p.

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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [sentania] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
I actually acted on Carl's advice above about sizing and went with a small. I'm able to hit my fit coordinates perfectly (see next paragrah)- i might need to add a spacer or two to the pads as I'm a touch lower then my current/old ride.

Right now it has the stock stem on it, but my LBS is getting me a 100/45 stem and swapping it - hopefully by next week - as the 60/45 stem puts the base bars a little tight and puts me at the maximum length for the extensions.

For the record I'm 5 ft. 10in, I'm not sure my exact inseam for some reason 83 cm from floor to crotch rings a bell.

The fit measurements posted just a couple posts earlier were 100% achievable on a Small w/ 60/45 stem; but puts the basebar reach to close for me; Small w/ 100/45 will be perfect and give me room to try a lot of different things.

As a side note - I was "surprised" to see the stock cranks @ 170 - although that probably makes sense for that frame size. Given all the talk of crank length recently, I'm gonna give them a shot before I run out and buy a replacement 172.5.



Hi Sentania,

The SMALL frame will be perfect for you - ESPECIALLY after you change the stock stem to a 100/45. Although a Medium frame will be good as well, the components of the frame are so adjustable that it may simply boil down to aesthetics. A small frame would show more seatpost and one additional spacer (ala Chris Lieto) while a medium frame will look more aero with one less spacer. Of course a medium frame will have a longer wheelbase but will you really notice a 1.5 cm longer length in a bike. I did some comparisons based on what you stated in earlier posts and check out both our stats:

Sentania
Saddle height: 740
(APS) Arm Pad Stack: 610 (could lower)
(BBS) Base Bar Stack: 580
(APR) Arm Pad Reach: ~495 (On Adamo ~520)
(BBR) Base Bar Reach ??

Paxfobiscum
Saddle height: 750
(APS) Arm Pad Stack: 610
(BBS) Base Bar Stack: 580
(APR) Arm Pad Reach: 480
(BBR) Base Bar Reach: 650

I am 5 feet 9.5 inches but my inseam is freakish long at 85 cm so my saddle height (BB to top of saddle) is higher than yours by at least a centimeter. After riding this thing for more than 600 miles I ordered the longer 100/45 stem to replace the stock 60/45 stem. The stock stem was actually fine but I like riding on the nose of my saddle (so the boys can hang out) and when doing so I feel I want to be a little more stretched forward. So I believe a new 100/45 stem will do the trick. I also removed just one spacer from the spacer stack and I really like the look looked of stacked spacers in the Speed Concept. Notice a lot of Tour de France pro riders have high spacer stacks too because their base bar sits so low. My base bar sits low which is the way I like it.

Once again the Medium would be fine for you but I always believe that between two frame sizes, one should err on the lower side. If you look at Lance and Lieto's SC frames they look quite small on them with a lot of seatpost and stems sticking out. By the way, I immediately replaced that 170mm crank for my 175mm. Finally, you won't regret getting the SC over the P3. I won't even discuss why. Just trust me.

P.

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Last edited by: paxfobiscum: Jul 9, 10 7:59
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [sentania] [ In reply to ]
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Sorry not to get back to you before you went and got the bike anyway Smile. I was in-transit from our assembly facility in Germany where they were putting together their first P1 orders. Your understanding of the options was right on and from pax's comments it sounds like you made the right call on sizing. Side note: at a similar height (5' 9.5") I find myself happiest on the Medium w/100x45 and no spacers. Something to do with a saddle height of 760 and pad stack of 620-625...the former may be too high but the latter is right on.

Glad to hear Brent was good to you. Their Lisbon Ave store is close to where I grew up (4blks west of Washington Park) and I've been in there a time or three.

I'm not familiar with SRM setup - wired or otherwise - so I'll certainly not go against whatever they've told you. My quick glance thru their users manual didn't turn up any obvious showstoppers to a possible internal solution...but there was also no info on cable lengths and that probably would've been the biggest obstacle you'd face in making any mods to covers or using existing openings to run it.

As far as the Thelma incompatibilty goes, I wonder how many other TT/tri bikes with tight front ends (i.e. smaller gaps from wheel to DT) also run into this...? Might be worth putting up a general question on the forum rather than in here?

Carl Matson
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [Carl] [ In reply to ]
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Hi All,

I am not sure if this question has been asked yet but what I was curious about is if anyone has had trouble getting their aero bars to stay put? The bars on my bike seem to keep moving up and down even when they have been seemingly secured extremly well by tightening the screws. It just seems that every time I am out riding I will have one of the bars actually move positions. My current front-end set up includes one spacer, could this be a potential cause to why the bars are not staying put?

http://www.turbeaucurbeau.com
turbeaucurbeau@gmail.com
The Cycling Formula - QT2 Systems - Fast : Splits
USAT Level 1 Coach
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [TurboCurbo] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
Hi All,

I am not sure if this question has been asked yet but what I was curious about is if anyone has had trouble getting their aero bars to stay put? The bars on my bike seem to keep moving up and down even when they have been seemingly secured extremly well by tightening the screws. It just seems that every time I am out riding I will have one of the bars actually move positions. My current front-end set up includes one spacer, could this be a potential cause to why the bars are not staying put?

Might be a good ideal to use a Torque wrench but the Tacx Carbon Assembly Compound is your friend. Put some on mine and it hasn't budge in over 600 miles.

http://www.speedgoat.com/...=C195&Prod=14513

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...................._.-\ <,_.........</\_
.....~_.o^,....(...)./.(...)......._/\...
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [paxfobiscum] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the help! I'll be putting those to use ASAP.

http://www.turbeaucurbeau.com
turbeaucurbeau@gmail.com
The Cycling Formula - QT2 Systems - Fast : Splits
USAT Level 1 Coach
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [TurboCurbo] [ In reply to ]
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x2 on pax's answers, in the same order. With a twist...

When going after max torque on the extension stack clamps, only put a wrench in the topside bolt heads to be the anti-rotation anchor and put your torque wrench into the bottom "head" (it's actually a brake nut) which is larger @5mm vs 4mm on top* and has a much deeper broach. 14Nm is A Lot, and even with wrenches (and bolt heads) in good condition you're less likely to round out the combination of the larger wrench head & deeper broach.

* for the highest spacer stacks the required bolt is actually not only longer but larger (M6) as well, and has a 5mm hex head broach. Comment regarding which side to apply the torque wrench still applies.

Carl Matson
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [wsrobert] [ In reply to ]
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Race ready.... My second race on an SC is Sunday, but it will be this particular bike's first time out... Garmin Edge 500 computer mounted between bars on a Profile Design mount, Bontrager Speed Bottle is most likely NOT going to make the cut......

(Not my lawn btw......)


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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [Weaver] [ In reply to ]
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lookin mean! i ended up putting some industrial velcro on the basebar between the ends of the aerobars and mounted my garmin there. so far so good.

is that a salt stick dispenser i see? good choice

curious. have you explored other aero water bottles with the SC? im never racing with the bont because its not easy enough to get out of the cage from the seat tube. im keen to try the arundel chrono though.

i emailed bontrager about the speed bottle removal issue and William Rand (Customer service i think?) said that this is the only model they plan on offering. he also said that he had never heard of this issue...

Toro Performance
Last edited by: jbird2131: Jul 9, 10 16:56
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [Weaver] [ In reply to ]
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Awesome bike, maybe one day.....

The only thing I would change is to lower your bonty bottle to eliminate the gap. I would think it may help the aero a little if the bottom of the bottle is essentially touching the BB/downtube area. Sweet bike though!


Fraser Bicycle | First Endurance

Check out my blog here | Twitter:@tmalis3
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [Weaver] [ In reply to ]
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That's sweet. Which model is it?

------------------------------------------------------------
Any run that doesn't include pooping in someone's front yard is a win.
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [jbird2131] [ In reply to ]
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if you open the valve a bit on the bottle it is way easier to remove. If it is closed, the bottle will not release.

Owner of a few Speed Concepts since 2011.
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [jbird2131] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
i ended up putting some industrial velcro on the basebar between the ends of the aerobars and mounted my garmin there. so far so good.
But then you cover up the nifty stem cover!


Yes, saltstick....the only way to fly.


Quote:
have you explored other aero water bottles with the SC?
Not yet. I might but I do like the simplicity of a regular old water bottle mounted on the downtube........baby steps for me I guess.

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he also said that he had never heard of this issue...
Ha....nice try.....On today's ride the bottle exploded like a geyser when I tried to wrestle it out of the cage........not gonna work in a race.... (Yes, I know how to use it....squeeze it near the clamp, etc.)
Last edited by: Weaver: Jul 9, 10 17:40
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [CCF] [ In reply to ]
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It's a 9.9 P1 with Di2 and Zedtech Zipps.....
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Re: Official Speed Concept Owners Thread [ttx_tri] [ In reply to ]
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I had the valve wide open from the first pedal stroke.....once you get 1/3 of the fluid out of the bottle it works great.....bottle rattles in the cage a little......otherwise works great. But, I like to get a full 24oz per hour......so I don't think it will work for me.
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