Swim Bike Run
Slowtwitch.com
  • Login >
Slowtwitch.com
Search menu
Hot Forum Topics

Poll

Comfort While Cycling
How much does comfort while cycling influence your overall race performance?
View Results


Home > Forum > Triathlon Forum > Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back!

Triathlon Forum

Back To ForumPrint Thread

Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Prev Next
Tri
Classifieds
Lavender
Jobs
Notices
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [Jiowa] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
styrrell
Jul 27, 12 11:41
Post #51 of 63 (3711 views)
Jiowa wrote:
kiwi. wrote:
NiceTri wrote:
...the downtube has a profile very similar to the fastest wheels on the market.


Why should the downtube be shaped like a wheel?


If Zipp wheels already has a solid shape for crosswinds it should work for the frame.

Zipps have a solid design for wheels in a crosswind, but they function under a different set of aero parameters than a down tube.
Styrrell
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [styrrell] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Jiowa
Jul 27, 12 11:43
Post #52 of 63 (3709 views)
I'd be surprised it was different.



Running is a gift.
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [Jiowa] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
styrrell
Jul 27, 12 11:49
Post #53 of 63 (3706 views)
I whats different? The shapoe of the downtube compared to a zipp rim or the aero parameters?. As far as aero parameters goes a down tube has a leading edge and trailing edge that stay that way. A rim has a leading edge that becomes a trailing edge (and vice versa) as the wheel rotates. Thats a significantly different design criteria.
Styrrell
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [styrrell] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
kiwi.
Jul 27, 12 11:51
Post #54 of 63 (3704 views)
styrrell wrote:
The current state of the art wheels aren't a typical airfoil shape. Most airfoils, and hopefully your frame are made to go forward while in a static orientation to direction of travel. Wheels are masde to go fard with the leading edge (tire) and also forward with the trailing edge (inner diameter of the rim).

Unless you ride your frame backwards half the time i wouldn't mimic a cutting edge rim shape.

This is what I was getting at, with fewer words.
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [styrrell] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Jiowa
Jul 27, 12 12:02
Post #55 of 63 (3689 views)
Wind doesn't really care if the wheel is rotating or not unless there's spokes. And Zipp, HED, and FLO all have wheels designed to have the leading edge and trailing edge be nearly symmetrical which works well in a crosswind. So I don't know what parameters you would expect to be different?



Running is a gift.
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [Jiowa] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
styrrell
Jul 27, 12 12:05
Post #56 of 63 (3685 views)
Just what I stated. That nearly symetrical desing works well for wheels, but if you are designing a bike frame with a down tube that doesn't have a edge that is both trailing and leading there is no reason to use a symetrical design. A normal non symetrical airfoil works better.
Styrrell
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [styrrell] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Jiowa
Jul 27, 12 12:25
Post #57 of 63 (3666 views)
A true airfoil works great without a crosswind but not so much at 10 to 20 degree yaw as the sharp edge creates a lot of turbulent air. Round it out and the air will still attached to the surface better. This will change though at high speeds (>100mph).



Running is a gift.
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [jcd] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
WelshinPhilly
Jul 27, 12 12:29
Post #58 of 63 (3661 views)
jcd wrote:
On the day that Felt announce trickle-down of most of their DA tech to the B12 frameset at less than $1800, this has to be a joke.

Sorry for the hijack, but do you have a link to info on this? (I did search but didn't find anything)
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [Jiowa] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
styrrell
Jul 27, 12 12:31
Post #59 of 63 (3657 views)
All true but the vast amount of aero bikes made today aren't airfoils that have been designed around 100 mph. They typically are modeled, designed and tested for best performance at normal riding speeds. Its simply nonsensical that a frame member can be designed for best performace both backwards and forwards vs just forwards.
Styrrell
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [styrrell] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Jiowa
Jul 27, 12 12:45
Post #60 of 63 (3640 views)
Trek Speed Concept and I think the new Scott TT bikes aren't airfoils, however they comply to UCI rules. The Specialize Shiv for triathlons downtube has more symmetrical shape to it than most bikes, which I believe is due to the fact that the cross section can be longer because it's not compliant with UCI.



Running is a gift.
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [Jiowa] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
styrrell
Jul 27, 12 13:10
Post #61 of 63 (3623 views)
Well technically yes they are airfoils, just truncated ones. And they are certainly not symetrical nor do they have the same performace forwards and backwards, not do they resemble current state of the art wheel cross sections.

Just to stay on topic I still maintain that utilizing state of the art rim cross sections is a non optimal choice for frame member cross sections.
Styrrell
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [styrrell] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Taugen
Aug 6, 12 10:52
Post #62 of 63 (3438 views)

My latest rebuild of my Pearson GC-1 Concept for mid-2012 season and beyond. I will be riding it for IM NYC on Saturday.
Team Zoot-Texas, and Pickle Juice
Quote Reply
Re: Looks like the Zipp 2001 / 3001 is Back! [Taugen] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
mfrassica
Oct 6, 12 17:13
Post #63 of 63 (3069 views)
You are the only person I have come across the internet that has a Pearson in the USA. How and where did you buy it? what is the price point for these frames?

Thanks
Quote Reply
Prev Next
Back To ForumPrint Thread

Our Partners

transition-DOT-area-AT-slowtwitch-DOT-com

Advertise with us

©1999-2024 Slowtwitch, Inc., and Slowtwitch.com
Reproduction of material from any Slowtwitch.com page
without written permission is strictly prohibited.