Not a doctor.
Be sure to go see one and they will send you to a / your cardiologist.
I had a similar episode (although didn't black out entirely).
Doc (cardiologist) said I might have to cut back on training severely if it got any worse.
It never did.
Evidently just very low heart rate and B/P leading to serious light headedness.
My point: don't be overly concerned but get in to see your doc.
-YT

Likely postural hypotension.
There was a similar thread a few weeks ago.
Better to get checked and have anything serious eliminated.

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Fruit snacks are for winners

Training is done until you are reviewed by a cardiologist


Chest tightness is not benign until proven otherwise


My experience with conditioned athletes is that the target heart rate for a stress test is too low to be of value. If my patient has a negative stress test and there is suspicion of a problem I have fitted them with a cardiac monitor and then have them go do what induces the problem. One has had a bypass secondary to an anomalous coronary artery, the other ablation for atrial fibrillation.

Enjoy the break. Read a book or something. My present read, The Sports Gene by Epstein, is excellent

I am wondering if any of you has had a similar problem?

Post from a couple of months ago

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/..._latest_reply;so=ASC

"previous episodes of chest tightness and feeling anxiety"
hate to say it but the anxiety is suggestive of a heart condition..
http://www.nih.gov/.../nov2003/ninr-03.htm

also, the Mayo clinic,
http://www.mayoclinic.com/...eart-disease/HB00040
"Women are more likely than men to have heart attack symptoms unrelated to chest pain, such as:

• Neck, shoulder, upper back or abdominal discomfort
• Shortness of breath
• Nausea or vomiting
• Sweating
• Lightheadedness or dizziness"

it might well be just the orthostatic hypotension but the other symptoms are worrying.. with the new recent headaches as well, seems like something might have changed..

I started to black out on runs at age 46, was quite worrying there for a while. Heart checked out OK after six months of different tests, now I just don't run that hard.. welcome to getting older ;-)

I just started experiencing another heart based problem that may or may not be related but that I wanted to know if it was common or not. I'm 25 with 12+ years of nearly continuous endurance training. I just took 3 months off due work, life, ext and have just started training again for a marathon. Before taking the time off I was in racing shape and red-lined at a heart rate 187-188 bpm very consistently. Today I just did a short and what felt relatively easy training run but my heart rate was holding at 196-197 bpm and I also got a nose bleed (very rare for me) during my recovery. I would expect to have a elevated HR for a specific pace now compared to race shape but I am confused why I was able to comfortably push my HR above my peak fitness max. Anyone else experienced similar issues?

Thank you, Y-Tri, for letting me know of your experience. I will definitely go see my doc, but sounds like you've got what I've got. bmeer, thank you for letting me know there was a similar thread.

Sametime, thank you for your help--now I know the stress test might not be of use. Schroeder, thank you for the link to the thread, which was very useful. I read through the entire thread and it looks like I probably have postural/orthostatic hypotension. This is all very reassuring because if that is all I have, then not too serious. But I realize there may be something else wrong with my heart. So I need to get it checked out.

Doug in co, when I say anxiety, I mean that when I had chest tightness, each time I thought I was having a heart attack so I was anxious. I also had shortness of breath and dizziness/lightheadedness. No other discomfort I was aware of though. I agree that combined with the headaches this could mean something more serious. Thanks also for letting me know that you had problems with blackouts starting at age 46. Yeah, it seems like my machinery is breaking down with age!

I'll try to write back when I find out what is going on to tie up this thread, whether I find out next week or six months from now. Might be helpful to someone else with the same problem.

My initial search turned up nothing on slowtwitch so I was likely not using the right search terms.

Definitely get checked out...but I'll add I had similar symptoms, and for me it was panic attacks. Took forever to figure it out, as we kept looking for physical causes and not finding anything.

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mmm-mmm-Momo Charms
Handmade beverage charms, jewelry, and miscellanea
http://momocharms.wordpress.com

I'm the guy from the thread from a couple of months ago that was re-posted here. They did extensive testing on me because as an athlete they wanted to rule out heart abnormalities that athelete's develop. Short version is that what happened is I went from running at a comfortable but quick pace, only 1/3 of a mile into the run to an abrupt stop at a stoplight. The blood vessels in my legs had dialated to allow for more blood flow to my muscles for the running. Because my heart is well conditioned, my heart rate came down very quickly. More quickly than the blood vessels could contract, which caused my blood pressure to drop very rapidly and then boom: Unconscious on my face in the gutter of 8th avenue in New York City.

2 weeks later I ran a huge PR at IM70.3 Haugesund Norway.

Now when I come to a light, I make sure to gradually come to a stop and jog in place a bit. No issues since.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

This. Postural hypotension.

At Nationals last week, I finished and kept moving (found a volunteer to walk with me). Tunnel vision set in, hearing faded, but managed to keep upright (finally learned not to stop right after the race). Added exercise induced asthma for grins (hadn't had that for 10-15 years!). I couldn't stop for a solid 20 minutes, or I felt like I'd pass out.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

mmrocker13, I hope I'm not having a panic attack! It always happens at the same intersection, but I don't feel any anxiety, until I black out, then I think possibly that I might be having a heart attack.

RowToTri, thank you very much for letting me know how things are going for you. What happened to you is pretty much what happened to me. I was trying to keep my running pace up over a long uphill, encouraged by my Garmin telling me I was going to break my 5K PR, but I stopped suddenly at the light and WHOMP, went to blackout almost immediately. I was pretty sure I was going to hit the ground, and I have no idea how I stayed standing, because this was the worst blackout I've had--completely blackness and it felt like I'd woken up from a nap when I came out of it. Previous "head rush" incidents were always manageable and I kept my vision but felt chest tightness and dizziness, so I'd just wait them out before continuing on my run. Even when I get out of bed in the morning, I get a head rush.

From now on I will gradually come to a stop and continue jogging in place. I think it is the combination of low blood pressure with low heart rate that creates the incidents, and that they are getting worse over time is an indication of my conditioning over hours of training. Maybe I should enter a race to see if I can set a PR!

Klehner, now I know also that I should be careful at the finish of a race, when I'm going all out. I don't come to a dead stop because of the walk through the finish chute, whereas at a stoplight, it's a quick stop. Scary to think that I should maybe be holding on to something at the end for support to prevent a collapse.

Yep, same here. I was really worried about it at first but I was very relieved when I found out that it was a blood pressure thing - not a neurological problem.

Nice response!

Hope the OP takes your advice.

Absolutely get checked out by a cardiologist before continuing to train. You may also be referred to an electrophysiologist if need be. But as far as I know, chest pain or tightness is not a typical symptom of postural (orthostatic) hypotension or related things like vasovagal syncope. I have some familiarity with this as I got a crash education last year with my teenage daughter, a soccer player and sprinter who was getting dizzy during games/workouts.

Definitely keeping my appointment with my doctor next Wednesday. Health care is free here, and I do use it when I need it! Thanks for the help.

That you should try to avoid. I know it's not feeling great knowing you could have done 10% more but after being in hospital after doin an HM at 116% avg --> diagnosis atrial fibrillation , needed shock to get the machine running right numbers again.
Millions of tests, some pills and when racing I just enjoy it being there, knowing I could have done a little more though.

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-shoki

Yikes, shoki!

But my version of "going all out" is probably your idea of a trot. So not to worry... my heart rate never exceeds 162...

Did you ever get an answer to why you blacked out?


Been thinking about you since this post. Hope all is well.

Thank you, TriBeer, for thinking of me.

I have been waiting to get a Holter Monitor. I'll be doing that next week, wearing it for 24 hours. I've got blood work (for diabetes?) and an x-ray to complete as well. I'm waiting until the kids are in school to get those things done. The doctor didn't say much, but she does not think it is postural hypotension. My blood pressure was not low. It was 130/80. It used to be 110/70.

And I've been playing with fire, if it is a heart condition. Did a strenuous hike, but only an hour long. Did a hammerfest on the bike on Sunday, around 3 hours, of which 2 hours were doing intervals at my maximum heart rate. I didn't notice anything unusual.

What was unusual--walking to the mall with my kids I felt dizzy. No blacking out, just dizzy. What has not changed is that I still get dizzy when I get up suddenly.

Thank you for the update. Wish the docs had an answer for you? Hope the Holter Monitor eliminates some concerns.

Sounds like you have been playing with fire a bit, but I'm sure you know your body. I think you're brave to push it on the bike. It would be hard to sit still though.

Take it easy. Sometimes it's nice to take a break and you certainly have a good reason.


Keep us updated.

Work out when you are wearing the monitor

If you can, do what you can to provoke the problem

Thank you again for your help, sametime. I pick up the monitor tomorrow. I will definitely be trying to trigger an effect. So I will be putting some stress on my heart, which means I will be sweating, and I can't shower for 24 hours. Yech.

What happened ?

Continue the story !

Hi sametime... I picked up the monitor yesterday. On the first day I didn't do much except ride my bicycle back from the lab. I waited until the next morning to try the same type of run which brought on the original problem as I did not want to go to bed sweaty.

It was not too bad wearing the Monitor to bed.

I ran for around 25 minutes by myself, trying to increase my speed while running uphill for the final stretch, coaxing my legs to run faster and faster, but I was very tired, having run faster than normal for the entire time. Then I stopped as quickly as possible, right in front of my friend who was meeting me at a designated spot in front of a restaurant for a second run, so I knew that if I had an "event" that she could get help. I was feeling terrible--so hard to describe the feeling. Felt like I could not get enough air, dizzy, held on to a water fountain so I would not collapse. But I did not black out. She kept trying to talk to me while I was trying to collect myself. I could not respond verbally but lifted up my shirt to show her my fancy Holter Monitor and mesh compression shirt to hold the Monitor in place.

It felt like it took minutes to recover enough to talk. Then I went for a second run with her and another friend (I am training both of them to run 10K).

It's strange to want to have an "event" because I do not want to actually have a heart condition. Hopefully this will solve the mystery. I had my EKG done (60 seconds) and did some blood work as well: hyperthyroidism, fasting glucose, bah, can't remember what else. I have not yet gone in for x-rays since it will take one week to get the Holter Monitor results.

For the record, removal of the electrodes was not painful as I'd heard others describe, probably because I am hairless! Enclosed in the package for the lab tech is a shaving razor. The tech did not use it, so I took it home otherwise it would have been thrown in the trash anyway. I did have a reaction to the adhesive of the electrode at my suprasternal notch. It was very itchy about 10 hours in. I resisted scratching because I've had scarring in the past from adhesive allergies. The electrodes held steady during my run, despite the fact that I sweated profusely. I'd requested special "athlete" adhesive pads, but there were none, so the tech used extra medical tape to secure the electrodes.

We'll see about the test results. Thanks for following up.