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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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AM swim, after feeling like crap in the water this week I decided to not push it too hard today. Overall felt good, especially toward the end. 71 min swim time
w/u
600 easy
4 x 100 alt 100 fist, 100 cruise
m/s 3 x 800 w/core shorts, steady, ~:30 rest
4 x 100 50/50 back & breast
w/d 500 easy

PM run
8.5 mile, wore flats again and just cruised, holding HR near 75% throughout. 61 minutes.

--------------------------
The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody
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Re: February Fish Challenge [mck414] [ In reply to ]
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Woops, been awhile for my postings.

2/11
Trail running in Whiting Ranch, up something called Billy Goat Trail - appropriately named. 8.2 miles & 1541 feet climbing
Followed with 3000 yards in the pool
1000s 12:55
4x250kwf alt be/fr/dob/fl
5x100@2:00 I'm w/fins
10x50@1:00 sprint 25/ez 25 alt br/fr
2/12
5.9 mile trail run w/700 feet climbing, pushed hard with 7:54 average


2/13
Swim Meet at Rose Bowl Aquatic Center (Man what a long way to drive for a few minutes of racing). I was pretty fatigued and had awful times. I felt uncoordinated and just plain slow/sloppy. Nevertheless, since I'm a geezer, I placed pretty well: (25 yard pool)
100 IM 1:14 & 2nd place (expected a 1:09)
50 breast 36 & 2nd place (expected a 34)
200 IM - scratched, based on my 100IM fly, I decided not to embarrass myself
200 free 2:13 and 1st place (expected a 2:06)
2/14
In honor of Valentine's Day (and that I have no one, ATM, to lavish with Valentine's stuff) I ran 14 miles on trails in Aliso & Wood Canyons. 1513 feet of climbing for a couple of hours. I felt pretty good after that. Ready for the final trail race of the WTRS series this coming weekend (21k). I didn't get a swim in, but should be able to today.

Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.
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Re: February Fish Challenge [HalfSpeed] [ In reply to ]
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OK, with 14 days left, I need to do 42000m to hit 90K. The problem is that I need to do a 5 day biz trip to Barcelona and back. I can swim the day I arrive back at home. That leaves 4 days that I may potentially miss. I have one day in a hotel at London airport that seems to have a pool that looks like around 15meters. If I put in 40 minutes on the evening I get there and the morning I leave, that gives me ~4000m that I'd otherwise have to catch up on. This leaves 2 days in Barcelona where I need to find a pool around work and business dinner obligations. The main problem is finding a pool close to hotel open in the morning, commute across to the pool, cram in a swim and get back in time for work. This is where running rules because you can do it anywhere. If I fall 10,000m behind that means every swim that I do for the rest of the month needs to increase from ~3000m to almost 3800m. I guess that is possible. The things you will do to chase a stupid number.

On a plus side I seem to be getting fitter in the water. Doing 500-1000m of band pull (no buoy) per workout is helping with body position. I have also used the opportunity to improve my kick. Normally I do zero kick sets because of the conditioning my legs get from bike and run and my limited pool time. I am trying to maximize upper body workload. Now since I am not running, I can happy to kick lots more. What I am noticing is that my plantar flex when I return to "normal freestyle" is better and even though I don't kick that hard during normal freesytle, I think better streamlining of the foot and I am arriving at the other a bit more than a "half stroke" earlier. It does not seem like a lot, but a half stroke over 25m, is 2 strokes over 100m or 38 strokes over an IM. If that is worth ~1 min just from streamlining the feet, I would take it. More than likely this is wishful thinking due to wetsuit getting most of the foot drag out of the way anyway, but you take every small victory however it happens.
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Re: February Fish Challenge [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think I've ever hit the Fish Challenge number, not enough time to keep up with running and cycling too.

2/13 - No swim
3 hour trainer, just grinding away
4 mile easy run

2/14- 16 mile run in 1:53:21, middle 8 at tempo effort

2/15 AM Swim 2400 yards in 37:47
w/u
300 easy
200 KWF
m/s
4 x 200 (50 ankle band, 150 buoy & band)
4 x 100 fist drill x 50
2 x 250 easy
w/d
300 IM
200 KWF

4 mile recovery run, 31:58. Got a HUGE blister yesterday, makes for uncomfortable running.

--------------------------
The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody
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Re: February Fish Challenge [mck414] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
Got a HUGE blister yesterday, makes for uncomfortable running.

Invest in some DuoDerm - then you can pop it, put the duoderm over it, much more comfy. It can be a bit pricey but is well worth it.

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: February Fish Challenge [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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band-only pulling is great.

7 mi run (5k @ 7:19 pace + 2 x 1 mi, first one 7:13, second 7:08)
3200 yd swim

5 x 100 on 1:30
10 x [50 kick + 100 fast] 1:12-1:10
2 x [500 swim + 100 kick] easy

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Rented a cabin for the long weekend with my wife, no pool for a few days. We did go to a maple syrup farm and eat pancakes and knockwurst, though :)

also did a little xc-skiing. we're slowly getting better balance on them, lots of fun.

I posted a link to the Global Swimming Summit interviews yesterday (crickets!!!) which was really good. I didn't listen to all of the interviews, but I did listen to the 3 from yesterday: Bob Bowman, Josh Davis (3x Gold medalist) and Jason Turcotte (head coach of Dynamo). I also listened to the Dave Salo interview. Pulled some interesting stuff from each of them.

I'm probably going to get some backlash from this, but comparing how open Bowman, Salo and the like are with their information, their programs, and their personalities, it is completely different from when I listen to the Joel Filliol / Paulo Sousa podcast. On the last one, Paulo specifically mentioned that he doesn't want his athletes telling anyone what they are doing via social media (or at least, that was the impression I got). Meanwhile, Bowman was talking about how when he was a young coach, he subscribed to a mailing list from one of the top coaches in the country at the time, and every week he got a package in the mail of every set those kids had done, and the coach's thoughts on what worked well, what didn't... It just seems like the swim coaches, at least the ones I am exposed to, are less "protective" of their space. Could just be the model that swimming follows vs triathlon is more open to "openness" in order for the coach to actually make a living at it???

Anyway, rambling over. The main point I was coming to was that Josh Davis had some neat stuff on his interview, one of which was talking about life as a masters swimmer with 5 (soon to be 6) kids, plus job. He set the 500y national record on going to the pool and swimming nothing but 50's, 2000 yards a day. He talked about what that was (which isn't exactly USRPT, but it is close...), which I'm going to dub the "Josh Davis Set"

300 warmup
30 x 50 @ 60 - at pace
warmdown

That's it. The trick is that those 30 x 50's all have to be at pace, which means race pace. For Josh, that means 30 x 50y holding 25's. That isn't easy by any stretch, not even for a former gold medalist....

So... I also came up with the "Josh Davis Lite", which I'll be doing at least 3x per week. It's a little easier to get through than the JD set, but still not easy. Gradually I hope to work up to the full JD set.

JD Lite:
400 warmup
10 x 50 @ 60 at pace (the first 2 can be building to pace, but not slow)
150 easy
5 x 50 @ pace-1s
150 easy
2 x 50 @ pace-2s
150 easy
50 flat out holding technique.
warmdown 150

Hold good technique for the whole thing.... It was hard, but manageable.

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
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Re: February Fish Challenge [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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"We did go to a maple syrup farm and eat pancakes and knockwurst, though :)"

Post of the Day!

No swim today for me.

AM - 52 min trainer ride, main set was 6 x 5:00 (T1 practice, 1 min feet on shoes, 4:00 feet in shoes) Much harder on the trainer than I thought.

PM - Easy 10K run in 49:52. Legs are almost back to normal, used some moleskin around the blister and didn't have any issues. Should be cleared up by Saturday (10 mile road race)

--------------------------
The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody
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Re: February Fish Challenge [mck414] [ In reply to ]
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If it's written in stone then it must done. This is Sharpie marker on HDPE (a type of plastic).
House coach drew up a little diddy to get me back in the game. Running 5K+ a day and that has helped my breathing a lot.




Training Tweets: https://twitter.com/Jagersport_com
FM Sports: http://fluidmotionsports.com
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Re: February Fish Challenge [SharkFM] [ In reply to ]
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that's cool!

12 mi run 1:38:33 ... was at 7.08 at 60:00, so a nice negative split.
2100 yd swim: 3 x [600 swim + 100 kick] 8:05, 7:55, 7:54
my shoulders and arms were unreasonably stiff this morning and I just wanted to swim some long intervals.

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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AM swim, 2500 yards in ~38 min
W/u
300 easy
8 x 25 w/band
M/s
500 bouy and paddles
500 moderate effort
10 x 50 (25 moderate, 25 full gas)
W/d
300 IM
200 KWF

PM run, 6 miles easy in ~47 min. Legs still not fully recovered.

--------------------------
The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody
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Re: February Fish Challenge [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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JasoninHalifax wrote:
Rented a cabin for the long weekend with my wife, no pool for a few days. We did go to a maple syrup farm and eat pancakes and knockwurst, though :)

also did a little xc-skiing. we're slowly getting better balance on them, lots of fun.

I posted a link to the Global Swimming Summit interviews yesterday (crickets!!!) which was really good. I didn't listen to all of the interviews, but I did listen to the 3 from yesterday: Bob Bowman, Josh Davis (3x Gold medalist) and Jason Turcotte (head coach of Dynamo). I also listened to the Dave Salo interview. Pulled some interesting stuff from each of them.

I'm probably going to get some backlash from this, but comparing how open Bowman, Salo and the like are with their information, their programs, and their personalities, it is completely different from when I listen to the Joel Filliol / Paulo Sousa podcast. On the last one, Paulo specifically mentioned that he doesn't want his athletes telling anyone what they are doing via social media (or at least, that was the impression I got). Meanwhile, Bowman was talking about how when he was a young coach, he subscribed to a mailing list from one of the top coaches in the country at the time, and every week he got a package in the mail of every set those kids had done, and the coach's thoughts on what worked well, what didn't... It just seems like the swim coaches, at least the ones I am exposed to, are less "protective" of their space. Could just be the model that swimming follows vs triathlon is more open to "openness" in order for the coach to actually make a living at it???

Anyway, rambling over. The main point I was coming to was that Josh Davis had some neat stuff on his interview, one of which was talking about life as a masters swimmer with 5 (soon to be 6) kids, plus job. He set the 500y national record on going to the pool and swimming nothing but 50's, 2000 yards a day. He talked about what that was (which isn't exactly USRPT, but it is close...), which I'm going to dub the "Josh Davis Set"

300 warmup
30 x 50 @ 60 - at pace
warmdown

That's it. The trick is that those 30 x 50's all have to be at pace, which means race pace. For Josh, that means 30 x 50y holding 25's. That isn't easy by any stretch, not even for a former gold medalist....

So... I also came up with the "Josh Davis Lite", which I'll be doing at least 3x per week. It's a little easier to get through than the JD set, but still not easy. Gradually I hope to work up to the full JD set.

JD Lite:
400 warmup
10 x 50 @ 60 at pace (the first 2 can be building to pace, but not slow)
150 easy
5 x 50 @ pace-1s
150 easy
2 x 50 @ pace-2s
150 easy
50 flat out holding technique.
warmdown 150

Hold good technique for the whole thing.... It was hard, but manageable.

Open vs closed.....think VHS vs Betamax.....

I think in the long run the coaches that are more open end up doing professionally better. It is the same with companies. There are companies that try to keep a competitive advantage by being secretive. Others stay competitive in the market by being open but "a step ahead". It's more like, "we have no secrets, but we're so awesome you can come and try to keep up with our pace". I have found in my professional life, being open and a step ahead and you end up winning. But everyone has to choose their business model.

I remember my best years IM swimming when I was in my 20's and swimming 20K per week. You mentioned a this many times when you said, "work on your streamline off the wall" which I had not been doing. Between 2000 when I had a shoulder injury, then 2003 and 2011 with head and neck injuries, a lot of things on my swim stroke fell apart due to mobility challenges and neck pain. Recently though, with 3 months of solid swimming ~20K per week, I am finding my streamline is getting better. I realized how bad my plantar flex was with my left leg when I resumed a focus on more kick sets and that seems to have translated nicely to faster freestyle, not because of kick driven propulsion, but simply by better streamline.

These days 60-70 min swims feel no different than a 20-30 min swim used to feel like 3 months ago....then again, I have not been running at all, so no doubt, when I am able to run again (I hope), a 20-30 min run is probably going to feel like a 2 hour run. I guess there are no free lunches!

Thanks for the challenge. I'll be really hard pressed to make it to 90K with only 12 days of swimming left and certainly 2 days will be no swimming
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Re: February Fish Challenge [devashish_paul]lly regar [ In reply to ]
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Glad to hear you're making progress! It was 13 degrees here today, all the snow is gone. Got out on the skis a couple of times before the snow melted, it's getting a bit easier, but still not easy. We are forecast to get 30 cm next week though.

Also, we have 4 systems of groomed trails within the halifax region now (when there's snow), up from zero about 4 years ago, all maintained by volunteers. So that's a nice thing to have. Still not like what you guys have, but up your way the snow tends to stay all winter.

On openness, I think what happens is that the guys who are open with their ideas are generally regarded as the experts, so people want to come and train under them, they attract the best assistant coaches (I was listening to josh Davis gush over Chris kubick (sp?) who's the longtime assistant coach to Eddie Reese at u of Texas. He's one of the best coaches in the country in his own right, but he's been with Eddie for a really long time for a reason). And that just creates a culture of success. There's nothing magical about the sets they give out, but where the value is in quality coaching is their ability to observe and communicate.

On another note, kid from u of Waterloo (my alma mater) just set a new OUA record in the 100 breast, under my former teammate/coach. That makes me pretty happy, it's not like we're one of the powerhouse teams like u of t.

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
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Re: February Fish Challenge [devashish_paul]lly regar [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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5 mi easy run 44:49
3600 yd swim, shoulders/arms still stiff and tired for some strange reason.

5 x 100 on 1:30
200 fast 2:31
5 x 100 on 1:30
50 kick
2 x 200 fast on 4:00 --- 2:30, 2:27
5 x 100 on 1:30
3 x 200 fast on 4:00 --- 2:32 (bad turns), 2:27, 2:30 (50 back + 50 kick before the 3rd one)
150 swim + 300 kick + 200 stroke c/d

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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No swim today

AM trainer ride, 47 minutes. Main set was 6 x :30 spin ups, 4:30 recovery.

PM, easy 4 mile run, legs still feel like shit. Race day is 48 hours away, not feeling confident I'll be 100%.

--------------------------
The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody
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Re: February Fish Challenge [devashish_paul]lly regar [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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6.2 mi easy run
4400 yd swim, finally felt good.

500 w/u
100 on 2:00
200 on 3:00
300 on 4:00 (3:50)
400 on 5:00 - missed it with a 5:02, a bit miffed as I should be able to make that
3 x [100 easy + 150 kick + 400 fast on 5:00] 4:57, 4:55, 4:57 --- got the quads locking up, piano fell on back feeling on the 3rd one!!!!!
2 x 300 easy first one free, 2nd one back
100 free

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Post 5K street punt and 2K march to Vancouver Aquatic.
In the 50 on 50 this morning, which is cool because 3 years ago it was a pipe dream.
Sharing the lane with two regulars who are real nice swimmers.
Highlights: 200M of solid kick, 400 IM cheated a bit on the backstroke :P.


Training Tweets: https://twitter.com/Jagersport_com
FM Sports: http://fluidmotionsports.com
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Re: February Fish Challenge [SharkFM] [ In reply to ]
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if I needed to cheat in a 400 IM it'd be on fly.
nice pool, and congrats on 50 50s

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: February Fish Challenge [devashish_paul]lly regar [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Saturday: 14.3 mi run in 2 hrs flat, 1000 yd swim easy (5 x 150 swim/50 kick) to cool off.

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Dropping in here to get some ideas for swim sets. My Masters coach retired, so I'm trying to find a new team - for whatever reason I can't motivate myself to swim on my own. Here's a set we did yesterday (yards):

3 x 300 on 4:00 descend
4 x 150 on 2:00 steady pace
Repeat.

I really had to hustle to make sure the guy going first didn't lap me on the 300's.

Today I had a swim meet - did the 100 and 50 free. Felt pretty beat up on both. Then ran an easy 7 miles in the afternoon.

Total bike mileage this year = 20. Still working on that.
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Re: February Fish Challenge [kells] [ In reply to ]
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6x100 descending
6x100 as 75swim/25 stroke
8x50 kick, sprint between the flags
4x150 as 100firm 10s RI 50 sprint into 100 active recovery
4x100 as 50firm 10s RI 50 sprint into 100 active recovery

_____________________________________
What are you people, on dope?

—Mr. Hand
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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Wow, been missing my postings. Probably because, I've been beating yself up a lot and too exhausted to post:
2/15
3500 yards in about 50 minutes
1000 fr 13:10
5x100 various kicks
5x100 various kwf
4x[200s+50k] 2:25/:25/:22/:25
500 s/k cool

7.7 mile run @ 8:47 pace kind of a cruise with some hills

2/16
Easy 6.9 mile run @ 9:20 pace 820 feet of ascent
2500 yard swim in 45 minutes
500s
10x50@1:00 fly w/fins kick down & fly back
2x250kwf bk/fr
5 x100@1:45 alt pull/fr 1:08/:06
3x[50k/100IM]
50k cool



2/17
Hill climbing on bike 25.2 miles in 1:49 and 5635 feet of ascent
No swim

2/18
easy run 9.9 miles @ 8:50 pace with 680 feet of ascent
No swim

2/19
Another hilly bike ride of 18.8 miles in 1:40 and 4620 feet of ascent
Swim of 2500 yards in around 50 minutes
500s 5:52
10x100 kwf alt br/dlp/dob/fr
5x100@2:00 alt IM/fr
8x50 br drill
50 br hard :38 off the wall
50 k cool


2/20
Epic trail race 21k (12.6 miles) in 2:13 with 2881 feet of ascent. I tracked my age group leader a half mile ahead with 2.5 miles of downhill fire road to the finish. I hit 6:39 pace and caught him right near the end. He had some sprint left in him and beat me by one second! This was one bugger of a run - especially a 1.5 mile singletrack ascent called Horsethief Trail. It averages 16% grade, climbing 1289 feet. It took me 28:39 to get up that.
No swim

2/21
25 yard swim meet - I did ok, as I am beat up so much:
500 free in 5:56 (yeah, tired) but still first place
200 free in 2:12.29 and first place - pretty satisfied with that time
50 breast in 36.91 and third - pretty disappointed in that time
100 free in 1:03.31 and third - equally (maybe more) disappointed in that time!

There! I'm up to date

Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.
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Re: February Fish Challenge [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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tigerchik wrote:
if I needed to cheat in a 400 IM it'd be on fly.

nice pool, and congrats on 50 50s

Well I can bring up the back end now. Your workouts look pretty beast, something to shoot for.

Got a taste of mid season TSUN club action today. Had my own lane beside our Sunday AAA group.
Fantastic stuff. I jumped out after 1 hour ~3000M? total, but should have stayed with it. Kids soldiered on for 30 minutes more.
Having said that my legs were pooched for the afternoon 5K TT run.

TSUN Video:

Training Tweets: https://twitter.com/Jagersport_com
FM Sports: http://fluidmotionsports.com
Last edited by: SharkFM: Feb 21, 16 21:48
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Re: February Fish Challenge [SharkFM] [ In reply to ]
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Time to catch up from a few days away.

2/19 - 2700 yards, 44:27
Kind of a shit day, went easy with a few hard sets produced nothing.
w/u 500 build
6 x 50 ankle band
200 kick
m/s 1000 w/core shorts
2 x 200, had nothing
w/d
300 IM easy

4 mile easy run in 30:16, legs finally feel recovered and blister doesn't kill to run on

2/20 - Race Day! Final race as a 44 y/o,
Snowman Stampede 10 miler, 1:01:46, 2nd AG 13th OA. Almost a full minute better than a race on the exact same course last month.

2/21 - Recovery run, planned for 6 miles but got to flapping my gums too much with the pack and didn't pay attention until we passed the 4 mile mark. I was feeling good so I went 10 in 1:12:59.
Demo'd the new Mizuno Catalyst, sweet freakin shoe. I'll be picking up a pair for sure to put into rotation.

2/22 - 3500 yard swim in ~60 min (~54 swim time)
Forgot Ye Ol' Garmin this morning so no interval times.
w/u
300 easy
m/s
2 x 400 w/buoy
3 x 300
4 x 200
5 x 100 w/buoy & band, my right shoulder felt really weak on the last 3
w/d
200 KWF

Easy 4 mile run coming up in 2 hours.

--------------------------
The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody
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Re: February Fish Challenge [mck414] [ In reply to ]
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Forgot Ye Ol' Garmin this morning so no interval times.


Really? A garmin??? I think a time-out is in order...

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly
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