Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis?
Quote | Reply
I have had a very few instances of soreness in either or both heels the last couple months. Sometimes first thing in the morning but otherwise random. Feels like a stone bruise. Today, for the second time, around 10 miles in on a trail run I felt a pulling sensation on the bottom of my feet. It ran lengthwise on the outer third from the heel to the forefoot. It was sharp. I was careful the final few miles and didn't have any other issues.

I've never had PF but this concerns me. It's not been frequent at all but I'm worried it's a signal. Or it could just be a stress symptom from a different style of running, as I don't do a lot of trails. Or something else?

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Sounds like it could be, when I got it, it was after a hilly trail run. Feels like sharp stabbing pain at the base of the heel, like someone is taking an ice pick to your heel. Pain was very sharp and felt much worse post run. I couldn't hardly walk after a few hours. Needless to say it took me 9 months before I ran again so use caution. PF sucks big time. I don't think one run does it but that one definitely put me over the edge, prior to that run the heel/foot felt a little tight but nothing major so I kept running. Go see a podiatrist, get it checked out, x-rays, etc..before it's too late.
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [bigred3] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks for the feedback. The run was definitely a bit hilly and rocky. I need to really watch it. Did you do stretches, sleeping heel stretcher, rolling a tennis ball, etc? Anything that seemed to help?

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Ice helps.
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Do stretches three or four times a day. Most CVS or Walgreens stores carry night splints that you should use as well. Gel inserts have been known to help but are not a replacement for the aforementioned tips. Injections, acupuncture, steroids, etc..are all gimmicks and some can even hurt you more than help you.
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
All of the above and then some. Soak the foot in a bucket of ice, stretch, orthotics, cycling orthotics, new shoes, night splint, Strasbourg sock, tennis ball, golf ball, etc.. Don't overdo rolling on the golf ball/tennis ball, I think all the rolling irritated it and made it worse in my case. Try everything and keep trying different stuff until you figure it out. I'm not sure if one thing fixed it for me except all of the above, time and not running. I wouldn't wish this injury on anyone, big time suckage.
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [bigred3] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
That's a lot of stuff! Hoping to head this off but wanted to make sure it wasn't another possibility. I've been scared of PF for several years. Have seen it shut down a lot of my friends.

I appreciate everyone's feedback.

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
It could be, but I wouldn't worry too much at this stage.
I run a lot of trail and sometimes get the odd stabbing pain/pulling in/around my plantar fascia, particularly when running downhill.

Soreness under or around the heel could be plenty of things, it could just be your running style causing a bit of localised inflammation/bruising.

The reason plantar fascia often occurs is excessive and uncontrolled deflection of the arch. This is normally well controlled by the muscles in the lower leg/foot, but if there is any dysfunction in these muscles, even temporary, then you get a sudden overload of the soft tissue structures such as the PF.

Why this happens is multi-factorial. Sometimes its as a result of wearing orthotics and shoes with medial arch support for a long time. (whilst these can be effective in short term symptom relief, I believe an effort should be made to enhance the intrinsic support structures such as the muscles BEFORE the last resort of long term orthotics are used).
When this support is taken away you overload the PF and you know what happens. Hence why so much plantar fasciitis is caused by switching to minimalist shoes without conditioning.

What to do about it? You need to work on strengthening your feet/lower limb.
You should also see a sports doctor and have an xray if the heel pain persists as you may have calcaneal spurs.
I wouldn't ice as has been mentioned, what is that going to do?

If anything massage and heat will help deal with the inflammation in the short term, helping to improve blood flow to the area moving in good things and moving out the bad.

But this is only short term.
I wrote a short article on it here -
Just a few thoughts about PF, but to be honest it is such as individual thing I would want to see someone in person to try and get to the bottom of it.

http://www.trimechanics.co.uk/plantar-fasciitis.html


Running analysis based in Leeds UK.
http://www.trimechanics.co.uk

https://www.facebook.com/trimechanics
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
If this *is* PF, know that everyone seems to be different wrt effective treatment. I did practically everything over the counter, stretching, special socks, nubby balls, ice water bottles, stretching, etc. Went to a doc, asking for a cortisone shot so I could get back to training (off 4 mos). He said no - cortisone, according to him, weakens the PF and makes the possibility of a rupture (especially in runners) greater. BUT, he told me to get some insoles and use them all the time. After all my over the counter failures, I was a skeptic. Damn, seems to have worked - for me. While I'm sure that others would be equivalent, I used Superfeet green. Almost immediate help. I run in them, move them around different dress/running shoes. When I pile up the miles and intensity, my PF is a little noticeable, but not enough to make me stop...
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Better start LAX balling the bottom of your foot ASAP.


________________________________________________________________________
"That doesn't make any sense at all, you can be second, third, fourth... hell you can even be fifth." - Reese Bobby, Taladega nights
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Coming from someone who missed the majority of sophomore season of track because of plantar fasciitis, it sounds like the exact symptoms, most specifically the fact you always get it in the morning when you wake up.

Plantar happens for a lot of reasons, but the biggest one is lack of stretching. Basically there is a big tendon that runs through the back of your calf all the way through your foot. Most people do not stretch their calf muscles enough so what happens is the tendon in your calf becomes very tight and pulls on the tendon in the bottom of your foot thus creating the tension and pain.

My trainers had me doing a variety of things.

First, I was being given extremely demanding stretching routines for my calf and feet (only after the the muscles were warm; since i couldn't run they usually used a heating pad or had me soak in warm water waist down). Second, deep tissue massage almost every day. The third is making sure when I woke up my feet never hit the ground so they gave me these really thick slippers that I had to walk around in in the morning (helped a lot). Finally they gave me Strassburg sock which was very helpful. When you sleep, you don't keep your toes points so your calf muscle is even tighter than usual when you wake up (why you're getting the pain early in the morning) but the strassburg sock corrects that problem.

Also, after it goes away, make sure to continue the stretching or it will come right back. Stretching is intended to prevent injuries, not make them go away after they already happen.
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I watched this clip last night, I learned something.

http://www.runnersworld.com/tag/plantar-fasciitis


Train safe & smart
Bob

Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [Tri-Mechanics] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks for the response and the article. Good read.

After reading that and viewing the video that was posted my pain is not typical of PF. I've pasted a crude image (that I edited) of where my soreness is (the black dot) and where the stretching sensation is that I felt during my run (green line).

I've had no arch pain nor soreness at all. Never had arch pain. Never worn inserts.

I DO run in a lot of different kinds of shoes. The main ones I rotate are Hoka (Bondi S2 for road and Stinson Trail for trail), Ascis 21xx, Brooks Adrenaline, Nike Lunareclipse and Newton (forget the model). Race in Nike Lunaracer and Pearl isoTransition. Probably seems silly but I feel like challenging my legs in different ways I will keep them healthier and stronger. I have no scientific evidence to back this up. It's worked pretty well until this year when I've had an IT band problem and now this heel thing. Both of those I believe were caused by pushing too much, regardless of shoe choice.

Anyway, I'm going to work on the recommendations that you and others have mentioned. Focus on cycling and swimming, which I need to do anyway.

Thanks for all the help.



------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [onceatriathlet3] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
onceatriathlet3 wrote:
Coming from someone who missed the majority of sophomore season of track because of plantar fasciitis, it sounds like the exact symptoms, most specifically the fact you always get it in the morning when you wake up.

Plantar happens for a lot of reasons, but the biggest one is lack of stretching. Basically there is a big tendon that runs through the back of your calf all the way through your foot. Most people do not stretch their calf muscles enough so what happens is the tendon in your calf becomes very tight and pulls on the tendon in the bottom of your foot thus creating the tension and pain.

My trainers had me doing a variety of things.

First, I was being given extremely demanding stretching routines for my calf and feet (only after the the muscles were warm; since i couldn't run they usually used a heating pad or had me soak in warm water waist down). Second, deep tissue massage almost every day. The third is making sure when I woke up my feet never hit the ground so they gave me these really thick slippers that I had to walk around in in the morning (helped a lot). Finally they gave me Strassburg sock which was very helpful. When you sleep, you don't keep your toes points so your calf muscle is even tighter than usual when you wake up (why you're getting the pain early in the morning) but the strassburg sock corrects that problem.

Also, after it goes away, make sure to continue the stretching or it will come right back. Stretching is intended to prevent injuries, not make them go away after they already happen.

It's rarely been painful when waking up. I would say no more than 4-5x over the past two months. Even then it's just been sore. Not sharp.

With the weather getting warmer I have spent most of the time around the house either barefoot or in flip flops. Then hitting the trails for a long-ish run this weekend. I also started yoga and pilates classes. Several new stressors probably led to this pain. Feels better today. Basically like a bruise.

Good tips on stretching. I hadn't thought about how the calf can impact the foot so much. I'm admittedly poor at following through on stretching but I will do better. Thanks for the response and the help.

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Ive had similar symptoms over the past few days starting on Saturday after a hilly duathlon. My soreness has been exactly like your picture describes and not at all at the "base of the heel". I overbiked and my form went to crap on run 2. My quads were so trashed that they weren't acting as natural shock absorbers like they should. I was afraid it was the start of PF but the more I read into it, the more I think it is just bruising.

Disclaimer : I'm not a doctor and have zero experience with pF
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Do all of the management techniques suggested above. Do not let this creep up on you. Very serious...could stop you running if you don't stay on top of it.

That first heel pain is a sign...listen to the sign and manage the situation.

My PF got so bad I had to quit running five years ago. Well, I could run, but only once a week and only for 30 minutes. This spring my feet started feeling good enough to running regularly again. More cushioned shoes have helped a lot.
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thought I'd update, if for nothing else at least to just keep a log for myself. This happened on the 25th of May. I ran a few times that week. Nothing hard but wanted to test it out. Pain was bearable but wasn't getting better. Decided to stop running entirely to see how it goes.

I've been doing several of the things recommended. Rolling the feet over a ball, icing, stretching, working the calves, wearing soft shoes. My calves are always a mess but the left was really knotted up badly. I also strained it doing swim kicks last weekend. Things definitely seem to be pointing to the calf as the root issue or at least a contributing factor. I got some of the knots to release with the stick. Hurt like hell.

Right foot has improved and doesn't have much but a little lingering soreness.

Cycling causes no pain or discomfort.

Left heel is still sore. It's a dull pain that feels like it's been hit with a hammer. I have felt some twinges on the back of the heel where it turns up. Again, another sign that seems to point to calf and possibly achilles.

If I walk on the balls of my feet there is no pain or discomfort at all, so maybe that contradicts the achilles theory. If this doesn't get better in the next few days I'm going to see a doctor. Haven't decided if I should see an ortho or a podiatrist. Seems to be a lot of strong opinions on that topic. There is a friend of a friend who is a podiatrist and he is a cyclist, so I'm trying to find someone who has seen him to get opinions but I like seeing doctors who actually run or bike.

Hate not being able to run. I've read where people run through heel pain with taping, orthotics, etc., but I don't think I want start down that path and get dependent on those things.

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Last edited by: BionicMan: Jun 5, 14 8:22
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Finally got to see a podiatrist today although I have finally felt better the last couple days. He did several tests and took x-rays. He said even though I don't have some of the classic symptoms of PF, that appears to be cause of the pain in my left foot. He didn't rule out sciatica given my back pain and historical hip issues but doesn't believe it's the cause. I'm seeing the chiro/ART guy Monday so maybe even get some more help on this.

The right foot doesn't have it but possibly does have a stress fx or on the verge of getting one. The pain in that foot has radiated at times the length of the foot on the lateral aspect and the forefoot/ball has had aches. I had some debilitating IT band issues over the winter and modified my gait to help relieve that and I'm pretty sure that's a likely cause because I've been landing more to the outside of my foot. The x-ray didn't show anything. I know it normally doesn't but he said he sometimes sees a cloudy formation as a precursor to a stress fx. I think that's how he put it.

He did mobility tests on my ankle and my left side was tight and likely the cause of the PF. So, he said to do the normal things that most people recommend and add in a lot of ankle flexion stretching many times daily. Did not recommend custom orthotics, which kind of surprised me, but he did say that getting Superfeet would be a good countermeasure. Arches are fairly normal according to him. Wants me to take it easy for 4 weeks. Said I could run a little only if it didn't hurt at all to do so. I'd like to at least test the waters occasionally but will focus on the bike and swim and maybe water running.

In the past 6 months I've had IT band issues and now PF. Never had either before.

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
BionicMan wrote:
Thanks for the feedback. The run was definitely a bit hilly and rocky. I need to really watch it. Did you do stretches, sleeping heel stretcher, rolling a tennis ball, etc? Anything that seemed to help?

I've battled it over the years. It definitely hurts worse after running and when you wake up in the morning. I do all of the above, though I use a small hard wooden ball rather than a tennis ball (used very aggressively). The sleeping heel stretcher I got from my foot doctor is much better than a previous one I had bought online. Also frozen water bottle massages. I also like the PF sleeve socks from Feetures.

I actually overcame my PF with all of the above plus a cortisone shot. I continue to do nearly all of the above for preventative measures. I'm running ~35mpw with no issues right now. <knocking loudly on wood>

Good luck with it.
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [mbwallis] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
mbwallis wrote:
BionicMan wrote:
Thanks for the feedback. The run was definitely a bit hilly and rocky. I need to really watch it. Did you do stretches, sleeping heel stretcher, rolling a tennis ball, etc? Anything that seemed to help?


I've battled it over the years. It definitely hurts worse after running and when you wake up in the morning. I do all of the above, though I use a small hard wooden ball rather than a tennis ball (used very aggressively). The sleeping heel stretcher I got from my foot doctor is much better than a previous one I had bought online. Also frozen water bottle massages. I also like the PF sleeve socks from Feetures.

I actually overcame my PF with all of the above plus a cortisone shot. I continue to do nearly all of the above for preventative measures. I'm running ~35mpw with no issues right now. <knocking loudly on wood>

Good luck with it.

Thanks a lot. Appreciate the tip on Feetures as well. Haven't heard of them. I've been using a trigger point ball. It's harder than a tennis ball and works pretty good. Haven't tried a golf ball yet. A little scared to. Ha ha.

The odd thing with mine is that the pain or discomfort doesn't go away and I don't get the shooting pains that people talk about. I did a run today before seeing the doctor so I would have a good feeling for the current state of things. It didn't hurt but I could always tell something wasn't right.

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Went in for a checkup a couple weeks ago, three weeks after my original visit. Left heel had not improved at all, even with no running and doing all the prescribed treatments. Right foot had very little pain at all and seemed to be feeling normal.

Decided to get a cortisone shot on the left heel when he offered it as an option. I had read countless articles and posts about the shots and knew full well the risks involved. The shot itself didn't hurt at all. He went in through the side between the fat pad and the bone. The next day it hurt like hell to walk. I knew this was a possibility so I didn't freak but dang it hurt. He told me to expect it to not work for 4-5 days. The following week it seemed to be hurting worse than before the shot but it also seemed like the swelling was gone, so I'm guessing the shot was doing its job but just a guess.

Doc said I could try some short, easy runs to see how things were felt. Truthfully, it still hurt enough that I didn't want to try any running. Elliptical and bike were no problem.

I'm now two weeks out from the shot and have tested it a couple times with walk/run 1:00 intervals after a good walk warmup. I can finally see the light. It's not totally healed yet but the pain is definitely leaving. Slowly but surely. I have been very depressed about this and now have a much better outlook. Have to remind myself to take it slow and not cause a setback.

I have a question for those who have successfully beat this thing. For a while I've run in a mix of shoes, mostly mid-level support like GT-21xx and Adrenaline. The last couple years I added Hoka Bondi to the mix, mostly for extra cushion for my hip. With this PF I'm using insoles (Superfeet or Powerstep) in all shoes. I wonder if I'm going to now always need to use the extra support or will I be able to get back to just using the shoes stock, so to speak?

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [BionicMan] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Everyone's recovery is different. Truth is, that unless you change your run mechanics, or drop a lot of weight, the cause of the problem hasn't gone, so it will come back. It's worse for me when I put some weight on and in cooler weather. Mine flared up again yesterday, the worst in a couple years, after a 20 mile long run. It's manageable, but frustrating. I rotate about 3 pairs of shoes depending on what I'm doing. Shorter easy runs I use something more substantial wit ha heel cup more offset and stability features. Medium and long run I use either my Cortanas or my Kinvaras, only because I intend to race my IM in the Kinvaras and want to adapt to them. I quit using my Virattas. I use some Fasttwtich 6's or Kinvaras for intervals. I still race in A6's and those haven't bothered me. My PF is worst at slower than 7:15 pace, and isn't an issue at faster paces where I probably land more midfoot and have higher turnover.


TrainingBible Coaching
http://www.trainingbible.com
Quote Reply
Re: Could this be onset of plantar fasciitis? [motoguy128] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks for the response. I've read some of your stories from the past, so I appreciate you responding.

I have found that walking on my fore/midfoot doesn't hurt at all whereas regular walking with heel first has, although that pain is almost gone. I may try some faster paces and see how it feels.

My weight hovers right around 155 (at 5'7" with a fairly lean/muscular build). I would like to get around 150 which would likely help as you say.

Good info about your shoes. Thanks for that. I've always hoped I would never have to use orthotics but it may just be a fact of life to some degree. I'm 42 and things just don't work the same as they used to.

------------------------
Loud pawls save lives
Quote Reply