I am no expert, but mine seems to correlate fairly well. I do mine on the treadmill and on the bike trainer.

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David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

Andrew C is going to pipe in hear any second to give you the 411 on the Conconi test. I took one a while back and the data was a little skewed.

60 min or 40k TT yield the best results. Take average heart rate over the test and thats your Functional Threshold.....

Mg

Good follow on article that answers some of my questions: http://jap.physiology.org/...ontent/full/87/1/452

Gives a decent explanation of why Conconi might have found such a high correlation between his breakpoint and LT when others do not.

OK, one more, HR deflection may be related to K accumulation: http://bjsm.bmj.com/cgi/reprint/36/2/113

Mike

Dang...just one more. Maybe it is a stroke volume thing: http://jap.physiology.org/cgi/reprint/98/5/1660

Enough for now, my brain hurts....Need a good run to cool it off.

Mike

Does AT even matter? How do athletes with low AT beat athletes with much higher AT's?

What the Hell is an Anaerobic Threshold?

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Ale Martinez
www.amtriathlon.com

Does it matter? Uhhh....yes. If your AT is at 6:30/mile and mine is at 6:00/mile, I will beat you in a 5K, 10K, half marathon, marathon, whatever... More important than VO2 max. Is there a physiological marker that is more important?

How do athletes with a low AT beat athletes with a high AT? Mostly they don't.

Mike

I think PDK is referring to heart rate, rather than pace or power

this is one of the more controversial topics right now in exercise physiology. I truly enjoy learning about it. Do some research on Tim Noakes Central Governor theory. Many people believe that the aerobic/anaerobic model is antiquated and/or irrelevant. Many athletes have been documented to have low VO2's and beat people with higher VO2's. I won't take time to track down examples though. Power to weight ratio is where it's at. LA was documented to not change his VO2, yet he increased his power output and lowered his body weight and then won the TDF. Also, his threshold HR didn't change...if there is such a thing as LT.
David K

i've done both conconi tests and vo2 max tests on the bike to determine LT...the conconi test has failed miserably every single time...5/5 for failures. and the coaches that have performed these tests (2 different people) have found the results are always different between the two.

i'm not a huge fan as the numbers were SIGNIFICANTLY different...

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"Anyone can work hard when they want to; Champions do it when they don't."

Hey Mike,

Other than the Conconi group, no one has ever been able to make the protocol work. There seems to be little / no physiologic relevance in terms of training.

Best bets in terms of field tests:

1 Hour Power: Highly correlated with LT / MLSS (Maximal Lactate Steady State) on the bike

10k pace to 1 hr pace: Highly correlated with MLSS running; practically speaking it depends on how fast the runner is.

Universite de Montreal Track Test: Can find vVO2max (or something pretty close to it).

Phil

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Dr. Philip Skiba
Scientific Training for Endurance Athletes now available on Amazon!

I am very familiar with Tim Noakes' work. I wouldn't say that the concept of aerobic/anaerobic model is antiquated or irrelevant at all. Many people just have misconceptions about what it represents. Same is true with LT or anaerobic threshold. They exist, it is just that many do not understand what they represent. It is all about what is going on inside of the muscle, which is primarily determined by the concentration of enzymes like lactate dehydrogenase and pyruvate dehydrogenase. In fast twitch muscle (fast glycolytic), there is a ton of lactate dehydrogenase. When you recurit them, you get lactate...regardless of if you have enough oxygen. Oxygen is not the issue at all. So.....to say that you get lactate accumulation because you have "gone anaerobic" is not correct. So, in that sense, I understand why you would say that the concept of anaerobic is outdated. Still, LT and AT as defined by the scientists, extists and is valid.

VO2 max is an OK predictor of performance, but as you pointed out (and as is explained in detail in Noakes' book), it fails to be a perfect predictor. However, pace at anaerobic threshold is a VERY good predictor. Much better than VO2 max (which by the way is a power to weight ratio).

LA probably did not change his AT heart rate but he most certainly increased his AT power, and his power to weight ratio, and his VO2 max.

If you are talking about HR then I would agree that AT isn't a good predictor of performance.

I could see how it would be useful for someone training by a HR method though.

jaretj

Very interesting article. Agrees with other things I've read.

thanks

jaretj