I might sign up for the 1/3 for next year. IMO, the thing that drags on the GF is its date: too close to IMFL and too "early" to be a "winter race" for those wanting to take a racecation to escape the cold. A December or January date would draw a lot of out of towners.

It's also competing with IM70.3 Miami and Miami Man. I think Fred may have some date constraints that keep him from moving it. The number of starters for all race options combined was only 394. It's sad to see this.

What was wetsuit situation?

ETA: I ask because athlete of mine had signed up but then life got in way so likely going back in ‘18.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Miraculously legal. 78 on Thu, 78.5 on Fri, then after a seemingly hot day and night, the official reading was 77.8 on Sat morning. I wore a shorty to keep from over heating.

The collegiate athletes did the sprint.

What a cluster.

Lead pack on the bike missed multiple turns due to (1) poor marking and (2) lack of volunteers. I understand that the sprint was probably an afterthought, but if you're going to send racers out, have the course well-marked so you don't need to have volunteers at every turn directing.

Furthermore, no bike race should ever take place on a running path. The sprint bike started off, downwind, on a bike path around the lake... I was going 30mph at one point on a trail open to dog walkers. NOT a good idea.

And last but not least, I accidentally grabbed a shoulder in the swim and that male AGer was compelled to stop swimming, turn around, and with both hands hold my head underwater for a few seconds. It's a sprint—there's no need.

Nevertheless, another lackluster race hosted by Sommer Sports—the question, to me, isn't how long the GTF will hold on, but how long Sommer Sports will hold on?

ETA: The timing of the race is pretty tough, being that it's so close to IMFL, Miami 70.3, Miamiman; however, if you go any later, who in the hell is in shape to do one of the most notorious, most difficult full-distances races well into December? That's rest/rebuild time, not peak time.

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@floathammerholdon | @partners_in_tri

Note to self: don't ever do the sprint at the GFT! I've done quite a few variants of the GFT as a "B" race in preparation for something else, and to try to support the local race scene. E.g., I've done 3 x full aquabike (plus my own transition run), the old Tri-America distance, the 2/3rds GFT and the 1/3rd GFT. Trust me, I've seen and experienced a lot of minor fails at this event which is why I would never select it as an "A" race. Unfortunately, it appears Sommer Sports has a catch-22 problem: i.e., he has too many events going on during the day to do any one of them right, but he can't cut back and really focus on - say 2 key events - because he needs the revenue from every event to stay afloat. I wonder if the new "Clermont Triathlon Beach" they are building a short ways down the bike path to the west will have any impact on future participation.

That facility looks awesome, and I wonder if there will be another race director to come in and capitalize on the Clermont scene better... I won't be around to see how it plays out, but I'm super interested. Clermont is a great place to train and I think the people up top seem to have their heads on straight for the future, investing in a direction that no other local gov't has gone.

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@floathammerholdon | @partners_in_tri

I am not sure if you are a local Clermont individual or not as this is exactly what a lot of the Clermont peeps say, almost to the point that it seems like someone issued talking points about Fred / Sommer Sports. Now don't get me wrong, my daily motto is to "be better" every single day, but I have done so many local small town triathlons and even larger races that were so much more dangerous. Ironman Louisville last week because of the gusty winds, double laps, magnitude of people and the fact that they chiseled large deep and wide grooves down the center line was one of the most dangerous races I have been apart of. But leading many small town races you would be surprised how obstacles there are.

Bottom line is Fred puts on quality races, lots of them, and keeps the pulse of triathlon going. Regardless of whether you like or him or not that is good for the sport. Maybe someone could do a better a job but I can certainly say the grass is not always greener on the other side. We could end up with a situation where we have no races and that would a huge shame.

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And last but not least, I accidentally grabbed a shoulder in the swim //

I won't comment on your race experience, being in the lead often has its pitfalls on poorly marked courses. I have been there many times and it sucks and hits you in the gut when you are doing so well, only to be relegated in an instant by outside powers.


But I will comment on this one thing, there is no accidentally grabbing someones shoulder in swimming. If you find yourself in the position of your hand on someone for whatever reason, keep your hand open and just slip it til it is in the water again. I certainly would not have done what the guy did to you, but I would probably have given you a good kick as I blasted off of you. Actual grabbing of anything in the water is a definite no no...

Monty, you of all people would understand there is going to be contact in the swim.......so to call out the guy for touching/pulling a shoulder and not calling out the guy holding someone's head under water....come on monty, I'm surprised in your response.

eta: While I agree that you shouldn't be grabbing anything, it's an open water swim with people, contact happens, so you respond with how you said it, kick them to get them off....not turn around and DUNK someone's head under water.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Of course there is contact, but it better not be in the form of someone actually grabbing anything on me. It has happened to me on occasion(but most in my zip code know how to properly contact) and it is never on accident. Contact may be an accident, but what you do after that contact is very important. I have thrown my arm/hand on someones leg, just let it slip. What is not ok is to grab that leg and pull yourself forward, and by doing so bring the leading person back. Same thing goes for shoulders, you accidentally find yourself with your hand on someones shoulder, you just let it slip down.

Look, when you swim your hand is open, it is a deliberate decision to actually close it on something solid and then pull yourself forward, that is not cool in any circumstance. I understand why the guy in front got so pissed he abandoned his race for a bit to serve what he saw as some justice. Hopefully the OP got the message loud and clear. But like I said, I would not abandon my race at this point just to make a point, but if I felt the dudes body near my leg, well that would have sent a similar message to the one he got..

I understand why the guy in front got so pissed he abandoned his race for a bit to serve what he saw as some justice.

--------

I agree with what your saying except for this part. If you feel it was justified in dunking/holding someone's head down because they "grabbed" your shoulder then we have different opinions on what "justice" is.


ETA: I just took your comments that only the original guy was in the wrong, because if you stop and dunk/hold someone's head under water or you think that is justifiable justice, that's BS. That has no business in the swim as much as "grabbing/pulling".

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Here is the problem, there are a group of people that think it is ok to grab on the swim, especially around buoys. They do think this is just part of the swim and continue to do it, maybe like the OP and don't think it is even wrong. And not much is going to deter them from this practice, outside of something alarming like what was done here. Even my little kick probably will just go unnoticed and repeat offenders just keep going as usual. We have both seen the threads of people bragging about this kind of thing, so no, I'm not that miffed at the guy that set the OP straight so to speak.

Perhaps he didn't deserve a full frontal assault, or perhaps he has gotten away for a long time as a serial grabber and deserved every bit of it. All we know is that this one time he crossed the line on the wrong guy, now me, I would take notice for future swims to keep my hands open..

IIRC, Fred Sommer has been putting on triathlons in Clermont since 1983, and indeed he is the main reason that Clermont is something of a tri mecca.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Oh I agree with what your saying...I just disagree with the idea that he someone deserves that type of response in any situation. Just as you are saying no one should be pulling/dragging on anyone; no one should ever respond with that type of response either. That's all I'm saying. Full frontal head dunking and holding down is not warrant for any response.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

This is neither her nor there, but I used "grab" but I didn't mean to imply that I used it as leverage to propel forward. My right arm got tangled up in his left and led to the inside of my right elbow landing on his left shoulder. It wasn't at all intentional nor was it anything that resembles bad sportsmanship.

I'm a horrible swimmer (compared to bike/run), and any time I find myself too close to someone in the water (where I would be grabbing feet, etc.) I move left or right or pause for a second to get a different line. It doesn't change anything and I 100% agree with what you said re: people who intentionally grab, but that's not, despite my incorrect way of explaining, what happened here.

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@floathammerholdon | @partners_in_tri

Their websites shows 96 Starters and 76 Finishers for the full distance. I deferred my 2017 race to the 2018 race. Did the race in 2016 and it was very well organized, maybe throwing in the sprint race was a bit too much.

Then it is what it is. I've only been doing Sommer events for the past 6 years and they have progressively gotten worse every year. But it's always easier to pick apart what's wrong with a race than what's expected/right.

With that said, I can always rely on races being in Clermont... Consistency is a huge factor I took for granted before this thread. So good call.

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@floathammerholdon | @partners_in_tri

That means it wasn't fully updated when I looked at the results. Good to know that the DNF rate wasn't that horrendous!

Edit - looking at the updated finisher counts, the 1/3rd GFT is by far the most popular event of the day. While the full GFT is the headliner event, the reality is that more people were in the 1/3rd than than the full, 2/3rds and sprint combined. That should be the focus for growing participation.

I would like to go back and do the full in 2018. It would be the 20 anniversary of the first time I did it and was my first iron distance race. I would like to do one more full distance and call it quits on long distance triathlon. But I have real concerns about The Great Floridian being the final one. I know it will most likely be hilly, windy and warm. The trends in participation just are not good. I like to have a few people around me.

I think the issue almost becomes GFT full is the "headline" simply because it is sorta carrying the "anti IM" on it's back. So if they drop, it becomes, "omg the sport is eroding away, IM is taking over the world". How many non-branded IM events are there in the US now? Less than 10? Less than 5?

But yeah they need to round out the full race day numbers so they open it up to all events, and I get that. Just wonder what is the magical number that dictates the full wont go on.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

"96 starters with only 76 finishers . . . nearly 50% DNF rate." How do you figure? Looks like 21% to me. Just sayin.

Next time I look at results the next day, I will take a screen shot. It originally showed 49 finishers. When someone pointed out that it was up to 76, I corrected my post but forgot to update the DNF rate.

I'm not sure how many full indies are left in the U.S., but with Vineman gone, the GFT is the oldest, continuously running FULL in the country. I think Fred is proud of that. And the course is easily one of the toughest, if not the toughest in the continental U.S. (Alaska Man is probably the toughest in the US due to the cold swim and the run). I'm rooting for the race to continue although I'm not interested in doing it.