Many on here touted Murray as a great biker but on the basis of those results he looks thoroughly mediocre. //

Ya, that is what I saw too, and even more so. The ITU guys got spanked on the bike by a bunch of guys that have an ironman in the legs, and several with the Xterra worlds just last weekend too!! I suppose part of it is the different bikes they each use, ITU guys just are not proficient in TT'ing.


Man if Lionel could just be a shitty swimmer and go 1 stinking minute faster, he would be leading this thing. Kidding about the shitty part, but he got beat by Miranda!!

Cam Dye got 3rd on the bike (in front of Kienle), and in the non drafting Beijing Olympic Triathlon which was a month or so ago, Alistair recorded pretty much the same time as him on the bike - 55:47 vs 55:57 for AB.

I recall Alistair saying he had to work to stick with him. But it's hard to know whether that's the case considering I think Alistair did pretty much the bare minimum to win that - as in coming off the bike with Cam Dye and then jogging a 36 min 10k to win comfortably and take home the dollar.

Man if Lionel could just be a shitty swimmer and go 1 stinking minute faster, he would be leading this thing


Could not agree more, he is giving up 2 1/2 minutes to some of the top guys, he fixes that and he is DANGEROUS!!! Eventually his swimming will improve, of the three sports, technique has the biggest impact on swimming and he will eventually get that nailed down to close the gap.

Yes. and I really really hope this happens. I don't know why, but I'm rooting for him more than anyone else. I love his story, his transparency, and I think I just want to see someone overcome a huge weakness.

Yeah and just think if they had done an event where the swim only made up 1.7% of the total distance like in an Ironman instead of this one that used the ~2.9% ratio of the Olympic distance. Gosh, maybe there is a good bit more than the 0 to 1 watt assistance some think the "legal draft" gives the guys in the IM bike peloton;)

Hugh

---

Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

Maybe LS will learn to swim faster but then again maybe not. He's been doing triathlons since 2010, i.e. 7 years total, so if he had a fair amount of swim talent, I would think he would already be faster than he is. Others may disagree but just b/c a person has a huge aerobic engine does not mean he's going to be a fast swimmer, since you also have to have a lot of swim specific "aquatic strength" to swim fast plus good spatial awareness of where your various body parts are. He swam 12:09.9 today for 750 meters vs the fastest time of 9:36 so he's still way, way back over just 750 m; since the 750m is only about 1/5 of an iron swim, that puts him at 12.5 min down, which is even worse than he's done at his recent IMs so perhaps he has benefited from drafting in the swim. I guess it's a good thing for him that drafting is fully legal on the swim. :)

---

"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

at least she runs real good

And he had a particularly poor swim, even for him, making things that much worse. His "normal" bad swim would have him 45s faster than what he pumped out today.

But what a monster bike/run the guy has, not many in the world that can hang with that combo. The ITU guys looked downright slow on the bike in comparison, and then only three of them beat his run split, and only by 30-40s.

I think Tim Don is done. I saw him at Ironman Racine 70.3 this year and wasn't impressed with what I was reading into his state of mind, body language, etc. I think we might see retirement from him at some point. It is tough to be competitive in sport if your mind is NOT there and your body starts to not perform, rolling backwards and that just keeps snowballing. We shall see. Maybe he is just cooked this year and with an extended break he can return, but I just don't think it will happen and instead he will announce his retirement.

---

---

Save: $50 on Speed Hound Recovery Boots | $20 on Air Relax| $100 on Normatec| 15% on Most Absorbable Magnesium

Blogs: Best CHEAP Zwift / Bike Trainer Desk | Theragun G3 vs $140 Bivi Percussive Massager | Normatec Pulse 2.0 vs Normatec Pulse | Speed Hound vs Normatec | Air Relax vs Normatec | Q1 2018 Blood Test Results | | Why HED JET+ Is The BEST value wheelset

She's like the female Brent McMahon

I am a huge fan of LS, but is it possible for there to be a single ST thread that doesn't devolve into a stream of comments suggesting Lionel should consider swimming better?

This is pretty much how all of the ITU folks looked from their recent Instagram/twitter pictures leading into the event. I wouldn't be surprised to see similar watts (relative) for the ITU and long course athletes, but then a huge difference in watts to cda. Some of the positions seem worse than in the drops on their road bike.

---

https://twitter.com/mungub

As I mentioned, wifi is not available at the race site this year due to challenges post Hurricane Matthew... we are working to share times as quickly as possible and we are sharing the results pretty much as soon as the pros hear them too!

Which isn't surprising in some ways...but hugely surprising in others (i.e. how much money is on the line).

Did lead media motos play a role at all you think?

---

---

Save: $50 on Speed Hound Recovery Boots | $20 on Air Relax| $100 on Normatec| 15% on Most Absorbable Magnesium

Blogs: Best CHEAP Zwift / Bike Trainer Desk | Theragun G3 vs $140 Bivi Percussive Massager | Normatec Pulse 2.0 vs Normatec Pulse | Speed Hound vs Normatec | Air Relax vs Normatec | Q1 2018 Blood Test Results | | Why HED JET+ Is The BEST value wheelset

James/Pubs

I supposed Terenzo has a moto is his bike. This is a picture that is pretty flattering as far as Terenzo goes and yet he road 1:57 at Miami and 2nd fastest today...

---

---

Save: $50 on Speed Hound Recovery Boots | $20 on Air Relax| $100 on Normatec| 15% on Most Absorbable Magnesium

Blogs: Best CHEAP Zwift / Bike Trainer Desk | Theragun G3 vs $140 Bivi Percussive Massager | Normatec Pulse 2.0 vs Normatec Pulse | Speed Hound vs Normatec | Air Relax vs Normatec | Q1 2018 Blood Test Results | | Why HED JET+ Is The BEST value wheelset

Sanders posted his numbers. 410w average on the bike, and a shocking 118 bpm average HR on the run with a 3.09 pace. His heart must be the size of a bowling ball.

 and a shocking 118 bpm average HR on the run with a 3.09 pace.//

Something off here, this cannot be right.

Your point?

My point is that the eyeball wind tunnel is only soooo goood. In addition, as I have harped on forever, there is a huge difference between those with short torsos and long legs versus those people with long torsos and short legs. I do try to understand both spectrum and everyone in between.

I know ST in general leans to want to produce low athletes, but often times this advice is mis-guided at best. What matters is winning triathlons. Are there sometimes area for improvement, yes. She needs a tri-rig brake, that is all I can tell from that picture with a high degree of certainty.

---

---

Save: $50 on Speed Hound Recovery Boots | $20 on Air Relax| $100 on Normatec| 15% on Most Absorbable Magnesium

Blogs: Best CHEAP Zwift / Bike Trainer Desk | Theragun G3 vs $140 Bivi Percussive Massager | Normatec Pulse 2.0 vs Normatec Pulse | Speed Hound vs Normatec | Air Relax vs Normatec | Q1 2018 Blood Test Results | | Why HED JET+ Is The BEST value wheelset

So, you'd recommend a $180 brake that saves her 6s/40k vs, for example, making the gigantic wind catcher that is her arms/shoulder/torso smaller?

I mean, Gwen would kick my ass...but that doesn't mean that we can't nitpick. I just nitpick your nitpicking is all.

Did Drietz need a loaner bike for the 5k as well? Yikes.

I mean, thousands of dollars are on the line for - potentially - separations that could be very small. I don't understand some of the choices these athletes make with that in mind

I mean we can nitpick all we want but we have to balance it with what Gwen's goals are and understand how Gwen's body works. Her goal was to win the Olympics. Now could she have maybe developed a better aero position, and more importantly be confident with it, for Island House??? Sure, but that might have sacrificed Gwen's goal to win the Olympics. The thing is we have too many arm chair quarterbacks worrying about the wrong things. It is the same thing with Lionel's swim. Simply put, winners know how to win.

My two cents, we need to give Lionel dance lessons, not swim lessons. I said the same thing about Matt Russell for years.

Going back to Gwen. Her position is fine. Is it perfect for a 30min TT, probably not. Could it be optimized, sure, but she could also pull a muscle, develop back pain, knee pain, or any other number of issues. It isn't worth the risk IMO. The tririg adjustment is a low risk IMO for some gain.

The mistake is that you think I am not nitpicking her position, I am, I am just weighing it with what I know about high-performance athletes. Now to be fair, maybe you understand Gwen's body, maybe you have been involved with a fitting process before, but without understanding her limitations we CAN'T begin to give her a proper fit. That is the biggest mistake many fitters and coach makes, they don't listen to the athlete and they don't truly understand the perspective of the athlete.

---

---

Save: $50 on Speed Hound Recovery Boots | $20 on Air Relax| $100 on Normatec| 15% on Most Absorbable Magnesium

Blogs: Best CHEAP Zwift / Bike Trainer Desk | Theragun G3 vs $140 Bivi Percussive Massager | Normatec Pulse 2.0 vs Normatec Pulse | Speed Hound vs Normatec | Air Relax vs Normatec | Q1 2018 Blood Test Results | | Why HED JET+ Is The BEST value wheelset

They should have made the bike legs road bike only. How often do itu guys train on their TT bikes? Not very often, if at all, I'd hazard to guess. Maybe a few rides a week in the month leading up to this race, but certainly nowhere near enough to properly adapt to their positions. My guess is if everyone rode road bikes, results might be different.