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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [waverider101] [ In reply to ]
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waverider101 wrote:
i only have 1.5 brain cells but even i can figure out how to put a phone at end of the pool, leaning on a drink bottle, and then just swim to the wall or past the phone if you put it on the side of the pool

don't need to part with $ ;)


Ha - the hard part actually isn't setting up the phone/camera. It's downloading and even cropping the video so you're only getting the parts you need, not the bad shots of nothing or shots of you swimming away.

I use a Gopro knockoff camera but found through experience and research that you should get the real GoPro suction mount, not a knockoff. It's wayyyyy better than the knockoffs, it's not even close, and will allow you to attach your camera to one of the wall tiles so you can get video. (Mine comes out upside-down as the camera is turned that way ith the mount, but you can flip it afterwards. Still kinda annoying.)

For sure, if you've never done or seen a video of yourself swimming, I'd consider that priority #1 in terms of technique improvement. Even a coach telling you that you do such and such wrong, doesn't hit the same until you see how badly you do it in real-time. But I still don't consider it a magic bullet - knowing what you do wrong is important, but fixing it can be really, really hard for non-beginners.
Last edited by: lightheir: Mar 13, 24 16:22
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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Can’t you just look at it on your phone and edit it on your phone and then send it off your phone?

???
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [waverider101] [ In reply to ]
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waverider101 wrote:
Can’t you just look at it on your phone and edit it on your phone and then send it off your phone?

???

Sorry I misread - I don’t use my phone I use a GoPro knockoff. It’s annoying to get the video off it not hard but annoying.
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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I don't have one :(
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [waverider101] [ In reply to ]
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waverider101 wrote:
i only have 1.5 brain cells but even i can figure out how to put a phone at end of the pool, leaning on a drink bottle, and then just swim to the wall or past the phone if you put it on the side of the pool

don't need to part with $ ;)

How do you get the underwater video please?
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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Just use an under water case and then put the phone and case under water
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [FindinFreestyle] [ In reply to ]
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FindinFreestyle wrote:
Here's another perspective. Video review is highly over rated and much less effective than people imagine. Essentially you are describing a "corrective approach": I watch you, identify a flaw, tell you about it, and you try to internalize it and fix it either directly or through targeted drilling.
My general approach to coaching swimming technique improvements is more of a process-based approach than a corrective instruction approach. I have the belief that most athletes find it exceedingly difficult to internalize verbal corrections, or "active technique" instruction - and often those who do have this ability are so gifted as to need very little of it. Neither do I attempt to teach a “correct” style – there are as many variations of the basic Australian crawl as there are body types and performance goals.
That does not mean that there are not commonalities – techniques that optimize propulsion and minimize effort – there most certainly are, but rather than focusing on a single end-goal of precise form, I strive to develop the core competencies and develop the athletes’ ability to integrate multiple competencies into a stroke that works for them.
Technical improvements, therefore, must come from a systematic and integrated set of activities that builds the core competencies of a fast swimmer in a component fashion. Once these component skills are mastered, integration of these skills into the actual swimming stroke may occur spontaneously (in contrast to verbal corrections, mastered component skills are integrated quite readily, and often unconsciously, by a majority of athletes), as a result of specific targeted activities that work to integrate various component skills with one another (i.e., a multi-component set), or by activities that serve to stimulate the athlete to integrate skills directly into the swimming stroke.
The arrangement of these activities in a carefully orchestrated, but process-based manner is what I call "passive technique".
It's the FIST of swim development.


I tend to agree with you that video is a bit overrated; I mean, even when you can see what you're doing wrong you still have to make those corrections. Apparently this is very hard for many to do, particularly if you take the "fix one thing at a time" approach. Your description is diff from the way I think of stroke correction though, as I think of it as more like "watch lots of really good swimmers and try to imitate the swimmer whose form you think you could emulate". I think this sort of thing happens unconsciously in most swimming teams, which is why there is not a huge variation in their strokes. Some variation for sure as in the smaller, shorter people will tend to turn over faster vs the taller people turning over more slowly with more distance per stroke. But on the whole, the basic strokes are pretty similar. And I would say this is true even at the lower levels of swimming like summer league. After a kid has swum a few summers on a team, his/her stroke will look pretty similar to his peers.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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I tend to agree with you that video is a bit overrated

That hasn't been my experience with video analysis. I've been working with swimmers and triathletes for the past 20 years with video. I would agree that the triathlon community's view on video analysis doesn't work. That view is do one video analysis, identify as many issues with the stroke as possible and try to fix them all at once.

In reality, what works well is doing a session a week for a minimum of 5 weeks, focusing on a single aspect of the stroke you want to improve and then focusing in practice (where you are swimming a lot between sessions) to make that specific change while swimming hard.

I hope this helps,

Tim

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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SnappingT wrote:
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I tend to agree with you that video is a bit overrated

That hasn't been my experience with video analysis. I've been working with swimmers and triathletes for the past 20 years with video. I would agree that the triathlon community's view on video analysis doesn't work. That view is do one video analysis, identify as many issues with the stroke as possible and try to fix them all at once.
In reality, what works well is doing a session a week for a minimum of 5 weeks, focusing on a single aspect of the stroke you want to improve and then focusing in practice (where you are swimming a lot between sessions) to make that specific change while swimming hard.
I hope this helps,
Tim

OK but do you agree with my "learning by watching really good swimmers and trying to imitate their stroke"??? This is basically the way I improved my stroke. :)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Sure. If you are around really good swimmers on a regular basis. But it isn’t the most effective way to improve.

Tim

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [waverider101] [ In reply to ]
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waverider101 wrote:
Just use an under water case and then put the phone and case under water

I have an underwater case thank you

How do you set the camera when swimming by yourself?
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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Oh great. When you are just doing this by yourself you are limited in what angles you can take but I just do the front on swimming in and swimming away, and can do the side on from the lane at the edge of the pool. When above water, just put my phone up against my drink bottle and check the frame is right. When under water and I am swimming into it, I would just lean it up against the edge of the pool

That is why it is nice to get my personal videographer (aka better half) to do a few quick shots when she comes down to the pool sometimes. Works better on weekends when nothing happening and no work etc
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [waverider101] [ In reply to ]
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Ah ok

I have a tripod I use. Luckily the 4 lane pool I usually have to myself. So above is easy

I was hoping you had a special underwater technique lol

I use a holder with a suction cup. But manage to have it pointed in the wrong direction 4 or 5 times before I can get it right
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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This. Do video.

More non-swim swim advice: start doing regular core strength exercises at home. If you are 2:00/100 or slower something is very very wrong with your body position or your kicks or both. Pause the stroke until you fix the body position and the kicking. At least 50% of your time in the pool should be drills. Deep end kicks. Swim with the ankles tied together. And yeah camera so you can see just how bad it is.
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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SnappingT wrote:
Sure. If you are around really good swimmers on a regular basis. But it isn’t the most effective way to improve.

Tim

Good. I swam with 4 or 5 former D1 swimmers when I was first out of graduate school, i.e. 23-29 yrs old, and I just modeled my stroke on theirs. It seemed to work b/c after a year or so several of them remarked that my stroke now looked really good. :)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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suction cup is excellent idea!!!

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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This is the one I use


https://a.co/d/4vPSxJQ
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [VegasJen] [ In reply to ]
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<<My kick is literally worthless. I took a boogie board to the pool one day to work on my kick. Held the boogie board with both hands to keep me balanced and just kicked. Spent about 30 seconds kicking and literally went nowhere. I mean I did not move from where I started. At all. >>

that is why you need to work on your kick. Typically one of two (or both) things are going on. Very poor ankle flexibility and/or kicking like you are riding a bike, kicking from the knees. Really try to work on ankle flexibility by using zoomers/short fins and away from the pool spend time sitting on the ground, legs folded underneath so you are sitting on the soles of your feet (if you have good knees). You may think it's not worth time working on your kick but if you are swimming with feet not streamlined as much as possible it's really slowing you down regardless of how much or how little you kick. Also make sure you are kicking from the hips. You don't want a completely straight leg when you kick but you don't want all the kick movement coming from the knee down.

Mike Plumb, TriPower MultiSports
Professional Running, Cycling and Multisport Coaching, F.I.S.T. Certified
http://www.tripower.org
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [Mike Plumb] [ In reply to ]
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I completely agree with you and want to say the same thing slightly differently, in case that helps with having the message sink in.

I have not seen anyone kick on the spot with a kick board, but hopefully I have enough days left on earth to see that and also to see someone go backwards on a kick board. I have seen quite old men go slowly on a kickboard, but at least they were going forward.

When Plumb says you need to work on your kick, what you need to work on is the technique of having a flat leg that is helping you float and also ankle flexibility.

Ankle flex first - Next time you are watching the TV try to get down on the carpet and start stretching out those ankles. If you cannot sit on the soles of your feet just yet, start on a kneeling position and then ease yourself down putting any excess weight on your arms behind your feet and just stretch them out. You may find this more comfortable to do on grass outside

Having a 'flat leg that helps you float' - spend a bit of time each time you get to the pool pushing off the wall, with your arms in a super man position, and see how far you can get quickly checking against a pool floor tile or a thing on the side of the pool. If you start pointing your toes as hard you can, you will hopefully get in to a better position and start moving further forward. Try to keep your arms in the same place to work on consistency. You also can then play around with noticing how having more air in your lungs makes you pop to the surface faster, compared with less air, and where you look with your eyes to imapct your head position. If you are eyes down you will go further than if you have eyes up looking where you are going

Don't know how you swim or kick, and what sort of kick timing you have - whether 2, 4 or 6 beat kick. But usually a kick should just be small and fast, and trying to keep your heels just at or below the surface. Try brushing your big toes together every so often when you are doing your kicking on the board (once you can move!). Also try putting on a snorkel and kicking, as that may help you flatten your body out and make it more parallel to the surface of the water.
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Re: Go get someone to video you swimming, TODAY [waverider101] [ In reply to ]
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I learned to not sink when 4-5 years old. Doggy paddle and breast stroke. Spent the next many years on a beach 'swimming' and feeling quite comfortable in the water. But I didn't learn crawl until age 30 and wanting to do tris. I was kicking in place, and yes even going backwards. It's definitely a problem for adult onset swimmers.
Last edited by: Dilbert: Mar 18, 24 9:02
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