Nope, and this one is no joke. I think I will let you people with creative minds dwell on this one for a while.

This is the time when I feel so lucky that I do what I do. I think about stuff like this all day and all night....and I make a humble living doing so.

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Emilio De Soto II
Maker of triathlon clothing, T1 Wetsuits, & Saddle Seat Pads and AXS since 1990
emilio@desotosport.com http://www.desotosport.com

Cut the legs shorter.

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Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.

Thin it out yourself by "scooping" out the interior foam?

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19° 38’ 11.08” N 155° 59’ 30.66” W

Lay it between two boards and place a weight on top of them, thereby compressing the foam so it's no longer as positively buoyant?

I think the key may lie in lowering the density of the foam...

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19° 38’ 11.08” N 155° 59’ 30.66” W

This may be going a tad far, but... Cut off the legs from the mid-thigh or knees down and glue on legs from a high-density surfing wetsuit... Something of a "frankensuit".

Hey, I'm trying to be creative, not necessarily rational...

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19° 38’ 11.08” N 155° 59’ 30.66” W

I'm thinking Emilio might be thinking along the lines of how you wear leg and arm warmers. You slip them on and tuck the ends under your shorts. Why not do the same for a wetsuit? Short sleeve top with detachable arms (just like arm warmers) and a bib-shorty with detachable legs.

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Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.

I'm guessing that you could cut the legs a little shorter, but Doc Counselman (?sp) showed that, except in sprints, kicking add no significant propulsion.

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Dick

Take everything I say with a grain of salt. I know nothing.

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Yep. You got it. Cut the legs. I did this for my 73 year-old father because he has a hard time removing any wetsuit and he likes to "feel" the water with his legs. Way to think my man!

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Emilio De Soto II
Maker of triathlon clothing, T1 Wetsuits, & Saddle Seat Pads and AXS since 1990
emilio@desotosport.com http://www.desotosport.com

Yep, tested this too. It works, but it is too confusing to bring it to market except to the small group of you that can get so creative in your reasoning to figure out without having to explain it.

It needs to have something like Velcro, or it would need to be a really really tight fit one over the other.

Great job in your thinking!

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Emilio De Soto II
Maker of triathlon clothing, T1 Wetsuits, & Saddle Seat Pads and AXS since 1990
emilio@desotosport.com http://www.desotosport.com

Ridges that sort of interlock - kind of like a zip lock bag. I'm sure it doesn't have to actually zip together, just enough resistance to not inadvertantly come apart. Might be a struggle, though, to remove quickly in T1.

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Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.

Dan,
I remember your results from way back when but as Emilio points out you were testing, I believe, a different style sleevless. The leading edge of the T1 bibjohn meets the water in a large scoop at the chest and small scoop at the back. I suspect you tested sleevless suits where the leading edge is around the neck.

I find that pushing off the wall tells me a lot about points of resistence, for example, from goggles or from the waistband of a swim suit. There is little question in my mind that the T1 bibjohn presents some resistance at the front scoop. ON THE OTHER HAND, the freedom around the shoulders is glorious.

It would not surprise me to find the T1 bibjohn with the right vest as fast or even faster than a full suit. That is if it isn't too hot.

Your old QR result have interested me because I really doubt that the advantage of sleeves on a wet suit comes from increased forearm surface area. My guess is that it comes from increased drag of the sleeveless due to drag from the edge under the arm pit. Just a guess.
Bill

With regard to the effect of a wet suit on kick, I doubt that propulsion is an important consideration. What you want is enough contact between your flexed feet and the water to nicely snap your hips around. I found this easier to do in the T1 because of the disconnect between the upper suit and the lower suit. I must admit though that timing is tricker because it is easier to catch air with your upper foot. Perhaps cutting off a couple inches would work well for me just to make sure I get the hip rotation without thinking about this.

As an aside on kicking, in my college days, no one ever beat me kicking. I always dreamed of a race where you could only use the flutter kick. That would have been my big chance. So, when I started triathlons at age 57, I wipped out my 6 beat kick and immediatedly learned it was a huge waste of energy.

I spent two years rebuilding my stroke using a 2 beat crossover kick. My speed is about the same as it was 6 years ago but when I exit the water my legs are ready to fly. I am puzzled by triathletes that spend time on kicking drills.
Bill