I find TP fairly straight forward, but I'd definitely be up for a training class on WKO4. I'd actually buy it then. I did the free trial and it was overwhelming.

+1

As a coach I've used it for 10 years. It has it's problems, but nothing else really compares at the moment. I also host all of my for sale "off the shelf" / Finding Freestyle plans there. They take a big bite out of those sales, but also have a good reach.

They have a YouTube channel with a pretty good collection of instructional videos for both TrainingPeaks and WKO4. There are also a bunch of 1 hour webinars on WKO4 that go into great depth on how to use the program and also how to plan and manage high level training. Those are as much about training as the program itself.

I've watched a few of the webinars and find them really interesting but often I have only the vaguest idea of what they are talking about. The reality is that once you get past the basic charts in WKO4 (or TP for that matter), you are really getting into tracking, analyzing and then planning some pretty detailed training phenomena so it pretty quickly gets into "how to train high level athletes" rather than just "how to work the computer program." Its like the difference between learning the basics of how to use your car GPS to punch in an address and the intricacies of using a GPS navigation system as part of planning and executing a sailing route across the Pacific. At some point the thing is not an end to itself but just a tool to help do something really complex which requires its own knowledge base ;-)

Golden Cheetah. Its not as pretty but once its set up its awesome...and its free!

I agree, as a cyclist i have thought about using "today's plan" but TP is just so simple to use and i have 7 years of power data. My primary complaint with TP is with the annual training plan, i use rolling 10-12 day blocks for training and they are stuck on a week system. I also wish one could track very specific power numbers such as 3 minute power or 45 second power. In essence allow the user to define the charts in greater depth.

Also is it just me or is TP missing a print function? I have been searching for a print week plan for a few months and cannot find the feature?

This is where the whole thing falls apart. Because this is not true. If you train at the same wattages for 3 months then it would be true. But that is not how training works. You can train for a LONG time at the same INTENSITIES, relative to your current fitness, and improve rapidly. And you TSS will stay relatively constant and your TSB will not be all that negative.

I spent many years essentially following the same plan over and over to run marathons and in a 7 year time span went from 3:30 to sub 2:40.

This year I spent a long amount of time doing bike training, my balance all summer long was close to 0 but my FTP went up 17%.

It's a marketing gimmick.

---

https://markmcdermott.substack.com

Rather than derail the thread further, on a topic that has been beat to death so many times....I simply disagree.

Based on the bolded bit, it seems that you have been listening to the wrong people.

EDIT: Here's what the right people have long said (note the italicized bit, especially point b):

"a long (e.g., 4-6 wk) plateau in CTL during a time when a) the focus of training has not changed, and b) the athlete’s performance is constant is generally evidence of what might be termed “training stagnation”

(From https://www.trainingpeaks.com/...performance-manager/)

Try telling that to all the folks in the team sport world who are now getting great use out of essentially the same approach (i.e., a watered-down version of Banister's impulse-response model, based on moving averages) to minimize injuries:

https://www.scienceforsport.com/...onic-workload-ratio/

You got it, they are simple monoexponential functions. Using the default time constants of 42 and 7 d for CTL and ATL, respectively, means that they will be ~90% of the way to plateau after about 3 mo and 2 wk, respectively.

As a coach I find it ok to use but my athletes preferred it. I was as happy on spreadsheets/WKO as I am on TP/WKO.

I keep searching for something else but...shrugs shoulders

---

Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I use TP as well, but also for some who are intimidated by all the stuff in TP, a version that is a bit closer looking to the old TP but with some things done a bit differently. It's called Fasttrak.biz It is super easy to use. Not for everyone but they have free trials (14 days) as well. I'd say if *feels* more like the "pre-TP 3.0" version with upgrades in it.