About 1:20 but at least you probably won't flat.

My complete guess is at least as much time as Gatorskins. I just can't remember how much time that is.

All of it. You will lose all of the time.

I'd imagine it's multiple seconds / mile for every mile ridden, forever.
Or for your example, multiple seconds x 25.

How many blocks of :25 seconds are you willing to give up, to slightly reduce the already very low odds you might flat during a race?

I take it you got a flat on one of your rare forays into the outside world on 2 wheels recently?

PS - the other things you reduce w tires like that, besides odds of flatting, are:
Cornering, braking, ride quality - and as mentioned, speed.

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float , hammer , and jog

Nope, was not the issue at all.

My race bikes are on the truck, so I used my backup bike today at a race, which has my training wheels on with Armadillo tires, which I use for
outside training rides. I felt they were much slower on my training rides, but ...

But I was shocked on how much slower I was at this race that I have ridden for many years. No matter how hard I pushed, I did not seem to go anywhere. Seems I added like 5 to 6 minutes in my 40K. Luckily the race was not that important, but decided I would just do some data collection. I would never "race" on them, but this was a unique case. If I get stuck like this in the future, I would buy some 4000's and install since I did not need that much workout today.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Going off tom's spreadsheet, its about 2 seconds /Km for a GP4000 vs a Gatorskin( 1:20 over a 40k)... Not sure armadillo vs gatorskin...

This assumes .0018 difference in CRR and
0.1 lbs (50 g) of drag (at 30 mph) = 0.5 s/km = 5 W = 0.005 m^2 CdA = 0.0005 Crr

I need to find some sales and buy some extra GP4000's. Never going to go through that effort again. Now since I had not raced the bike before, maybe something else is going on also but oh well, having 75 year old guys, and younger gals flying by me was pretty humbling. :(

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Why was your effort higher? You are going all out from the gun, so it was only 6 min longer over a 2hr+ race.

Where is your TT, Aleppo? Seriously a GP4000 has great durability under any reasonable circumstance. They are my gravel tire of choice. Riding an Armadillo is like saying "I don't care how badly I suck".

See post no. 5

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

Based on my (subjective) experience, they are horrendously slow; much worse than Gatorskins.

If Tom's spreadsheet says +1:20 for Gatorskins vs GP4000S IIs, I wouldn't be surprised if it's 2:00+ for Armadillo's vs GP4000S IIs; +5:00 mins seems like a bit of a stretch though!

+5:00 wouldn't surprise me. I recently tested a sample set of "flat-proof" tires that required an extra 73w over GP4000s @ 20mph...

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"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"

I have the same impression of them. They are horribly slow tires and suck all the joy out of cycling. It got the point where I literally didn't want to ride outside on the training wheels because the ride would be harsh and slow.

I now use them only on the trainer. I can't bring myself to ride them outside ever again.

Out of curiosity, which tire was that? I kind of have an inverse problem in that I'd like a slow tire for training on the bike trails near where I live.

These were samples that aren't on the market yet...

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"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"

Disclaimer: I've never tested Specialized Armadillo tyres but did use them for commuting. When I switched to Gatorskins I was a few minutes faster over my 1hour commute.
They are a super slow tyre.
It would be funny to test them against my race tyres.

there was a thread by a guy saying most runners dont hurt themselves on the run. maybe have a look and see if you get something out of it ...

I was pretty shocked. Not sure if the race will put splits up. But since I have ridden this race route many times, and my biking has been okay for me this season,
I was pushing as hard as I could and it was just not going anywhere. Numbers do not lie but glad it was not totally in my head. I would take a few flats compared to how slow, and extra work, these made me have to do.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

The last entry on my list is an "all-conditions" Armadillo...and it is estimated to "cost" ~71W for a pair, while a pair of 23C GP4K2s would roll at ~31W, for a 40W delta.

That is DEFINITELY something you'd feel. 40W is "worth" ~4s/km of time difference...4s/km x 40km = 160s, or a mere 2min 40s over 40K.

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

Yep, I felt it as soon as I started riding. I kept looking to see if the brakes were rubbing. Oh well, will not do that again in a race if I have a choice.

Thanks, glad it was not totally in my head or total lack of legs. :)

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I bought a set of these Armadillos in Sacramento one year, rode over a full year in training without a flat. They were super difficult to mount, but purchased a bead jack tire lever. Didn't care if they were slow, it kept rolling a full year before the threads finally showed. I think there was like 6,000 miles at the end of life. Our roads are pretty good around here though, so it may last longer?

Now I pretty much use Gator Hardshell for training. No issues, good road feel.

I haven't had a puncture in the best part of 2 years using GP4000s on mostly bad roads.
The fact you had no punctures with Armadillos could equally be considered evidence you don't need them, not a reason why they're worthwhile. If punctures are not a frequent occurrence I'd skip the Gatorskins too. They may be better but they're not good. I used Gatorskin Hardshells for a while back when I believed puncture protection was a consideration. I've had LESS punctures since I got rid of them maybe 6 years ago. Probably a matter of luck as I doubt they're actually more puncture prone than the Conti 4 Seasons, Conti GP4000s and Michelin Pro4 SC tyres I've used in the intervening period - all with puncture rates less than 1 per 5000km. I wouldn't go back to Gatorskins, even 4 Seasons or similar more racey endurance tyres seem unnecessary for me. I've weighed 85-88kg for most of that period and ride year round, very often on bad roads, and often in wet conditions.