Oh no... OH NO!!! Let me get my camera, 'cause this is gonna be a train wreck! ;-)

Seriously, this has been beaten to death, and then some more. I know you're new, but if you search the forum you'll get all the opinions you could ever want on this topic. This has to rank as one of the top 3 Slowtwitch holy cow discussion topics.

Use Clinchulars

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Or Tunchers.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

"Are tubulars more reliable, lighter, faster etc? "

All the above. The gap is narrowing but tubs still have the edge. Definately use tubulars for racing.

OK, I will try and lay this out as best as I know

Tubulars are more expensive. Clinchers are cheaper. If you flat a tubular, you replace the whole tire. If you flat a clincher, you replace the tube for a few bucks. Tubular tire changes are generally regarded as faster. But if you are decent, a clincher tube change isn't too much slower.

I have ridden a few of both, and feel as though tubulars ride smoother. But, there are many clinchers that ride very smooth with low rolling resistance.

In regards to tubulars vs. clinchers for flat protection, it is a wash. It all depends on which type of each you choose to get. I can show you a clincher that won't flat, I can also show you a clincher that will flat if you look at it real mean-like.

Thus, break it down like this.

Clinchers are better for training because they are cheaper to replace when worn out and cheaper to replace a $5 tube when they flat. Its easier to keep a few $5 tubes laying around than a few $50 tires.

Tubulars and Clinchers are both good for racing. There are clinchers that are excellent race tires and there are tubulars that are crappy race tires.

You said you were a newby. Thus, get CLINCHERS to start out with. Get a decent set of training wheels. Look to reliability and strength more than aerodynamics. Training wheels don't need to be aero, they need to reliable.

When you start going faster and feel race wheels are an option, tubulars are a very popular way to go. But, there are many clincher tires that are well worth racing and won't cost you the race.

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- Nick
Now that I know some of you guys look through the special needs bags for kicks, I'm gonna put some really weird stuff in mine. I can see it now. "What the heck was he going to do with a family pack of KFC chicken, a football helmet full of peanut butter, a 12 inch rubber dildo, and naked pictures of Bea Arthur?"

Seriously speaking.

Yes, tubulars are better for racing. nearly every pro in the Tour de France uses them as well as almost every top pro triathlete.

Lighter wheel and tire than clinchers.

More flat resistant.

Marginally lower rolling resistance.

Better comfort on rough surfaces.

Lower rolling resistance at lower tire pressure (again, comfort).

Better cornering perfromance since the tire has a round cross section, not "U" shaped like a clincher.

Much faster to change a flat in a race environment if you know and practice the simple technique.

As you will see in this thread, there will be significant dissention about which one is "better".

I maintain that those who argue against tubulars as the tire of choice aren't employing them optimally. There is a lot of lore and semi-informed baloney about tubulars, their use, mounting and maintenance. That BS is perpetuated in threads like this.

Watch it collect.....

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

get both and join the fight.


Thom the tubbie man ha ha

Or you could get Beth and Jon to fight.

Thank you. That is great information.

beth is mine ! ha ha

Is is possible for the tubular to "pop" off of the rim? I guess it needs to be glued properly, which if true, would mean that when changing a flat in race conditions a mistake could be made. Am I off the mark?

They can Roll OFF if not glued well. There is also the possibility of the glue heating up when braking during a descent. However, so long as the tires are glued properly, this shouldnt be an issue.

Some guys leave a small gap in the glue directly across from the valve stem to aid in the changing of the tire in the event of a flat.

You don't reglue when changing a tire in a race, you rely on the tackiness left from the old tire and the air pressure of the new one. Just don't corner real hard and you should be ok.

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- Nick
Now that I know some of you guys look through the special needs bags for kicks, I'm gonna put some really weird stuff in mine. I can see it now. "What the heck was he going to do with a family pack of KFC chicken, a football helmet full of peanut butter, a 12 inch rubber dildo, and naked pictures of Bea Arthur?"

It isn't probable that a tubular would ever "pop" off a rim. A tubular could be rolled sideways off a rim given the right circumstances. No, in fairness and reality, those circumstances are rather extraordinary. I would suggest that a reasonable incidence of this happening is attributable to user error, i.e., improper gluing (it really is very simple- it does not take hours) or some other preventable situation.

Also, it takes roughly the same amount of force to "roll" a clincher as it does to "roll" a tubular if the tubular is correctly glued.

We teach a tubular clinic once in a while in our store. To a person, when we finish the class, people's reaction is, "Is that it? That's simple!"

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

I'm normally in agreement with most of your posts, Tom--but this: "Marginally lower rolling resistance" is a perfect example of this: "There is a lot of lore and semi-informed baloney about tubulars, their use, mounting and maintenance. That BS is perpetuated in threads like this"

Having a lot of $$ tied up in tubular discs and deep wheels, I really didn't want to belive the mountains of info on rolling resistance, some quite scientific, some not. My own sem-scientific test concluded what everyone else's has--that tubulars have more rolling resistance.

If you trust the modelling on analcycling (I do), a clincher is faster in pretty much evey situation, even a hill climb TT! That's if you have a perfect bond between tire and rim! If you have the tire mounted in a way that allows a quick roadside repair, the results aren't even close.

Tubulars certainly have advantages (mainly high-speed blowout safety), but in terms of shear speed, clinchers are faster.

When you factor in the convenience factor, it seems like an easy decision to me.

Still, I'm glad people still go for tubies--it made my e-bay selling experience much more pleasurable!!

Clinchers



Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

"When you factor in the convenience factor, it seems like an easy decision to me. "

I'll say that tubbies are more convenient. Glue it on.....rip it off.....pop on a new one. No tube to try and get into the tire, no repair kits, no patches, no pinch flats. I have 2 sets of tubbies, a tubbie disc and one set of clincher HED3's...but, I use the tubular clinchers on these, I love 'em.

I've sold all my clincher wheels, except the HED3's. but...they're HED3's and thats why I kept them. Even as clinchers they are worth their weight in gold.

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Paul

http://draco.acs.uci.edu/rbfaq/FAQ/8b.17.html

I have used both for training and racing. As soon as I can find time to get a replacement clincher disk, I will never ever ride a tubular again.