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Re: 70.3 training volume [jacobtri92] [ In reply to ]
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jacobtri92 wrote:
I also know that when you do too much volume you will sacrifice speed.

Not sure what you mean by 'sacrifice': yes you will most likely sacrifice the amount of intensity (not speed) you can do in training as the risk of injury is probably too high. But bare in mind ITU guys on LOW run mileage are doing 70ks a week with heaps of intensity, where people like Jan Frodeno are doing 120-130k run weeks.

The reality is that volume is key to HIM training, intensity is very important and should be used across the board during HIM prep, but building a big aerobic base is key. The pro's are doing 25+hr weeks 45+ weeks of the year.

Swim: Depends on your goals, try and swim with a squad, you will get a much better quality of workout and have someone looking at your technique. Mentally it's a lot easier too.

Bike: Ride often, find some long hills to build your strength, long ride should be building to 4.5-5.5hrs.

Run: Your biggest limiter will be your aerobic ability, NOT speed. Hence getting in some decent mileage is imporant, the key session of the week is the long run, start at 90mins and build to 2hrs. Do some extended runs at goal HIM pace, longer repeats at 10k pace (1-2ks). Hills again are very important, you need strength to run well of a 90k bike

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Re: 70.3 training volume [cannastar] [ In reply to ]
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Well I can at least say this... you will sure be ready for that half:) Dude that volume as mentioned before is PLENTY!! I think you can get do far less and still be just as fast. Shorter but more intense. But on the other side volumes is beautiful thing. And that you have plenty of!! one thing I've learned is that volume can help bring that speed in rather than just trying to train fast all the time. My first ever half was Fl 70.3 and I went 5 flat... that was with 2 40 -50 mile bike rides a week .. nailed them as hard as i could.... only 30 miles running a week with a long run of 12 miles... and two 4k sessions in the pool... wanted to puke when done.. the only way you wont go sub 5 is if the race is cancelled. If you are fine with that volume and you don't get injured then more power to you. Keep it up. I kind of share your way of thinking. Have your training and effort trump your race distances by quite a bit so when race day comes around and you are fresh and tapered... it will just another day at the office!!
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Re: 70.3 training volume [The Phoenix] [ In reply to ]
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+1 What The Phoenix said... what you briefly described sounds more like my IM volume. For 70.3, 14-15 miles my typical max during build. YRMV
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Re: 70.3 training volume [jacobtri92] [ In reply to ]
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Depends what your goals are. Volume is really arbitrary, but I would say do as much volume as is possible given your time constraints, without having to sacrifice key threshold workouts. On the bike that's at least one 2x20 type effort, as well as some steady riding during your long ride (4-5 hour ride). For running, that's a 20-30 min tempo/progression and a 2 hour long run each week, with the long run done progressive/steady every other week.

Another key thing though - don't worry about hitting 'peak weeks' - try to maximize your training volume over the ~10-20 weeks before the event w/o too much variation week to week. Carrying a fairly steady level of fatigue will help you get those key workouts in without burying yourself w/ inconsistent high weeks.

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Re: 70.3 training volume [snackchair] [ In reply to ]
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whoa this thread is making me feel like a lazy fat guy ....... amazing world we are in when looking at the mileage and time on a weekly basis that we all talk about as normal and that is NOT to win racing but to compete well. "normal" people think doing what what we do for "just" 5 to 9 hours a week is obsessive but as you can see by reading through thread it not enough to even compete well - we are a strange breed indeed
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Re: 70.3 training volume [goaheadjump] [ In reply to ]
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I'm currently around 12-13 hours, and have a HIM in a little over three weeks. My week is generally broken down into 5-6 hrs of biking, 3-4 hrs of running, and 3-4 hrs of swimming. Most stuff is pretty high intensity, with speedwork on Wednesday at the track, and a Sunday long run (currently around 15 miles) that has a bunch of miles at HIM goal run pace. Lots of biking above HIM wattage, and also lots of fast (for me) intervals in the pool. I'm hoping for a < 4:20 HIM.

I'll be transitioning into IM training for Tremblant for the nine weeks in between races. Things are also a bit crunched for time as my wife and I recently had our first child, who is almost 8 weeks old. Balancing training with everything else is a bit tricky.

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Re: 70.3 training volume [goaheadjump] [ In reply to ]
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goaheadjump wrote:
whoa this thread is making me feel like a lazy fat guy ....... amazing world we are in when looking at the mileage and time on a weekly basis that we all talk about as normal and that is NOT to win racing but to compete well. "normal" people think doing what what we do for "just" 5 to 9 hours a week is obsessive but as you can see by reading through thread it not enough to even compete well - we are a strange breed indeed

Ha - I was just going to ask if anyone in this thread has a JOB? How do people find this much time to ride 800 miles a week, run 100 miles a week and swim 10 miles a week?
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Re: 70.3 training volume [jacobtri92] [ In reply to ]
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You can be "planning" to build to such volumes all you want, but ultimately you're going to have to figure out what numbers you can effectively and constructively handle. Sure, more is more, except when it isn't...and if you are in touch with your body and perceptive about how you're feeling, you will know when you cross that line (or are starting to). The biggest week I did in my HIM training was 18k/240 miles/33 miles (21 hours) and the biggest four week moving average I held was ~20k/~200 mi./~25 mi (18 hr/week). These numbers represent the upper limits of what my body can handle and sustain.

It sounds like you have never put your legs and lungs to the figures you are quoting--to be sure, they are very big numbers you might never be able to maintain--but my advice would be to find volumes that feel very tiring but not debilitating, which is subtle but really in my experience the difference between fitness accretion and fitness dilution.

Optimizing fitness for long-course triathlon is kind of like undertaking an elaborate science experiment on your body, and yet even when armed with every technological and numerical/quantitative tool at our disposal, we still shit the bed because we get the qualitative part of it all wrong. And even when we get it all right it can go all wrong, because it's a maddeningly difficult sport...it's just bloody hard. So my answer is: get out there and train a lot, but not too much. The goal is more, not more.
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Re: 70.3 training volume [jacobtri92] [ In reply to ]
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Depending on your experience at the 70.3 distance the most you really need is 4 hour rides and 2 hour runs. After that you can do less volume with higher intensity to work on speed. The more years you have under your belt at the distance you should focus less on volume and the quality from week to week.
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Re: 70.3 training volume [jacobtri92] [ In reply to ]
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My peak week leading up to my last IM was roughly 300km cycling and 60km running. In the buildup to that IM I did a 70.3 in 4:39 and I am far from naturally talented (first sprint race was 1:36, 4 years ago).

That kind of volume should easily get you sub 5, but simply consistently training for a couple of years should get you there as well, though I'm sure you don't want to wait that long.
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Re: 70.3 training volume [borncrazy] [ In reply to ]
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This is a great post- Many questions I've often wondered about were answered or at least commented on. I am doing my first Half in November.

I have been racing for 5 years and do quite well in sprints. I am hovering at 18 min to high 17 min off the bike at 26 mph and swim pace around 1:22 / 100. My training for the Half in November is about 15-18 hours a week atm. I do want to break 4:15 for my first one. THe one thing I have noticed with my friends is that they always die on the run. I don't want to be another guy who dies on the run. I want to do a 1:20 after averaging 25 on the bike... we will see... Train the way you race... People don't like doing the 60 mile time trials with 10 mile run afterwards but thats what it takes. I coach myself...to be updated.. Venice - November.

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Re: 70.3 training volume [kdw] [ In reply to ]
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kdw wrote:
I've raced well with a 50 mile long ride and a 12 mile long run each week. Both of these were ball busters and way harder than race day rides/runs.

Ride:

20' easy
2x30'@90%(5' easy in between)
10' easy
5x5'@105%(3' easy)
(Race day effort was 85%)

Run:

20' easy
2x15'@T pace(5' easy)
10' easy
10' T pace

Good to hear. I'm kinda already there @ 5 weeks out. Trying to figure out if I need to go beyond 60 miles on the bike (hard) and 13 miles on the run (hard) over the next 3 weeks or so. I can easily do the swim at my own (slowish) pace and don't want or expect to make any major gains there. My total hours per week right now is @ 10. I'm looking to break 6 hours on race day. Any advice or guidance is appreciated!

"The first virtue in a soldier is endurance of fatigue; courage is only the second virtue."
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Re: 70.3 training volume [goaheadjump] [ In reply to ]
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goaheadjump wrote:
whoa this thread is making me feel like a lazy fat guy ....... amazing world we are in when looking at the mileage and time on a weekly basis that we all talk about as normal and that is NOT to win racing but to compete well. "normal" people think doing what what we do for "just" 5 to 9 hours a week is obsessive but as you can see by reading through thread it not enough to even compete well - we are a strange breed indeed

By golly, older farts (with real jobs) such as myself would be broken down and unable to start the event with a lot of the weekly time/mileage figures posted. Gosh darn, many of the old farts lousy running performance is not related to "aerobic fitness". Watch out for what the future is going to bring you.
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Re: 70.3 training volume [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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jaretj wrote:
If you are really new to the sport then what you are planning on doing is just fine. Find out how much volume you are capable of then add some intensity in the last 8 weeks. Something like 40 minutes of tempo work for the bike and run.

Find a 5 to 1 bike to run volume (miles) that you can consistently repeat week in and week out.

You may find that what you plan is quite a bit though.

jaretj

I've backed off the 5 to 1 ratio and am down to about 4 to 1 but i really think that's a matter of how much time I actually have to run in a week.
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