*claps hands and rubs them together* Alrighty then.

Lets get to work crafting some laws making it illegal to kill folks with guns. What you're proposing is more control; more laws; more restrictions. And, as has been pointed out, only the law abiding will abide

Tony is on the right track in pointing towards a break down in values within our culture; a breakdown of families; a deliberate blurring of what's right and what's wrong.

As JSA points out (repeatedly) we've plenty of good laws and procedures that are just not followed/enforced.

So if u want to get to work? start with enforcing existing laws and procedures and not trying to enact more California confiscatory legislation.

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Steve

Terrible analogy. Last I checked, alcohol isn't sold to kill people.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

I know I feel safer, too. ;-)

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Who said the violence will stop? Nice deflection.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

you still here? color me shocked!!

That's fine with me, Dan. It's your site and your rules. I have no problem with that.

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Why has that breakdown occurred in the US, alone of all countries in the world?

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"Go yell at an M&M"

So they're like the Koch Brothers, then. Or Priorities USA? Or People for the American Way? Good to know. ;-)

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Really? Because it accounts for in excess of 100,000 death in the US per year, so, it is doing a pretty good job at it. Nearly ten times better than guns.

How about tobacco then?

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If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Well played

This is a nice law.
A Florida Man Turned His Front Yard Into a Shooting Range — and That’s Perfectly Legal

Ken

I don't think it's confined to the USA--it's just in our face here because of overwhelming media. I think the family breakdown is prevalent throughout western society at a epidemic level. Now when you go to places like Vietnam i've found they still value and revere family. Very odd. Can't explain it. But i personally think--as Tony points out--it's a big contributing factor to the anger and alienation that drives a lot of these killings

IMO

/r

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Steve

So you see this as a problem that can be solved by gun control/reform. I would remove gun control from the discussion (not this discussion, but the greater discussion taking place) and instead focus on how to prevent this from happening from a security standpoint (accepting that the guns are out there and not going anywhere).

In the broader context, it's very hard to take any politician seriously on this subject as whenever these shooting happen, they all rush to condemn the evil AR weapon and the need for an assault weapons ban (Diane F. has hers ready to go, she tweeted about it), but very little is ever said about handguns which account overwhelmingly for the gun deaths in this country.

It is happening throughout the the Northeast AND in mid-Atlantic states, AND the left coast, AND many urban areas in otherwise red states. Gun ownership is plummeting in virtually all blue areas, and only holding steady in red areas.The laws will follow those trends. Judging from my facebook feed, these opposing trends are going to accelerate, and will certainly cause major changes by the time my grandkids reach my age. Firearm deaths track gun ownership extremely closely, and twisting and ignoring that fact is frankly alienating most folks in the major population centers of this country.

So, is he hurting himself or others by doing that? And is he on his private property?

I know private property rights are an alien concept to much of the world (and wonder of wonders, we here in the US still allow private property owners to control the mineral and water rights on their land, to a large extent -- though California's a bit iffy on that, when it comes to water, of course ;-), but they're still in effect in the US.

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

https://www.vox.com/2015/10/3/9444417/gun-violence-united-states-america




https://yaleglobal.yale.edu/content/out-wedlock-births-rise-worldwide

Yet alone in the US is there an epidemic level of gun violence (and mass killings in general). So why does this breakdown lead to mass killings in the US and not elsewhere?

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"Go yell at an M&M"

you know, if he is not going to get banned for his vile statements (and I'm not necessarily advocating he should be), and he's not going to back up and apologize for them (which I am advocating he should), then I would advocate you don't legitimize his posting to himself presence here.

Just my 2 cents

there are plenty of other people on the other side of your argument here to engage with. I am enjoying the intellectual give and take on a tough issue.

i think this is precisely the discussion. the legal "remedies" i've listed in this thread do not include in any way limiting the number of guns you own. they do include keying your guns to you; and they include a ban on guns and ammunition that are designed to destroy human life. (if you don't want to hunt with a round that destroys animal flesh, why do you want that round to destroy human flesh?)

yes, it's true, some of what i'm advocating is going to inconvenience you. i think you have to decide between your inconvenience (you can't buy hollowpoints) in order to not have a societal moodswing that forecloses on many more of your current rights.

would you rather live on a street on which none of your neighbors owned guns? or on a street where all your neighbors owned 15 guns, including "tactical" weapons and devices, and armor piercing bullets or hollowpoints? mind, you have no say-so on who those neighbors are. it's just your garden variety AR-15 owners. how comfortable are you that none are of the nut variety?

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

i'm no expert. i just think ammo designed to inflict max damage on flesh is a problem. i don't think the rounds they're shooting in winter biathlon are designed to tumble once inside my body.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Good find.

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Books @ Amazon
"If only he had used his genius for niceness, instead of Evil." M. Smart

You're seriously defending this idiot's right to fire rounds on a range he built in his front yard in a residential neighbourhood?

Legal or not, that's the kind of dismissive attitude that might make people think you're not really serious about entertaining any discussion around "common-sense gun laws", because this situation certainly doesn't scream "common-sense".

i applaud your ardency. but not the implications of your speech. i don't think anyone here is happy that our country's children are getting killed. even those of us in the US who advocate for legislative remedies recognize that those on the other side hold their views on goodwill.

please recognize that. what i value most on this forum is civility toward each other, not advocacy of a particular political position.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

of course you know that the hollow point boat tail bullet (yes bullet) has superior ballistics relative to a solid tip projectile? it carries further and truer. It's that physics shit. Nothing to do with rendering flesh (human, deer, elk, moose (sorry BLEP), etc.

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Steve