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I think Howard Kurtz has a realistic take; here's excerpts of an excerpt from his new book:
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"Donald Trump is staking his presidency, as he did his election, on nothing less than destroying the credibility of the news media; and the media are determined to do the same to him. This is not just a feud or a fight or a battle. It is scorched-earth warfare in which only one side can achieve victory. To a stunning degree, the press is falling into the president's trap. The country's top news organizations have targeted Trump with an unprecedented barrage of negative stories, with some no longer making much attempt to hide their contempt. Some stories are legitimate, some are not, and others are generated by the president's own falsehoods and exaggerations. But the mainstream media, subconsciously at first, has lurched into the opposition camp and is appealing to an anti-Trump base of viewers and readers, failing to grasp how deeply it is distrusted by a wide swath of the country."
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"This is, at bottom, a battle over the truth. Who owns it, who controls it, who can sell their version to a polarized public that increasingly cannot agree on basic facts. Everything you read, hear and see about Trump's veracity is filtered through a mainstream media prism that reflects a lying president — and virtually never considers the press' own baggage and biases. Everything you read, hear and see from the Trump team is premised on the view that media news is fake news, that journalists are too prejudiced, angry and ideological to fairly report on the president. Trump and his acolytes use these attacks on the Fourth Estate to neutralize their own untruths, evasions and exaggerations. What many journalists fail to grasp is that Trump's supporters love his street talk and view the media critiques as nonsense driven by negativity. They don't care if he makes mistakes. As paradoxical as it sounds, negative coverage helps Trump because it bonds him to people who also feel disrespected by the denizens of the mainstream press. The media take everything literally, and Trump pitches his arguments at a gut level. It is asymmetrical warfare."
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https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/how-trump-trauma-is-crippling-news-media-guest-column-1077062

Get the whole story on that Krugman statement, why don't you?

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"Go yell at an M&M"

The Krugman statement I referenced contains no links to additional information or stories. Was there a retraction or corrective statement issued?

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

You have a very low standard for 'classic'.

Now classic would have been Trump including his own fake Time cover, his own fake historical marker, Obama wiretapping him claims, Obama not being born in the US, his physical results, ...

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

I largely agree with Kurtz' analysis and have read other similar opinions, or perhaps summaries of his analysis.

Trump is using the only strategy available to survive against a media out to take him down.

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

wasn't it just recently proven and the investigation is still on going that yes members of his campaign were in fact wire tapped due to the recent abuse of the FISA warrants based of the fake dossier.

Yes, within days, Krugman retracted what he said.

https://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/the-long-haul

An interesting prediction he made above, in light of the situation in Puerto Rico:

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"Go yell at an M&M"

I'll add that the kerfuffle about his physical is another thing lumped in the "fake news" category by Trump's supporters (using that term colloquially as it is understood by Trump supporters). I did not read the thread here about Trump's physical. I can't imagine learning anything.

I think the common sense view is that Trump is 71, people of that age can suffer sudden unpredictable ailments so there is not guarantee about his health. He is overweight. Yet he campaigned tirelessly making an order of magnitude more campaign appearances and press appearances than Hillary and his stamina always looked good. So when the liberal pundits go off on the physical thing, I just roll my eyes.

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

The kerfuffle didn't have anything to do with his health, it was about him lying about his health.

I pretty much roll my eyes at all of the non- issue, over the top things they bring up.

Thank you for that. Good for Krugman. Still should not have gotten past the editor.

Yet still good on Trump for calling Krugman out. He did write it, and the NY Times did publish it, and that is itself a fair point to make. Especially since a common theme against him is that he acts irrationally (he does, everyone does, and Trump does it much less than commonly thought).

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

OK. I'll play. I ignored this because I assumed that this was just another one of the over the top things that get brought up. Like the WaPo article that recently said he was lying to everyone in the televised White House meeting with congress a couple weeks ago. That lie was saying "great idea" or some such pleasantry to everyone who spoke. It was a lie because he heard things he disagreed with and still said "great idea." Really. I did read that. Someone here linked to it and it was a supposedly intelligent WaPo pundit. Take my word for it, it is so stupid that I will not bother to find a link.

So I'll guess here without reading the thread and seeing maybe one article on the subject. Trump said his health was "great" or "super" or some other superlative. Maybe he said he was "a little overweight."

Is there more? Is there a great deception that Trump has foisted on the poor America public about his health? Is there something important I need to know about his health?

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

The non-kerfuffle kerfuffle is that he claims to be 6'3" and 239 lbs which magically gets him to a BMI of 29.9.

He has always been listed at 6'2" and appears to be the same height or shorter than the 6'1" Obama. And many people in the 239 range have doubts about that.

It isn't that he is fat or short. It is that he feels the need to force an admiral to lie about it.

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

Get past the editor? It was an *opinion* piece. Should the editor have said, "no, Dr. Krugman, you are not entitled to an opinion about the effects of this election on the economy, in spite of your Nobel Prize in Economic Sciences?"

Krugman has been correct far more than he's been wrong.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

Are you serious? No one reads those opinion pieces before they are published?


That would have been better than nothing. Assuming the editor had better tact, perhaps, "Paul, I am in no position to question your economic views, but we are all very emotional about this election, and I wonder if a prediction about the markets and economy ought to wait a few days."

Krugman admitted he was hasty a few days later. Are you saying he is so hard-headed that he would not have listened to a voice of reason earlier?

I respect Krugman more knowing that he changed his mind.

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

I'd be interested to see something that says what you have just stated.

I believe Manafort was caught up in wiretaps and has also been charged with crimes causing him to learn how to sing.

I'm pretty sure that Trump's claim was that Obama was spying on his campaign for political gain and not that some of his campaign officials were caught up in criminal investigations and therefore caught on wiretaps.

If there is more along the lines of what you have stated feel free to correct me. As long as those stories are not themselves fake news of course.

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

I'm pretty sure that's not how opinion pieces by staff columnists are vetted.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

No way. Really? Did this occupy time of the talking heads on TV? Did liberal pundits editorialize about this? No wonder people are calling it fakenews and tuning out.

When the opposition talks about him instead of his policies and the policy actions his agencies are taking, he wins.

Meanwhile, last Friday he addressed the March for Life in Washington via video. First president to do that. Well done speech. He's got the pro life crowd locked up. He's locking up many other constituencies too. He's a little embarrassing but he is fulfilling his promises. His base will be stronger when he is up for re-election. If the economy stays good, he'll be re-elected easily.

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

   Krugman is wrong on most everything right now, owing to the fact that he is a partisan first, and economist second. He's been repeatedly wrong about the market under Trump, wrong about who or what type of fed chair Trump would pick, etc. He reliably gives a center-left to left readership what they want, which is why he is still a great fit at the NYT.

Ok, from now on, I'll take every "climate change" prediction from the "experts" as an opinion.

Referring back to the earlier point about what is 'fake' or not, you seem to be dismissing the basic value of objective facts vs subjective opinions.

Again, it's not his health that's in question, it's the fact that he and his supporters are intentionally and specifically lying about clearly measurable and consistent facts like height ~ not simply different interpretations of disputable/aggregated measures like economic indicators or crime stats which can be parsed any number of ways.

So if I claim to have run a 2:45 marathon, are the actual race results showing I really ran a 4:15 just more fake news? Shit, why can't I go ahead and claim to be a sub-9 IMer too while I'm at it? (other than invoking the wrath of BLeP for contaminating the LR w/ Tri jibberish.) Hell, we could keep going... VW shoulda told everyone to fuck off w/ that recall noise and just claim the reports of fraudulent diesel emissions test results were fake, too. Why wouldn't you believe VW instead of the mainstream media reporting?

You say we should really be focused on policy positions instead, which sounds well and good, but again the point is that if he can't even admit/agree the sky is blue, what are the chances his claims about larger/more complex issues aren't entirely full of shit?

When asked if he knew that the market was up in the wake of Trump's election, he said, "I actually do not know that. But I imagine that is the case."

Yeah, you do that.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

I take it you believe in the predictive ability of climate models to tell us the temperature of the earth decades from now, more than the predictive ability of economic models to say whether or not the market will collapse in a few days?

Please explain how climate models are so much better.

Or are you admitting that Krugman is a partisan hack that should never be referenced again.

What planet are you from? Name me one current or former politician in Washington whom you contend has not lied.

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It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev