I'm thinking about SavageMan next year b/c of the aqua bike. Any advice on where to stay?

This was my second triathlon. The venue is amazing. The difficulty is extreme. It was a lot of fun. There were so many volunteers, so many traffic cops, it was so well organized. Amazing race. I hope I can do it again in the future. The wall was fun and is not a gimmick, but people shouldn't overlook the difficulty and grade of some of the other climbs. Even big savage mountain had some steep sections that cannot be replicated where I live. I hope it survives and more people do this race.

My only regret is I didn't know we were allowed to climb and slide down Thomas the turtle on the swim. I have unfinished business with Thomas. I will be back...



We stayed at the "The Inn". It is on the other side of the lake and a very short couple miles to get to the event site. I rode my bike to packet pickup and the meeting the evening before, no problems.

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"If it costs you 30 minutes at Maryland so what" -dwreal

Toefuzz wrote:

I'm thinking about SavageMan next year b/c of the aqua bike. Any advice on where to stay?

Suites at Silver Tree is a good option. Right across the lake from the event. Technically, you could watch the swim from there. Less than 5 min drive.

If you have a big group, VRBO is a possibility. Lots of choices.

We've done both.

https://suitesatsilvertree.com/

I stayed at the Carmel Cove b and b. It was a five minute drive to the venue.

Seems odd that the Extreme Tri's seem to have taken off in the last couple years while Savageman numbers are in a downward spiral. I think Savageman fits into the same niche as the X-Tris, but there's a gap in the way the race is currently marketed. Need to find a way to plug into that space and attract people interested in more than a new PR on a flat course.

I've done it three times and have always stayed in Frostburg. Its about a 30 minute drive from transition and there's never been any issue with getting to or from the venue. (Specific recommendation would be the Hampton Inn on New Georges Creek Road)

Seriously? They need to add this to the athlete guide. I wasn't sure I was going to do Savageman again next year, but this seals it, I will be.

Silly kids. If they put a ladder and a slide on it, do you really need more invitation than that?

Make it a 70.3...........and not just the distance but the (IM) brand & it would flourish.

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

I suspect it probably would. And I imagine WTC could probably get away with putting an extreme 70.3 on their calendar. Obviously that's not for everyone and it would never be WTC's bread and butter, but I think they could get away with going all-in with a single extreme race as a one-off alternative to their portfolio primarily of as-easy-as-can-be-designed options.

I won't go into all the reasons that this can't and won't happen, but suffice it to say there are many, and it can't and won't. And I have relinquished all say in the matter anyway, so it's moot.

But, as I sat atop Maynardier Ridge on Sunday and cheered the riders coming by at 4mph one by one on a gorgeous fall day with leaves in color and falling around, every rider with a smile on their face and kind words to say, and as my kids jumped on their stomp rocket launchers sending them over the heads of riders as "fireworks", all I could think was that more triathletes needed to experience this. This was the last hard hill of the ride and we saw literally nothing but smiles and cheeriness, even from those cramping up, paperboying in order to keep moving, and even from a few resorting to walking. I hate pretty much everything about WTC, but if WTC were the answer to getting people out there to experience that, then I'd be all for it.

Sunday was my first time at Savageman, my second half.

I really liked the course. It was as tough as I expected it to be. I wish I would have done a bit better with nutrition on the bike so I would have had a better run. But I made it up the wall and finished in less than 8.

I'd really hate to see the race go away. I didn't realize it was in danger of that. When I went into and even somewhat now, it was a one time race for me. I definitely will try and talk other friends into doing the race next year. And my buddy who did it with me this year nearly has me agreeing to the 30 and spectate on Sunday. With doing a full the month before, we'll see...

Odd, its been a few years, but i don't remember smiling when going up Maynardier. I may even have had some unkind thoughts concerning the race director :-) To be fair, Kyle gave me great advice on how to get up the Westernport stuff. But nobody told me anything about Maynardier.

If i ever train for triathlons again. I would love to go back. it is a beautiful venue and one of the best organised races and most fun anywhere.

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run well, run happy
george

I guess I'm partially to blame. I raced Savageman in 2010 and 2014. I love the race, but have been slacking off this year.

I'm also wondering whether it could go the Norseman/Celt/Swiss extreme route. Maybe the run is too easy? Is there a nearby mountain that could be added for the finish? What happens if you keep going up the gravel road at the turnaround on the run? Finish on top of the Thayerville lookout tower? How high is that above the lake?

Hey Kyle!

I agree with all of the above reasons, so many people are just all about the M-dot and lame flat races.

I was very bummed to not be able to race this year, but they still got my money as I was hoping up until the last minute that I would recover enough from my MTB crash to keep my Savageman brick streak alive. At least Lisa raced this year to keep the family name up there!

I'm still a bit bummed though with the thinner crowds and spectators the race does not have quite the same vibe. The swan boat has been gone for a few years, and the VTS-MTS Facebook page said this was the last year for Thomas the Turn Around Turtle. That is an outrage! You never see that sort of thing at WTC races! (I have also never seen things like Westernport Wall devils, Savage Mountain Sasquatches, or Killer Miller Angels at other races.)

Savageman just makes all other races seem so bland.

This about sums up why my buddy says people are dumb--he said if WTC took over the race and put a M-dot on it the race would probably sell out..

I really wouldn't want to see this as a M-dot race but I want to see it continue. The more that I've thought about this over the last few days I can't help but feeling like I HAVE to sign-up for this race--but why does this race HAVE to rely on the same people coming back each year in order for it to survive (that's the message earlier in these posts)?? I don't know of any other races that have to have the same people come back every year or they disappear so why is that the case with SavageMan??

I guess the bottom line is if it is still around for '18 it will be my 'travel' race and my goal race for the season..... And no it won't be a HIM PR!!!!

I'll add to the SavageMan praise - it was my first time racing it this year, and I loved it! My only regret is not knowing about the ladder and slide on Thomas the Turnaround Turtle. The run put me in some pain, but the bike course is one of the most stunning I've ever ridden on. If the race is back next year, I plan to be in it. If it's not back, I'll cry. Which I never did on the course.

Careful what we wish for! You can definitely go to the top of Meadow Mountain via the Fire Road or other trails that were just built/improved. In fact Savageman v1.0 went to the top twice on the run. This was pre Killer Miller so I guess Kyle felt a little bit of sympathy and took that away when he added Miller Rd.

It is interesting reading and experiencing Savageman Participation versus Mdot participation. Perhaps I just have blinders on or maybe it's the same polls that had Hillary winning 2016 but here is my take away:

Ironman 70.3 are mostly boring draftfests that cost way to much to enter but are very well ran events=High Participation
Savageman and similar are awesome courses with zero drafting at a much lower course=Dwindling Participation

This is in no way a knock on the Mdot races. I've done them and enjoyed them. They are just my version of Walmart and Savageman is like the local Hardware Store. Who doesn't love their local Hardware Store!

I'm still hurting after Sunday. I'll be back for brick 4 next year. You can learn a lot about yourself at a race like this.

It stinks you couldn't keep your brick streak going. The number of people with bricks every year has now plummeted from 6 to 3 this year.

In my opinion what made SavageMan special and unique is the following:

• A great venue
• A great course
• Extreme challenge
• Enthusiastic promotion, marketing, word-of-mouth "virality" (and this includes the Bricks in the Westernport Wall - that is just marketing, right?)
• Being "weird", different, fun - aka Swan Boat, Turnaround Turtle, Devils, Angels, Sasquatch, Funny / self-deprecating signs

The first three haven't changed. The last two have. In many ways I am sympathetic to VTSMTS. They run events every weekend and were never going to continue much/all of the "weirdness"; that was inevitable, and frankly never was sustainable when I was in charge.

But, I do think they've dropped the ball on the promotion of the event. Now it's just an event in their calendar. All grassroots, word-of-mouth virality of the event has disappeared. I used to stage literally 20+ amateur photographers on course and would crowdsource bib-tagging the photos when complete, and every athlete had many dozens to hundreds of free photos of themselves all over that gorgeous course watermarked with SAVAGEMAN that they would spread around on social media. That's marketing. No longer.

There used to be a great website with videos and endless scrolling of incredible photos and endless testimonials, all of which just screamed "I MUST DO THIS RACE" to whoever was looking. No longer. They just have a website of all their events and a page of critical details for each.

We used to promote the shit out of getting people to Westernport to turn that into a Roth Solenberg like scene. We sent 8 buses of fans/family down there for free to turn that into a huge, boisterous crowd. That investment pays back. No longer. Now Westernport's a ghost town and if there is a bus to get down there no one would ever know it.

We used to work hard to get people there to increase the virality in future years. Running competitions like Club Challenges, Collegiate Competitions, reaching out to influential people and clubs to get them there, knowing they would enjoy it and bring many back in subsequent years. That doesn't happen by itself. The days of big groups coming down from Canada and NYC region and New England are long gone.

I'm sympathetic that it's hard as hell to keep doing what needs to be done year after year, and indeed, I couldn't/wouldn't keep it up which is why VTSMTS has it. But I also think they just treat the race like every other anonymous race they have in their stable and the result of this is becoming apparent. They've relied on SavageMan remaining great because it's a great course in a great venue and an extreme challenge, but that's obviously not enough.

Those are all reasons I have been in Deep Creek every September since 2011. I remember watching Dave Scott race, which was great. I would think if the weekend is profitable for VTSMTS then the race would stick around. Abandoning this venue would be a mistake. In my opinion, the charity helped draw people years ago and that's gone. I should be able to sign up for the race now with a big discount, but I can't. Those legends should have their own wave start. Why isn't the race sponsored? Savageman brought to you by_______? Maybe another company may purchase the race and get back to the basics.

I didn't realize that was you and your family. I loved the stomp rocket.

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"If it costs you 30 minutes at Maryland so what" -dwreal

They put together a hell of a recap video - and quickly, too. Now they just need to get it so it's seen far and wide!

https://www.facebook.com/...eos/865970566910781/

Nice video. My kids are in the Conga line with the guy in the weird outfit at the end. My family had a fun day at the park. Beautiful weather.

I think you and the family were just getting there when I started up Maynardier. I don't think the rockets were set up yet. But I did see you there.

It's funny you posted this I just saw this video and was very impressed by it--BUT you are right--they need to get it out there--far and wide--everyone needs to see it--that was exactly what I thought while I was watching it.

I think you hit on a bunch of good points above about what it takes to draw people to this EVENT--it's not just a race, it's not just another race on a companies calendar-it's an EVENT! To draw the crowds from more than 2 hours away (which Deep Creek isn't exactly only 1 hr away from DC or NY or Philly) it needs to be promoted-the venue needs to be promoted as an EVENT. Other races can survive off bucket list type racers but it's because of the promotion and draw of the EVENT--SavageMan needs to get that back... Some just want flat, fast PR courses...in other words boring/I have no idea what the scenery looked like courses!