It's a great course. Not too hilly not too flat. Not too many cars.

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"And so, my fellow Americans: ask not what your country can do for you--ask what you can do for your country" JFK - Replace 'country' with the company you work for, friends, family, and strangers and the world will be a much better place.

i was gonna make it my first half, but i heard that they let way to many people in the race, and that it can be a zoo, expecially the swim

"it can be a zoo, expecially the swim "

Not true at all. The most calm swim of any half I have done.

Dave

It was my first half some years ago and I'm heading back this year. Best swim, most scenic bike and the run is always painful no matter where you are.

Can't speak to the crowds. I've done the full Vineman a few years ago, and that always draws much smaller crowds but the course is the same (just two loops of everything, obviously).

The swim is great. Very calm water. it's in a river, but the dam blocks almost all the current and it feels like a lake swim.

Bike is very scenic. Lots of rollers. You need to watch your power output on the hills. They're gentle enough that you'll be tempted to muscle them and you'll pay the price for it. Pacing and good power management is key. There are a few patches of rough pavement (at least there were were a few years ago- don't know if they've since been repaired) but mostly a great bike course.

Run will just hurt. Not too much shade but GREAT support.

All in all, I'd definitely recommend this race. The course, organization and volunteers are first rate.

Great race to be your first. Tough but fair course. Great post race BBQ. RD runs the race very well. Only drawback is; it is not a family friendly race (obviously this does not apply for everyone). So once my kids get older, I will be going to this race again. Or go back and leave the wife and kids at home.

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"No one ever told me they made black fondant!" - Duff Goldman

This was my first half. It was an awesome race, very scenic bike ride.
The swim was not hectic at all. There is no mass start, they send people off in waves.
I'm doing this race again this year beause I had so much fun last year.

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"I ran. I ran until my muscles burned and my veins pumped battery acid. Then I ran some more. "

I'll echo Dave's comments in that the swim is anything but a zoo. With a bazillion wave starts each one is very, very manageable. Race management and officials do an awesome job with this event and it's hard to beat the area where it's held.

A+ event in my book. Large race, yes...but you hardly ever feel it, if that makes sense.

[reply]i was gonna make it my first half, but i heard that they let way to many people in the race, and that it can be a zoo, expecially the swim[/reply]

Obviously, you've never done the race, or any M-dot race for that matter. Go ahead and prove me wrong though, I'm sure it'll make you feel better.

From experience of participating in this event 3 times: If you think this swim is a zoo you probably think a decent masters practice is a zoo too. The race goes in waves with I believe a more than a minute between them. Actually, I think it's 5 minutes. The race is closed once it reaches capacity, then a wait list is used to fill for people who hurt themselves or come upon circumstances of life and they have to throw in the towel. No over-selling here.

I did Vineman last year as my first half. 25-29 AG. It was a long day for me, but that's a different story.

The swim was really pretty easy, and there wasn't a tremendous amount of flailing in my AG.

The bike course is rolly but fast (for everyone else). I didn't realize I'd gone over Chalk hill until I came into town so I wouldn't stress about climbing. T1 and T2 are separate and being slow I wasn't the first into transition. I lost roughly 15 minutes trying to find my shoes. When I did find them there were three bikes racked on top of one another on top of my shoes.

Then the run was really nice and rolly again. I totally fell apart, but if I'd been prepared, it would've been a great day. The support on the course was excellent.

The only thing I didn't like was the separate transition areas. I would definitely recommend it as a friendly race and it's SO pretty in Sonoma County. Make a week's vacation of it.

TriHive.com recently interviewed Vineman RD, Dave Latourette. Go to

http://www.trihive.com/thradio/TH_Vineman.mp3



Alex M.

Thanks for the support folks ... one of Russ' biggest things is having sensible waves seperated by 8 minutes to spread the race out and limit drafting opportunity as much as possible. We also rotate the waves around every year so a given age group isn't racing first or last every year.

Swim waves have no more than 150 people in them usually quite less ... the last 3 years we have started less than 2000 athletes (over 18 swim waves) and we will not go over that.

My Best ...

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

I can email the bike course profile if you'd like it.

dave@vineman.com

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

Like everyone mentions, you must have been misinformed about the swim. Excellent race. My favorite race actually.

clm, 7x HVM finisher

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

I have to agree that 1/2 Vineman is a top-notch race. I raced there in 2004. It was a well-run race. The bike course is challenging with a rolling hills that can be technical at times and very scenic. The run course is rolling too. I thought the swim was great. Calm water and I wasn't at all trampled (good for your first 1.2 mile swim in open water).

The only thing that I did not like about it, and this is a minor thing, was that the swim-bike transition and the bike-run/finish area are in two different locations that require you to take a bus from the finish back to the start (and they don't let you take the bike on the bus). So I ended up having to drive back to the finish to pick up my bike; however, if I planned better, I could have probably gotten around this one.

I would definitely recommend it for your first 1/2.

--Wheeze

wow, great replys. I stand corrected, the guy who i talked to must not have known what he was talking about. Based on what i read i went and registered yesterday!!

thanks

What's the best airport to use? Was thinking about doing HVM this year...

SFO or OAK.

About a 1.5 hour drive, unless you leave noon or later on a Friday, then it's 2+ with all the traffic.

clm

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

Agreed w/ CLM ... get a flight that puts you in the airport as early as you can! Friday northbound 101 traffic starting mid-afternoon is a BEAR!

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

My only complaint, and it's not a real complaint, is at the finish line there is a clock with the elapsed time of the race. If you started in a later wave your finisher photo will show a different time then your actual race time.

I also wanted to say thanks to Dave's 1/2 Vineman training program. Last years race was my first triathlon, and following his training program I was able to really well (in my own opinion).

I'm already signed up for this year's race; I can't wait.

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"I ran. I ran until my muscles burned and my veins pumped battery acid. Then I ran some more. "

And there is a new pub within walking distance of finish line in the "old/new" downtown Windsor. It is called Patterson's Pub and is on north end of the Town Green. Great draft beer selection and pretty good food. Also a new retro diner type that recently opened as well as pretty good thai, mexican and high end Cal cousine place at the Green. Keeps growing every year.

We will have to do another ST get together before the race.

Wow! Great news!!! And yes, let me know and once this ($*%&%$* rain quits, I'll come up on a Sat/Sun.

clm

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

Last year's Vineman was my first half, actually my first ever tri, and I have to say that I had a great time and thought they put on a really organized race. Especially after comparing it to other tris I've done since.

The swim is really easy with no stress because the water isn't very deep and the you are never very far from the riverbank. I think this is the perfect first tri for anybody that may have any open water issues.

In my opinion, the only two things that may potentially be issues are that the transitions are in different places so it's a little more complicated to set up your stuff, but not that big of a deal, and the fact that it can potentially be very, very warm, i.e. in the 100s. Even with those issues, I really think it was a great race and will be back this year.

I did it last year and thought it was a great race. I am a BOP swimmer but thought the river swim was fun. (and loads of room) I'll definately be back to do it again at some stage.

When does this race usually sell out?

...and when does Barb's Race (which I understand is on the same course) sell out?

thanks.

[reply]When does this race usually sell out?

...and when does Barb's Race (which I understand is on the same course) sell out?

thanks.[/reply]

HVM usually sells out by now, right Dave?

Barb's==you can enter right up to the day, unless they start to limit the field

clm

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

Oleander ... the last 3 years we have sold out by the end of April and our numbers are almost identical to years past. Our next price bump hits on May 1 and that usually closes things out as folks want to get in under that next price bump.

Barb's Race is same swim & bike course, different T2 (will save about 5min) and slightly different run course. OH ... Barbs race will not sell out!

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

You gonna do an award for the fastest HVM/Barb's double this year???? ;-)

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

You know ... it would be fun to do that! We have talked about doing a fastest double for that AND the 70.3 / Full double too!

Did you see the revised bike course? We are trying to tweak the end of the bike course to get rid of some bad pavement on Faught & safer intersections (trying to get away from airprot - old redwood 4 way)

Also ... i did some investigating the other day and maybe can make a couple tweaks on La Crema property to get the run spot on 13.1 instead of 13.3 ;)

Cheers ...

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

Did the bike course change effect the elevation much?

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"And so, my fellow Americans: ask not what your country can do for you--ask what you can do for your country" JFK - Replace 'country' with the company you work for, friends, family, and strangers and the world will be a much better place.

What if you turned right at the horse park off Faught (where there is an aid station for the full/Barb's)? That would be an easier crossing of ORHwy, but maybe still need to ride on it a little bit. Paul and I came a different way a few times, but I don't remember street names.

And yeah, if you do the double...I'm all over that!!

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

The change we made between Geyserville and Hwy 128 (Jimtown) because of the bridge lost in flooding does not really change the profile (little longer) but there will be a REAL fast section on Alexander Valley Rd headed down to Jimtown (nice pavement & downhill) ... the change @ Shiloh will put us on better roads and safer intersections (Shiloh is slightly downhill on smooth pavement)

Again ... these are proposed changes assuming county / city permits are approved.

NOTE: because of the bridge detour this year we will be closer to 57m for the bike course. No way around it, it's the only safe route back to HWY 128. Next year we hope to be back to normal w/ just the slight changes @ Shiloh Rd .. that will put us spot on 56

Cheers ...

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

Cool, I hope it happens. I like fast!

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"And so, my fellow Americans: ask not what your country can do for you--ask what you can do for your country" JFK - Replace 'country' with the company you work for, friends, family, and strangers and the world will be a much better place.

That's where we are turning to tweak things ... right on Shiloh Rd, left on Old Redwood, Rt on Fulton, Rt on Airport ... better pavement, safer ... now we are hoping everyone approves it! We'll hope to keep that long term and next year be back on 128 in geyserville as normal.

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

[reply]That's where we are turning to tweak things ... right on Shiloh Rd, left on Old Redwood, Rt on Faught, Rt on Airport ... better pavement, safer ... now we are hoping everyone approves it! We'll hope to keep that long term and next year be back on 128 in geyserville as normal.[/reply]

OK I am with you until you get to the right on Faught off Old Red...how do you do that? Do you really mean Faught to Shiloh to Old Red to Airport? I am amazed they will let you use the Shiloh, Old Red intersection as that is a busy area with the shopping area near there. It would be much better though and the section down Shiloh will be FAST, albeit short.

It's a an outstanding race. I did the full IM and the half back in the early days.

It goes with out saying that the wine tasting/sampling/buying options in the area are also outstanding.

Fleck

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Sorry Mike i meant Rt on FULTON ... the Old redwood / Shiloh intersection is signficantly less busy than Old Redwood / Airport. (CHP really dislikes that intersection) Our main reasons for changing things there: \

Bad pavement on Faught (safety), safer 4 -way intersection (mentioned above), nice shoulder on ORedwood (safer and can be coned off), safer to make RT turns on Fulton & Airport (both coned w/ shoulders), we eliminate the 4-way @ Airport/Fulton and make a Rt turn (safer) by approaching it this way.

It's a much better traffic control situation by far and safer by far! The glitch we see will be Windsor wanting to deal w/ the Shiloh / Old Redwood ... we know the CHP woul rather have that intersection than the Airport / Old Redwood.

You live in Windsor?

Hope you are well ...

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

I'm curious - people who have done both the 1/2 Vineman and Barb's Race, how did the experience differ? Which one is your preference and why? (Note - I am not out to qualify for Kona or anything so that part of Vineman I don't care about.)

[reply]Sorry Mike i meant Rt on FULTON ... the Old redwood / Shiloh intersection is signficantly less busy than Old Redwood / Airport. (CHP really dislikes that intersection) Our main reasons for changing things there: \

Bad pavement on Faught (safety), safer 4 -way intersection (mentioned above), nice shoulder on ORedwood (safer and can be coned off), safer to make RT turns on Fulton & Airport (both coned w/ shoulders), we eliminate the 4-way @ Airport/Fulton and make a Rt turn (safer) by approaching it this way.

It's a much better traffic control situation by far and safer by far! The glitch we see will be Windsor wanting to deal w/ the Shiloh / Old Redwood ... we know the CHP woul rather have that intersection than the Airport / Old Redwood.

You live in Windsor?

Hope you are well ...[/reply]

Yep...right near Old Red and Shiloh so my kids will nearly be able to see me go by from their bedrooms upstairs. This change does sound much better. I hated that bumpy section of Faught near the end when you are tired.

This will be a great question for CLM!

BUT, from my standpoint being invlolved w/ the race ... the course is virtually the same, Barb's will be lower entry fee, seem more laid back, less people, can be less intimidating, fun to have the Full Vineman Athletes starting ahead of you, Barbs race may be logistically easier for you becasue there are less athletes. Athlete's in both races (Barb's 70.3) are provided the same amenities etc. ... the 70.3 will have more pre-race "hype". I think it depends on what you are looking for in a race.

Hope that helps ...

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

Both are good.

Swim: same


T1: much less crowded for Barb's


Bike: same now that there is no out/back over the Wohler Bridge


T2: easier for Barb's since it's shorter and there is not the run on the dirt/grass to the football field


R: I like the one big loop run of HVM better I think, though it can be hot out by La Crema. I dislike loops and Barb's has 1.5, thankfully we don't have to run up that big hill twice.

Other:

HVM: I HATE having to start in a later wave as the food is gone, the porta potties are generally so full you can't use them at the finish and by the time you go back to get the car at the river, it's just a long darned day, and it can get hot. Starting early is good (like this year!) Of course that means the temps will never go over 75F all day long.

Barb's: More of a "feel good" vibe. Lots of gals are doing their first HIM distance and it's a great race for that. All the top 20 dudes in the Full are always very supportive on the run too, shouting out encouragement. That said, when you have to start in the later Barb's waves (STORY OF MY LIFE!), and then you pass a lot of gals on the bike, there is less adherence to the rules. Lots of blocking, since many people are riding side by side and chatting. I'm not the fastest, but when I race, I RACE (irregardless of speed). At least Russ put a stop to the personal pacing on the run. Two things that are my personal peeves. There is also the dilemma of racing AG or Athena. Last year I raced AG, but if I'd raced Athena, I'd have won wine. ;-)

So, you do like me and race both!

clm

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

[reply]We also rotate the waves around every year so a given age group isn't racing first or last every year.[/reply]

I just love that part.. gives us old guys a chance at uncluttered roads on the bike, once in a while.

I had 5 flat tires last year and still thought it was a great race so hopefully that tells you something =)