Wow.

They have regained some of my respect.

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This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time. - Fight Club
Industry Brat.

nah

if this was to "free up" the spots tied up by people that register for multiple events and then only do one then WHY NOT GIVE REFUNDS OR TRANSFERS!!!???!!!???

"If you guys think we're wrong... we're wrong."

I'm impressed.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

What's it say, I can't see movies at work...

FF

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To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target.

If they would allow transfer of entry, this would also help. Just my .02

Why do they care if people register for multiple events, but only compete in one...they still get the money?

Basically said that you guys caught us with our hands too deep in the cookie jar and we are sorry..no hard feelings, right?

Paraphrasing:

The bad feedback they got on their facebook and in their e-mail indicated people did not like/agree with the program. Based on that- they are changing it.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Gotta give WTC props on this one. Thank you for listening Brad. I for one am impressed.

Carp - I guess that means I have to race this weekend after all!

Milka Whaaaaaaa?

Now what?

WTC events back on everyone's schedule again...or do you still need to just PUNISH them! Yeah.

I don't believe he said canceled... well yes for the original plan. He made it sound they were going to regroup and roll it out again with better perks and a better price point... at least that's what I got from the video.

acknowledged.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Ben Fertic and WTC:
Thank you. This was the right move. Gutsy but right.

I got that they were refunding the money, so it me it sounds like the program is kaput? Admittedly, just for now and in its current iteration. But wow, what an about face!

Maybe Lance didn't like the program.

He seemed o-so sincere about his apology. Either the guy has the personality of a dumptruck, or he was freaking pissed off at having to do that!

Thank you for listening Brad.

His name is Ben! Ben Fertic.

I was on the fence on this one. For certain people - it would have been an advantage and for all others, it would have meant no change at all!

This has been more a demonstration in the swiftness and power of internet social networking than anything else.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Yup! Spin doctors at work...

Fuck, I just spent $40 on posterboard and markers for signs to boycott Calif. 70.3 next spring.

I think they deserve credit for being responsive.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

In some bizarre sort of way, I'm not impressed. This concession makes their behavior look like nothing more than shameless profiteering. While that is undoubtedly the case, if they had simply stuck with the program then they could have made money hand over fist and disguised it as a smart business tactic in a high-demand marketplace. But they're business folks. Maybe their cost/benefit analysis revealed that playing the evil-to-compassionate card would produce greater gains over the long term.

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"The right to party is a battle we have fought, but we'll surrender and go Amish... NOT!" -Wayne Campbell

Exactly!!Good on them for making an apology and giving the impression that the program was somehow good for the athletes but it is nothing but a quick retraction to keep the rabble quiet.

So WTC if you are so worried about making sure that the athletes get to race Ironman why did you slash 500 spots from Ironman Australia?

I could go on but Tom D might make a voodoo-doll of me and stab it with an Ironman brand pin. ;-)


.

So they will add more magazine subscriptions and a free hat?

Guess I'll have to spend mah bread on hookers and cocaine now......Damn you! DAMN YOU WTC!!!!

I didn't necessarily think that the IA program was wrong. I was not going to pony up to be a member, but they are running the business, and the program was based on economic motivations (perhaps based on misguided assumptions, judging by how they cancelled it). I think his description of why they created the program is nonsense. I don't believe for a second that the motivation was to free up spots that were otherwise going unused. That rationale was a reach at best.

In the end, good on them for listening to their audience and making a change when they saw the PR backlash. Lots of much larger companies have not been flexible to change course, leading to their demise.

Eaxactomundo! I could not have cared one way or the other...but from my seat...that's what I'm seeing.

If I were him I would be pissed off too. They tried to do something different, it didn't work. Sometimes you work hard on an idea and are blind to just how bad it is. Obviously there was enough emails and facebok comments to change their minds.

I think it's huge that a company can admit to a mistake and pull the plug so quickly in a response to the customer. Just think how long it takes Microsoft to fix a bad decision they make!!

Rapid response, good job WTC.

Damn, I just burned my two copies of Lava magazine. Crap.

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Founder of THE TRIATHLON COLLECTIVE (Closed Facebook Group). A SBR discussion group without the white noise/trolling!

I canceled my subscription. Dang.

Their people are just thinking of another way to give less and gain more. Like someone else said, What's next? There is no way I could sit in that round table meeting and agree that that program was a good idea.

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"injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" MLK

Totally disagree. Quote from President of WTC: "If you guys say we are wrong, then we are wrong". This phrase used by WTC President will come back to haunt them in the future. HUGE mistake to make that video.

Still will never do an IM brand event again.

For my $.02, if you were pissed about IM and swearing them off before, there is no reason to not carry through on voting with your wallet. I think this was a bad PR move, but did not affect me one way or the other. Blackout dates are my real issue, and you will notice they have not budged on this issue.

Ken
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Frankly, I've lost more respect for WTC now that they have changed their minds on this -- two days of some nastygrams on Slowtwitch and they cave like a house of cards? How thin skinned is everyone over there? I didn't realize that WTC was a democracy.

Running a business is tough and sometimes you have to make choices with your business model that aren't popular at the outset. This wasn't New Coke or CBS cancelling Cagney & Lacey, it was a little pay-to-play scheme that tested the upper bounds of what the market would bear -- boo hoo. So they were trying to eek out some additional revenue for their investors -- they have a fiduciary responsibility to do so.

Me too.....Give them major cred for stepping up to the plate. The outcry must have been overwhelming

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Michael in Kansas
"Once you learn to quit, it becomes a habit"
"Its not whether you get knocked down, it's whether you get up" Lombardi

So they will add more magazine subscriptions and a free hat?[/reply]

No, they are going to increase the price not decrease it.

Here's how it went:

1. They say "lets make more money from the people who we thought only made 150k but the paper says makes 175k".

2. They come up with this plan, and release the info.

3, we went insane on the feedback

4. They said how do we get them to accept this? Oh I know, we'll tell them that by doing this, we'll actually be opening up more slots, not filling slots.

5. they say this wasnt working and caved.

They were way to late on their defense, and frankly, no one was going to buy this line. Especially because sold slots that are empty actually lower their costs because if no one shows up, they dont have to do any work to support them, and have a higher profit margin.

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You don't have to like what I say but you should respect my right to say them and I'll do the same to you.

I, for one, have to eat some crow. I thought (and said) they'd never respond to the e-mails. I tip my hat to them.

And apologize to whomever I may have scoffed at.

Truthfully this is a good thing though. You see now I don't have to start my own 'WTC' like ironman distance triathlon series. This was going to be a daunting task that was destined to take away a lot of my training time, so I'm back on schedule.

Or to quote George Castanza's dad, "I'm back baby!"

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Founder of THE TRIATHLON COLLECTIVE (Closed Facebook Group). A SBR discussion group without the white noise/trolling!

They could have at least come up with a better excuse for what it was designed for. Seriously, free up slots? That's the best you got? You is crazy Mr. Fertic

Just say, Greed is good, but too much can have a bad backlash and we don't want to give away our dominant market share so we'll just pull it back since it would have only been 100k or so anyway per year. We can get you morons to buy tons of retail junk and make that easily.

It's obvious that they are reading Slowtwitch. So, with that in mind:

PLEASE GET RID OF THAT VILE POWERBAR PERFORM DRINK.

Thanks in advance.

That's the way I see it too.

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blog
twitter

EXACTLY. The release is complete BS to try and make it look like a different animal than what it was

It was nice of Ben to come out on video and say "we listened to the feedback, we're human, we make mistakes".

That would have been the perfect way to get out of this. Trying to justify the strategy by talking about freeing up slots was a bit like Bush going in to search for weapons of mass destruction :-).

But overall, I think it was a good PR move.

Who is going to write the Harvard Business School case study on this one?

So why don't we say they are wrong not to off transfers/wait lists. They are wrong to have courses filled with FAR too many people?

This seems like a great opportunity to get some stuff fixed.

In a capitalistic viewpoint this idea wasn't that good to begin with. It was way too transparent and really didn't captilalize on the full reach of their brand. They seriously thought adding more spots to a race and then asking people to pay more for them was a good idea? Because that's all it really was- making the same race more expensive for some people. The same amount of race slots were still available to the average person- did I understand the program correctly? I actually came up with a more profitable idea today that would bring in more money, but with less backlash and more buy-in.

 

x2

about the weakest excuse they could have used. they 'love' no shows at races. they are all sold to 120% capacity with the expectation of the no shows. transfers/refunds would be a 100% hit to their margins.

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it's all about the run

Well I think they could still do the transfers and make money, but in short, when it comes to selling $1000 VIP packages versus transfer fees, it is far more profitable to sell the VIP packages...

Secondly, the Transfer / Wait List program would MAXIMIZE the utilization of slots.

So VIP / Ironman Access. - Maximum Revenues... possible WORSENING of utilization of slots

Wait list / Transfer program - Less Revenues... HIGHEST Utilization of slots..

Which way did WTC choose. Nuff said.

In fact... WTC WANTS to oversell events. Ironman Access contributes to this as well, not alleviate it.

There has been a lot of WTC bashing on this site (and most of it justified). WTC acknowledged the out cry over the Access Program. I think all the people who have been bashing WTC (me included) have to take the high road and thank WTC for reversing this program. "WTC, thank you for listening to your customers." I will also be sending a message direct to WTC thanking them.

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Barry Dmitruk
2017: Florida 70.3 (done); Mont Tremblant 70.3 & Ironman

I can't say that his body language was one that showed sincerity. I agree with another poster that he seemed more pissed about having to apologize than truly thinking they did the wrong thing and retract it.. I also noted that he made no mention of working with athletes and WTC in coming up with a better process to close down those open slots.. better utilization…
But I agree with the prior poster that acknowledgment of doing something was better than moving forward with a bad program. I give them credit for that.

we are on the same page. i agree w/ you 100% i wasnt defending them in any way shape or form. i was making (trying to) this exact point

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it's all about the run

Hello WTC: I would like to thank WTC for reversing the above program. The chat pages I was reading it was obvious there was a huge out cry of displeasure from your customers. I was one of them. I believe credit should be given where credit is due. WTC, thank you for listening to your customers. I believe this will go a long way in re-establishing confidence from your customer base. Again thank you for listening. Barry Dmitruk Orleans Ontario Canada

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Barry Dmitruk
2017: Florida 70.3 (done); Mont Tremblant 70.3 & Ironman

It's actually been a demonstration of people not thinking things through, not having all the facts and making knee jerk reactions.

WTG guys....down with the evil corporations!

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I'm faster in Kilometers!
Wattie Ink Triathlon Team
Powered by Accelerate 3

In general I would agree, expect I think Ben is full of %^*(, knows he is full of %^*&, and has no problem LYING To my face.

That to me makes it worse.

If the issue are slots not being used, I can create a program in 5 minutes that not only MAXIMIZES slot utilization, but CREATES REVENUE.

But in the end, this IS NOT what the WTC wants. They make MORE MONEY selling slots that don't get used. They know this.

Ironman Access WAS NEVER about maximizing utilization of slots. It is inefficient for that, and to the contrary, I think the net effect would be a WORSENING of the situation.

I would be more than happy to address this DIRECTLY with Ben, but he won't bite..

And to put this in perspective.... If there are 3000 slots that go unused each year, that is $1,650,000 in revenue that the WTC gets without having to address.

Its all about the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Not creating more athletes racing on race day

x2!

We are on the same page... I was just refining, adding to the excellent point you brought up with overselling.

What gets scary is if the oversold people showed up, they would run out of nutrition on the course for sure.

That's nonsensical. If it puts someone at an advantage it necessarily puts other at a disadvantage.

Hmmm... Sounds like Penalty Tent or DQ to me

I was hoping they would have used some of the money to fix Active.com's registration process

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HED. Cycling - Twitter @hedcycling - HED Wheel Selector iPhone App

I am impressed that WTC responded to its base that quickly.

I think the premise behind the plan may have been misguided. WTC's issue is that people are signing up for events and then not showing up. "Access" probably would not have solved that problem. I have a friend that has done this very thing, even after being a volunteer the year prior. Losing the entry fee doesn't mean anything to him. I could easily envision this same person paying the $1,000, signing up for a race (or two), and not showing up for one or more races again. It depends on how busy he is leading up to the race. I guess I have some questions about this:

1. Can anyone chime in and tell me percentage of people that sign up and then do not show up for IM races?
2. Isn't it true that entry is non-refundable (I am sure there are some exceptions)?
3. How many entry slots are given to Multisports.com and similar companies as part of a training packages that go unfilled (or are they counted separately)?

I don't think you can do anything to reduce the number of no shows. Life is to unpredictable. I know other people that have dropped out because of serious illness in the family and loss of a job. There is no way to prevent that sort of thing. There should be enough data on these no shows to at least predict the number of people that will not show, and then plan accordingly. If I am wrong, help explain it to me.

I literally laughed out loud when I saw this.

"That's nonsensical. If it puts someone at an advantage it necessarily puts other at a disadvantage."

You must not be a big Steven Covey fan. What about the "Win Win" (Seven Habits of Highly Effective People)?

Covey proposes the best solutions include some synergy of efforts that do mutually benefit each party. I think that is possible.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

How is it mutually beneficial to the people who could not have afforded this program? In a time when Ironman events sell out in hours, when you are giving a group of people with more money the opportunity to get to the front of the line, how can that not be a disadvantage to those with less money?

There was nothing "win win" about this, unless the two parties you are talking about are WTC and the people with the money to pay for the program.

You are wrong.

Many people know MONTHS in advance that they cannot do a race. They unfortunately have no way of transferring their slot.

I also contend that many "shut out people" would LOVE to be on a waiting list, especially if they knew upwards of 6 weeks or more that they could do a race. That may be short for an Ironman, but still doable since most people will already be in the middle of their training cycles

As well, if people knew they were in the top 100 wait list slots, even as high as the top 200, many would train for the race in advance with it coming through.

It is an easy process to resolve in a reasonable manner. May not address it 100%, but you could easily fill 30% or more of those slots

Props to WTC for reversing the Access Program and to Ben For making the announcement. He had to recognize that he was going to take alot of shots from critics/naysayers for being the one to voice the reversal. Never met him but I appreciate the good news.

Not addressed at you M

That was the lamest, most bullshit story I have ever heard. WTC = WTF...

Who gives a rats ass if those that register don't race, they get their money. And I doubt the DNS rate is anywhere near as high as he stated. Do they really think we are that stupid?

If they want to make sure those that are registered race, then set a cut off date and refund more than 100 bucks, then reopen the slot to someone that wants to race. Simple.

So easy, yet they take us for fools...

FF

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To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target.

Good on WTC.. but I hope they have the EAC hotline ready to go. I imagine that the processing of refunds is going to be a foreign concept to the staff and there are likely to be some employee meltdown's to resolve!

<< How is it mutually beneficial to the people who could not have afforded this program? In a time when Ironman events sell out in hours, when you are giving a group of people with more money the opportunity to get to the front of the line, how can that not be a disadvantage to those with less money?
There was nothing "win win" about this, unless the two parties you are talking about are WTC and the people with the money to pay for the program. >>

as someone else, I think Flanagan posted in one of the other related threads, why does it fall on WTC to make races affordable? You can either afford to do Ironman races or you can't.
I think everyone is looking at this wrong. If any mistake was made on the part of WTC it was in not rolling this program out 7 or 8 years ago, at a time when every North American IM event was selling out on the spot and not even getting to the point of offering online entries and the only way to get in was to be present on race site the day after when registration opened. I know I have spent more then $1000 on numerous occassions traveling to Ironman Canada just to enter for the next year. This program would have saved me money. Now maybe if you just want to do Lake Placid you can drive there since you live in Boston, but if I want to do LP it's going to cost me around $1500 to fly there the year before, rent a car, hotels, food, days off work etc, plus the entry fee.
Now at least there are more options as only a few of the NA Ironmans don't reach the point of going to online entries so there are more options.

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Mike Plumb, TriPower MultiSports
Professional Running, Cycling and Multisport Coaching, F.I.S.T. Certified
http://www.tripower.org

The rationale for the program is the biggest bunch of bullshit I've heard in quite a long time.

He claims that people were registering for multiple races and then not doing all of them, leaving those slots unfilled. Yeah. How would that look right now?

- IMLP general entry opens. I sign up.
- IMC general entry opens. I sign up for that, because if something goes wrong in my IMLP training, I want to be able to fall back to it and I've got the cash to burn.
- IMWI general entry opens. I sign up, for the same reason as above.

In what way would the Access program change this? Simple: add the word "Before" to each of the above sentences. It doesn't remotely address the reason people do it.

I wasn't saying it falls on WTC to make races affordable. I wasn't commenting on the virtues of the program or of WTC at all, at least not in this thread...

I was merely responding to the assertion that this program was going to have "no effect" on all those who could not afford (or justify) buying into it. Logically that makes no sense. Of course it was going to have an effect. When someone gets to cut in front of you in line because they can pay more, that's great for them but not so great for you, particularly if you are one of the many people whose turn comes up after its all filled.

As to whether that's "right" or "wrong", well I'm tired to make a point about that.

Answers to your questions:

1. Only WTC knows this. Im going to guess due to injury, illness, or lack of fitness that 5% seems a solid number.

2. Some portion is refundable, but its a small amount and only in certain situations.

3.That isnt a problem, those spots get filled one way or another.

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You don't have to like what I say but you should respect my right to say them and I'll do the same to you.

Wow. Reading some of these comments it's clear these guys just can't win. I met Ben Fertic at the finish line of a race one year and pulled him aside to thank him for a great experience. The guy spent 10 minutes talking to me when he clearly had other things to do. Granted it was only a brief encounter, but I came away convinced he gave a damn and was genuine.

I'll give WTC the benefit of the doubt on this one.

And your point is? The OP stated that there was no way to reduce the number of no shows. I demonstrated that many no-shows are forseeable and that there are several ways to fill these slots... IF THEY WANTED TO.

I also contend, like you, that the WTC doesn't give a flying &*)(& and likes and counts on overselling the events and the extra $$$$$$$.

Addressing no shows, improving the number of people who actually race is a SIMPLE matter to address, the fact that they don't and they SELL OUT early shows that they have NO INTENTION of addressing the issue.

There are definitely realistic scenarios (I am not saying that this is the true reason for the program, however). For example. Someone may really want to do IMLP. IMLP is in July and sells out online within hours if you can even get through. IMCDA is in June and stays open for several weeks. People may very well sign up for IMCDA, get into IMLP a month later and then bail on doing IMCDA because they don't want to do 2 IM. I'm sure you can come up with others.

'We are part of the Ironman family'. Do you charge your family 1000$ to have the chance to book your place next to your favourite oncle for next Xmas dinner?

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Francois-Xavier Li @FrancoisLi
"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." George Bernard Shaw
http://www.swimrunfrance.fr
http://www.worldofswimrun.com

this has me puzzled too

My first sentence was that I was NOT directing my tirade at you. Sorry if it came across that way, but yours was the last post and I didn't feel like scrolling all the way to the OP.

FF

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To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target.

I was sitting in the rules briefing down at the Miami 70.3 today and thought of a new revenue opportunity for the WTC. They can sell a "Drafting Access Card". For a $1,000, you get a green sticker to put on your bike's race number and the referee can't penalize you for drafting. Pink, pink, pink!

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What I do: http://app.strava.com/athletes/345699

Well this is exactly why Ben Fertig is full of %^* with his explanation.

He indicated that there were around 3000 slots that this program was supposed to "fill" from being unused.

1) Membership allowed purchase of ALL RACES. That means if there were 500 of these programs, that it was possible for every race to have 500 slots filled.

2) Given that some people may signing around 3 or more events to get the race they want, Ben is indicating around 1000 people doing this... maybe a little more, maybe a little less... So under this program, lets take IMLP, there would be a chance of day before the race already 1000 slots could be filled for the following years... That would mean either a field of 4500 people the following year, or not only would racers potentially not be able to sign up for next years race, volunteers would DEFINITELY be SOL... in short... less volunteers hoping to get entry into the race.

3) If they were only doing 200 or 300 of these programs, they really were not addressing the "issue" i.e. that many slots would be bought and not used.

Again, I appreciate that the POS program is gone, but don't insult my intelligence and try to state that the main purpose of this program was to address people buying multiple races as backups in case they get shut out of the race they want when this program does not LIMIT the number of races that can be bought.

When you get down to it... this program INCREASES the chance of the possibility that people would have to do exactly the logic this poster is trying to justify, because off the top there may be 300 slots that are GONE even before the race goes on sale to the general public.

As indicated, the program also SERIOUSLY SCREWS the volunteers who then can give their time to only be told, sorry... racers and Access Members have taken all the slots.

This was a VIP PROGRAM
This Program REWARDED those willing to pay for it.
This Program INCREASED the chances that people would buy back up races and INCREASED the chance that regular members would get shut out of races
This Program was designed to INCREASE the demand for races and INCREASE the justification to RAISE ENTRY fees.

I hope it's been said before, but I couldn't make it through 4 pages of posts.

If the WTC/IM really cared about what people thought they would have had, among other things, transfers and refunds by now. It has been the largest complaint for quite a while now.

This will be filed under "social networking fail" when the book is written.

My first thought when they rescinded it, where is that revenue going to come from? You know they have targets. If it was going to free up "2,500 slots," I'd say it is safe to assume they are going to be looking for $2.5 million somewhere. It was coming from the folks that could afford it, now? Maybe they just might start allowing transfers or deferments...for $1,000.

I'm glad that they listened to the public and cancelled it but I'm going to have to call bullshit on the reason they started it in the first place.

They claim that there is a significant number of athletes who sign up for multiple events and then don't do them all and somehow the IA program was supposed to magically solve this? How exactly?

If someone is signing up for multiple events they obviously have the means to do so and they take away spots from those who don't have the ability to do so.

So now they are charging a fee to sign up early. Who do you think is going to go for that? The person who can only afford to do one or the person who can afford to sign up for multiple races? So basically what they were doing was giving people who were already taking multiple slots an opportunity to sign up even earlier and screwing us even more.

If they have an issue with individuals taking multiple slots and then not participating. Then why don't they just implement some sort of rule, like you can only get register for two full distance IM through the regular methods, and if you want to register for and full distance races in excess of two then you have to do it via community fund.

Or just keep track of the worst offenders and then make them persona non grata.

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"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."

Hunter S. Thompson (1937-2005)

I was impressed when they cancelled the program. After hearing the excuse, I am much less impressed. As others have pointed out, the excuse given for creating it is just plan bull. Wether you are in the access program and sign up in the first week, or not in the acess program and sign up the second week, it's still a year out and is not going to cut down on no shows due to lack of training/injury/life getting in the way. Apology not accepted. Treating people like 2 year olds is uncool.

I would like to think people would not be interested in this. However, if Kona slots are in the mix.......

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Barry Dmitruk
2017: Florida 70.3 (done); Mont Tremblant 70.3 & Ironman

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Swim.Bike.Run.Live

Proud Member of Team Rev3

I am sure this has been posted on one of these threads, but here it is again....

http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/7478523/?ref=nf

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Lisa Walser-Anderson, ATC,CSCS

1st rule of crisis management

tell the truth, tell it fast, and tell it yourself

good for him

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"if you chose it, it's not really pain"

I still don't get their logic. If you want to do on IM in a year it would still cost roughly the same to sign up for THREE slots in various races than to do the now defunct Access program and register. If that is the problem they were trying to solve, I don't get it at all.

Again, transfers would work -- especially in case of certified injury or family emergency.

The other thing is say did free up slots -- would it free up slots at the races that are most popular or at races that people can readily enter?

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Janyne

They were trying to free up those unused spots so maybe YOU or I could get into a sold out race that's not really sold out. I respect that concept. May need a little more tweaking though. But maybe these athletes should make up their mind and stick to it by choosing only the events they are REALLY going to compete in and not be selfish little 'tards.

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Charles Myrick
33North Adventures | Owner

A lot of people forget that the community fund spots (typically going for 2x race entry) used to include a deferment option through the following calendar year. Basically, you were paying ~$550 for (1) access to an already full race, (2) some IM tchotchke crap, and (3) the ability to opt out of said race (up to a month prior), and automatically register for any open IM race within the current or following calendar year. I believe there were roughly 200 CF spots per race, so the number was well within the DNS expectations. At the time, the cost:benefit ratio sounded absurd to most. Who would actually pay for the right to sign up for subsequent IM races!? As it turns out, those were the good ol' days. Item 3 was one of the first policies to meet the chopping block when PEP rode into town and bought up WTC.

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"The right to party is a battle we have fought, but we'll surrender and go Amish... NOT!" -Wayne Campbell

this is my idea for the newly released version of this crappy program.

keep the $1000 buy in AND the ability to "cut in line" and get your slot first. as a perk give everyone a HUGE sombrero hat that is bright pink and "allow" them to ACTUALLY cut in line the day after the race on the race site only if they are wearing said sombrero. oh and give them a velvet rope to walk through. oh and a bouncer with a clip board that tells other people they "aren't on the list". and maybe umbrella girls for when it's hot or raining (this would actually be an added $150 benifit).

and of course a yearly subscription to LAVA mag.


i think the cheers from the people in line would be well received.



(where is that pink font editor.....)

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Tim

Ready...FIRE!...Aim...

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infinIT Nutrition
Custom Blended Nutrition Solutions
http://www.infinITNutrition.com

I've heard this logic from several people, now, and it really doesn't make sense. How can they possibly expect to fill purchased-but-unused spots when those determinations aren't really made until race day? I'm sure that some fraction of these multi-registry abusers request a withdrawal refund in advance, but I highly doubt that any more than 5-10% of all DNS cases inform WTC of their decision more than a month ahead of the race. So how are these unused spots going to be filled? Wait list? Who in their right mind is going to undergo a full season of IM training on the premise that they might get into the race at the last minute?

This was a bungled operation, from inception to concession, and I have to imagine that the equity firm holding these guys has called an emergency meeting for this morning to review the WTC performance and sale prospects. Not that they're likely to sell based on one boneheaded decision, but I'm sure they're doing some head scratching. The loss of a huge financial opportunity is one thing, but the PR mess they've created is an order of magnitude beyond that.

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"The right to party is a battle we have fought, but we'll surrender and go Amish... NOT!" -Wayne Campbell

Maybe YOU can explain that "concept" to me. Fertic couldn't. I'm a simple guy.

Thanks
uli

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CAMPAGNOLO GRAN FONDO NEW YORK

I find it puzzling how so many people have said Wow that was great to apologize like that, or, yes I really respect the WTC now...

say what?

how about not pulling a BS move in the first place?

and it was a crap apology too.

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You don't have to like what I say but you should respect my right to say them and I'll do the same to you.

Wow. Reading some of these comments it's clear these guys just can't win. I met Ben Fertic at the finish line of a race one year and pulled him aside to thank him for a great experience. The guy spent 10 minutes talking to me when he clearly had other things to do. Granted it was only a brief encounter, but I came away convinced he gave a damn and was genuine.

I'll give WTC the benefit of the doubt on this one.
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From my very personal point of view it seems that many folks just have not had the experience of being affected (or realized that they were being affected) by the choice of an individual between them and money. It is the VERY VERY VERY rare individual who will choose in private to put another human over personal monetary gain. They can be the nicest person when face to face, and even 99% of the time, but at the point at which the rubber meets the road, things change. You can multiply this effect when you are talking about a corporation. I am not complaining about WTC or their parent company; but I am bummed that I can not afford to do their races, and that their pricing has trickled down to the local triathlons so that I am getting squeezed tighter and tighter each year. I do blame them, and rightly so; but this is a disappointing thing that should be expected...just like you can be expected to be screwed by the insurance company of the car that hit you while riding your bicycle. The anger that I keep on reading seems to stem from this either being the first time dealing with this type of behavior, the first time that they realized that they were on the receiving end of this behavior, or the first time that this behavior affected them in a place they really love.

Or maybe Im completely off base.

Stephen J

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I believe my local reality has been violated.
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Happiness = Results / (Expectations)^2

Ever hear any for-profit corporation apologize for raising their prices? Why would you expect them to do so now?

I've never heard the president of Ford say, "Dear consumers, I want to apologize from the bottom of my heart for raising the price of our Taurus this year. We realize our error and are working to come up with another approach that will satisfy your needs."

Folks, WTC does not hold a monopoly on long distance events. If their approach to all things IM doesn't hold water then the market will have a direct affect on their business practices to knock it back into line.

Spending time viewing the WTC like it owes the triathlon community something is off base and a waste of energy.

Many of you are acting like battered housewives - it's a sport and you have choices. Stop yappin and actually do something about it if you are in such emotional pain over this.

When Ben mentioned about tying up the slots and the increasing size of the registered participants for the events, it reminds me of the airline industry. The airlines have started overbooking on flights because they count on people making last minute cancellations. My last time to the airport, i was greeted by the ticketing counter personnel saying that they were overbooked by 48 people. How do you overbook by that amount of people?

Anyway, glad to see that they dropped the IA program.

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Paul..