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Re: Israel [TMI] [ In reply to ]
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TMI wrote:
Nutella wrote:
TMI wrote:
Kay Serrar wrote:

The temporary pier constructed off Gaza to bring humanitarian supplies to Palestinians has been damaged in heavy seas, holding up thousands of tons of aid in Cyprus.

I know you’ll be pleased to hear this so you can have a swipe at Biden (obviously it’s his fault), and because it further threatens the lives of some brown people.
The condition of the pier is the least of the Palestinians' worries.

https://www.nationalreview.com/...it-can-be-delivered/

Interesting that you rushed here to post an uncorroborated National Review story
The NR story was posted a week ago.
Your Reuters link is from last November and only refers to a short window of a few days. It doesn't speak to the aid being delivered to the pier.

Try this one instead. https://www.usatoday.com/...ijacked/73800804007/

Nutella wrote:
yet are silent about many, well documented, cases of right-wing settlers attacking and destroying aid.
Far-right Israeli settlers step up attacks on aid trucks bound for Gaza - The Washington Post

Admit it, you don't really care about aid reaching the Palestinian people. You just want to throw rocks at Biden for trying to help the Palestinian people.
You WaPo link is solely about aid passing through the West Bank. I don't want anyone to starve, but how do you ensure the aid doesn't end up in the hands of Hamas?

Would you care to explain how "right-wing settlers" are poaching the aid leaving the pier in Gaza?

Your protect Biden at all costs approach can't hide the fact that hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars have been spent on a half-baked idea to help the Gazans. It's the result of thinking that throwing money at a problem will solve it - that doing something is better than doing nothing. Nevermind that what we have done has accomplished little in achieving our goals.

by the way, notice how Nutcase sidesteps how badly he's getting played by the Biden admin and focuses on your "unsubstantiated" story.

you did notice Biden up and denouncing Bibi first thing this morning right?

Oh yeah, he was too busy race baiting in front of 100 people and Elmo in Philly for 45 minutes with our highly qualified VP that Biden trumpeted was part of "the most diverse administration ever" which we all know is just a racial dog whistle. She did cackle as part of her "can I get a witness" pandering today but, its sexist to point that out (so Biden didn't).
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Re: Israel [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
TMI wrote:
I don't want anyone to starve, but how do you ensure the aid doesn't end up in the hands of Hamas?


I don't think you can. Just yet. Hamas isn't just the militant arm. They are/were also the entire government, responsible for all the things that governments do. The IDF is well on the way to "demilitarizing" Hamas. Somewhat of a euphemism for killing anyone willing to lay hands on a weapon of any kind with bad intent. And then taking the weapons away so someone else can't pick them up. That's Step 1. I support Step 1, with guardrails.

Step 2 is figuring out how to replace Hamas as a government entity with something better. Because there are lots of self-identified Hamas people who are not militants. They are bureaucrats or other kinds of what we call civil servants. That's what Israel (and the world) needs to figure out, how to replace them since anyone who ever called themselves Hamas maybe should have zero role in a new government.

What is that going to be? I have no idea. Legions of NGOs from around the world taking over basic internal logistics in Gaza until a proper government can emerge? Some coalition of Western governments stepping in with a provisional government (like Bremer in Iraq). Some coalition of Middle Eastern governments stepping in? The ME governments stepping in (Egypt, et al) sounds like a good plan to me, but will Israel allow Egyptian, Jordanian personnel into Gaza? I think they'd say F to the No on Lebanese people. Do Egyptian and Jordanian goverments really care, or want to step into that morass? No idea.

I don't think a plan has materialized yet. This is what Benny Gantz is threatening to leave the government over. A total lack of plan (according to him) of what to do after Step 1.

As former Israeli PM Olmert said in the interview posted earlier today, is the international community going to sit by while Israel indefinitely restricts Gazans’ human rights, economic rights, rights of freedom of movement, voting rights… The answer is no. Israel’s government has burnt a lot of international support with its actions in Gaza and there will be little patience for it to occupy Gaza or (even further) turn it into a giant prison indefinitely.
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Re: Israel [TMI] [ In reply to ]
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TMI wrote:


Would you care to explain how "right-wing settlers" are poaching the aid leaving the pier in Gaza?


I never said they were. I am pointing out your very selective outrage. You are giddy that Hamas may be intercepting some of the aid America is giving the Palestinian people but silent about the fact that far right settlers have been destroying aid, vandalizing trucks, and assaulting drivers since January.

Israeli soldiers and police tipping off groups that attack Gaza aid trucks | Israel-Gaza war | The Guardian

You don't really care about aid reaching the starving people of Gaza, you just want a reason to mock America's effort to feed them.
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Re: Israel [lastlap] [ In reply to ]
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lastlap wrote:
As I said the word is a strange place. Hamas, a terrorist organisation slaughters hundreds (was it thousands?) of innocent civilians and get rewarded indirectly with 12 votes to become a member of the UN and public protests of support around the world.
M

The world is a strange place, but can you point me to where someone voted for Hamas to be a member of the UN?
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Re: Israel [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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chaparral wrote:
lastlap wrote:

As I said the word is a strange place. Hamas, a terrorist organisation slaughters hundreds (was it thousands?) of innocent civilians and get rewarded indirectly with 12 votes to become a member of the UN and public protests of support around the world.
M


The world is a strange place, but can you point me to where someone voted for Hamas to be a member of the UN?

You also have a problem with attention to detail, try reading again how I put 'indirectly' in there as I knew there would be people who still like to pretend that Hamas and Palestine aren't basically one and the same...
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Re: Israel [lastlap] [ In reply to ]
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lastlap wrote:
chaparral wrote:
lastlap wrote:

As I said the word is a strange place. Hamas, a terrorist organisation slaughters hundreds (was it thousands?) of innocent civilians and get rewarded indirectly with 12 votes to become a member of the UN and public protests of support around the world.
M


The world is a strange place, but can you point me to where someone voted for Hamas to be a member of the UN?

You also have a problem with attention to detail, try reading again how I put 'indirectly' in there as I knew there would be people who still like to pretend that Hamas and Palestine aren't basically one and the same...

No I read correctly.

Read your own post, the subject of the sentence that is getting voted to become a member of the UN is Hamas. There is no other subject. What you said was that this reward of being made a member of the UN was indirect, but that Hamas was voted to be a member of the UN.
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Re: Israel [Kay Serrar] [ In reply to ]
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Is Israel going to cut diplomatic ties with every country that chooses to recognise Palestine?

Its increasingly being viewed as a Pariah and accusing countries of becoming terrorist sympathizers will just make it look increasingly mad.

Omert is right, there will be elections, the right will become neutered and whoever takes over, if they want to regain some international credibility will require to do something other than blockading an open prison and how sustainable will that be in the long run, what to the extreme right think is going to happen, that secular jews are going to tolerate maintaining an open prison indefinitely because some messianic crazies think its all theirs
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