Convince me that this is a good thing

Mar 29, 17 6:22

Post #1 of 23 (2299 views)

Quote:

House Republicans voted nearly unanimously Tuesday to revoke the FCC’s broadband privacy rules, sending legislation to the White House that would undo the federal government’s strongest-ever online privacy regulations.
Republicans passed the measure 215-205 over the fierce objections of Democrats, who are widely supportive of the Obama-era regulations. Set to go into effect later this year, the rules would block internet service providers like Comcast and Verizon from using data on customers' web browsing and app habits for advertising without their consent.
Telecom industry groups and Republicans have been targeting the rules for months, saying they are too strict and unfairly hold ISPs to a tougher privacy standard than that faced by web companies like Google and Facebook.
“These rules are unnecessary and just another example of big government overreach,” said Rep. Marsha Blackburn (R-Tenn.), who led the legislative effort in the House.

http://www.politico.com/...ules-236607?cmpid=sf

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Last edited by: sphere: Mar 29, 17 6:22

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [sphere] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 6:27

Post #2 of 23 (2280 views)

I don't think it is a good thing. Better to expand the rules to include google and facebook. Maybe the Republicans see Google and facebook as friends of the democrats so they are leveling the playing field? Seems to me better way to do that is to make it more inclusive not less.

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [sphere] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 6:34

Post #3 of 23 (2264 views)

I don't think it's a good thing. However, note that these are rules that have not gone into effect yet, so reeling them back in is a preservation of the status quo. Have you been outraged for the last decade at the status quo of the privacy treatment (or lack thereof) around ISP data collection? I have, but I can see an argument that this move isn't really making things worse.

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [wimsey] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 6:40

Post #4 of 23 (2251 views)

I'm pretty much immersed in the Google ecosystem and find it incredibly useful, and that pretty much depends on them collecting personal information. No outrage on my part on way or the other, and on it's face, it seems like the government picking winners when it comes to Google and Facebook. The devil is always in the details, though, and I don't yet know what the devil looks like in this instance, but when Republican howls of "Government Overreach!!!" are accompanied by legislative wins for megacorps, my inclination is skepticism that it actually benefits the average Joe.

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [sphere] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 6:46

Post #5 of 23 (2237 views)

sphere wrote:

I'm pretty much immersed in the Google ecosystem and find it incredibly useful, and that pretty much depends on them collecting personal information. No outrage on my part on way or the other, and on it's face, it seems like the government picking winners when it comes to Google and Facebook. The devil is always in the details, though, and I don't yet know what the devil looks like in this instance, but when Republican howls of "Government Overreach!!!" are accompanied by legislative wins for megacorps, my inclination is skepticism that it actually benefits the average Joe.

Oh, I hear you, and I go a bit of the way on the spectrum of outrage about it (notwithstanding the fact that I represent a number of companies that deal in this sort of data). It's definitely not for the benefit of the average Joe, or at least that's not the primary goal. The average Joe and his data is the product for all these guys, not the beneficiary of altruistic 'connecting the world' BS that they hold out as their image. I just don't see this as tilting the field any more against the average Joe that it already is.

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [sphere] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 7:07

Post #6 of 23 (2191 views)

It's a good thing in that it will allow for many more headlines about "Republicans not protecting your personal data!", and that will help get the message across to more people to be careful with how they use the interwebs.

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [dave_w] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 7:45

Post #7 of 23 (2149 views)

As I understand it, there will be no opt-out of data collection and sale as there is with Google and Facebook services. Seems to me a fundamental difference that justifies different regulation.

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [wimsey] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 7:50

Post #8 of 23 (2136 views)

wimsey wrote:

I don't think it's a good thing. However, note that these are rules that have not gone into effect yet, so reeling them back in is a preservation of the status quo. Have you been outraged for the last decade at the status quo of the privacy treatment (or lack thereof) around ISP data collection? I have, but I can see an argument that this move isn't really making things worse.

This. I was going to post almost exactly the same thing.

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [JSA] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 9:00

Post #9 of 23 (2089 views)

JSA wrote:

wimsey wrote:

I don't think it's a good thing. However, note that these are rules that have not gone into effect yet, so reeling them back in is a preservation of the status quo. Have you been outraged for the last decade at the status quo of the privacy treatment (or lack thereof) around ISP data collection? I have, but I can see an argument that this move isn't really making things worse.

This. I was going to post almost exactly the same thing.

Correct, and largely irrelevant.

Should the effective duopoly of ISPs (Comcast and Verizon, in most areas) be free to pick your online pockets, or should we prohibit that from happening?

With regards to Google and Facebook being exempt, as I understand it, it's like being forced to take public transportation to a shopping megaplex, where the two biggest stores pick your pockets as a condition of entry. You can choose to enter those stores on those terms, or you can opt out. But if access to that megaplex is conditional on you taking public transportation, wouldn't it be in our best interest to prohibit the bus drivers from picking our pockets as well, as a condition of ridership?

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [sphere] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 9:14

Post #10 of 23 (2074 views)

sphere wrote:

JSA wrote:

wimsey wrote:

I don't think it's a good thing. However, note that these are rules that have not gone into effect yet, so reeling them back in is a preservation of the status quo. Have you been outraged for the last decade at the status quo of the privacy treatment (or lack thereof) around ISP data collection? I have, but I can see an argument that this move isn't really making things worse.

This. I was going to post almost exactly the same thing.

Correct, and largely irrelevant.

Should the effective duopoly of ISPs (Comcast and Verizon, in most areas) be free to pick your online pockets, or should we prohibit that from happening?

I don't agree that it is irrelevant. In the OP, you asked whether "this" was a "good thing." If by "this," you mean the actual action being taken by Congress, I don't see it as good or bad - it is status quo. If by "this" you mean the current ability to use this information, I agree that it is undesirable, but question whether it is "bad."

The extent to which it is "bad" should be measured by how it directly impacts each individual. We have data on that, given that this has been the status quo for over a decade. During that time, it has not adversely affected me or, likely, anyone else. So, it is highly relevant on determining whether this is a good thing or a bad thing.

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [JSA] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 9:37

Post #11 of 23 (2052 views)

I think most people would agree with the Rumsfeldian view here, that the unknown unknown is something we should be concerned with as it pertains to privacy and personal data access, and that less access to our footprint and personal information, rather than more, should be our inclination, rather than allowing our internet transit system to collect and sell at will.

The status quo wasn't ideal, so preservation of that status quo, at the will of the data collectors and sellers over the preferences of the individual users, doesn't strike me as a good thing.

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [sphere] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 9:47

Post #12 of 23 (2045 views)

I tend to agree. In the abstract - allowing any entity the ability to collect information about you/me is concerning.

That said - it's a mixed bag. We want smarter and smarter devices. We want Alexa to turn on our lights and re-order our toilet paper at a quick command. Soon, we will want Alexa to anticipate our needs and carry them out before we utter them. How can she do this? By accumulating information about us.

I see both sides and don't know which is better.

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [JSA] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 11:27

Post #13 of 23 (2008 views)

JSA wrote:

I tend to agree. In the abstract - allowing any entity the ability to collect information about you/me is concerning.

That said - it's a mixed bag. We want smarter and smarter devices. We want Alexa to turn on our lights and re-order our toilet paper at a quick command. Soon, we will want Alexa to anticipate our needs and carry them out before we utter them. How can she do this? By accumulating information about us.

I see both sides and don't know which is better.

If I allow Alexa, or Google or Facebook to access my info, why do I have to at the same time allow my ISP to collect my info? Why can't you opt out of everything if you want?

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [BLeP] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 11:48

Post #14 of 23 (1981 views)

Quote:

Why can't you opt out of everything if you want?

Why should the mega ISPs give you the option if they can have Congress force it on you?

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [BLeP] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 11:56

Post #15 of 23 (1971 views)

BLeP wrote:

JSA wrote:

I tend to agree. In the abstract - allowing any entity the ability to collect information about you/me is concerning.

That said - it's a mixed bag. We want smarter and smarter devices. We want Alexa to turn on our lights and re-order our toilet paper at a quick command. Soon, we will want Alexa to anticipate our needs and carry them out before we utter them. How can she do this? By accumulating information about us.

I see both sides and don't know which is better.

If I allow Alexa, or Google or Facebook to access my info, why do I have to at the same time allow my ISP to collect my info? Why can't you opt out of everything if you want?

I'm not claiming you can't. As I said -- I tend to agree. In the abstract - allowing any entity the ability to collect information about you/me is concerning.

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [JSA] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 12:02

Post #16 of 23 (1966 views)

JSA wrote:

I'm not claiming you can't. As I said -- I tend to agree. In the abstract - allowing any entity the ability to collect information about you/me is concerning.

You're such an Obama ball washer. Fucking lefty snowflake.

YOU LOST!!! GET OVER IT!!!!

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [BLeP] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 15:06

Post #17 of 23 (1907 views)

BLeP wrote:

JSA wrote:

I'm not claiming you can't. As I said -- I tend to agree. In the abstract - allowing any entity the ability to collect information about you/me is concerning.

You're such an Obama ball washer. Fucking lefty snowflake.

YOU LOST!!! GET OVER IT!!!!

I'm going to park on your moose.

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [JSA] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 15:38

Post #18 of 23 (1889 views)

I haven't seen a moose since July 2013. That's far too long.

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [BLeP] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 15:43

Post #19 of 23 (1885 views)

BLeP wrote:

I haven't seen a moose since July 2013. That's far too long.

You must be so lonely.

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [JSA] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 16:46

Post #20 of 23 (1856 views)

JSA wrote:

BLeP wrote:

I haven't seen a moose since July 2013. That's far too long.

You must be so lonely.

You have no idea.

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [sphere] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 17:49

Post #21 of 23 (1829 views)

I'm seriously having a diffficult time understanding how this can negatively impact me.

So my isp sells my browser history...and this is dangerous because....?

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [Duffy] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 18:05

Post #22 of 23 (1807 views)

Duffy wrote:

I'm seriously having a diffficult time understanding how this can negatively impact me.

So my isp sells my browser history...and this is dangerous because....?

-
Yeah, I was going to just post that I'm into gay cross-dressing Himalayan twin midget porn,...but who isn't?

Re: Convince me that this is a good thing [dave_w] [ In reply to ]

Mar 29, 17 18:07

Post #23 of 23 (1805 views)

dave_w wrote:

Duffy wrote:

I'm seriously having a diffficult time understanding how this can negatively impact me.

So my isp sells my browser history...and this is dangerous because....?

-
Yeah, I was going to just post that I'm into gay cross-dressing Himalayan twin midget porn,...but who isn't?

And if you were, so what? How is it a problem if your isp sells this info?

Civilize the mind, but make savage the body.

- Chinese proverb

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