Wouldn't the 14th amendment (state actor doctrine) allow the federal gov't to intervene in cases where they feel a state is depriving a citizens any of the rights protected by the Bill of Rights? Wouldn't this simply be the first step in exercising the federal gov't 14th amendment right to protect state citizens?

---

---

"In the world I see you are stalking elk through the damp canyon forests around the ruins of Rockefeller Center. You'll wear leather clothes that will last you the rest of your life. You'll climb the wrist-thick kudzu vines that wrap the Sears Towers. And when you look down, you'll see tiny figures pounding corn, laying stripes of venison on the empty car pool lane of some abandoned superhighway." T Durden

Don't confuse what I think the law should be and what the law is.

Understood. I generally accept your statements about what the law is. My only point is that the law is often an ass, and I don't find reference to SCOTUS decisions all that persuasive these days. I agree that the court hasn't held that the right to bear arms applies to carrying in public. Yet. It might, it might not- but I think that right is pretty clear, regardless.



The 10th Amendment.

lol! Dead letter.

But even so, isn't that the one that talks about powers being reserved by the states or the people? Doesn't the 2cd amendment specifically reference the people? Are there other specifically enumerated rights of the people that the states can restrict based on the 10th amendment?

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

And again, hasn't the 14th amendment applied in cases where states have used the 10th amendment to deny the rest of the bill of Rights.

---

---

"In the world I see you are stalking elk through the damp canyon forests around the ruins of Rockefeller Center. You'll wear leather clothes that will last you the rest of your life. You'll climb the wrist-thick kudzu vines that wrap the Sears Towers. And when you look down, you'll see tiny figures pounding corn, laying stripes of venison on the empty car pool lane of some abandoned superhighway." T Durden

Sure. But you have to define what right is being deprived. Neither SCOTUS nor the Appellate Courts have ever said you have the right to walk around with a firearm anywhere you want.

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Like I said to Forge - first you have to define what rights the 2A actually grants. Historical writings suggest the Founding Father feared a government that disarmed its people, thus subjecting them to totalitarian rule. To prevent that, the 2A was drafted. There is nothing in the Constitution or the supporting documents that suggests the 2A was intended to permit all persons to walk around with firearms at all times.

Now, if you want to argue "living breathing document," ok. But, what do you read the actual intent of the 2A to be?

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

what do you read the actual intent of the 2A to be?

I'm more of a textualist. ;)

Like I said, I think the meaning of "keep" is "own," and "bear" is "carry." If I'm walking around town and my guns are locked up in my safe, I'm keeping them, but I'm not bearing them.

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Pick any type of federal monies that you deem appropriate for this exercise

The federal funding has to be related to the activity. I cannot think if one that would apply to CCW.

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Police grants

I don't see those related at all. In addition, local police department receive very little in federal funding. If anything, they get left over military equipment.

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

Only one answer to that question:

---

________
It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev

Anti-violence grants

I already said law enforcement or DHS grants.

---

---

"In the world I see you are stalking elk through the damp canyon forests around the ruins of Rockefeller Center. You'll wear leather clothes that will last you the rest of your life. You'll climb the wrist-thick kudzu vines that wrap the Sears Towers. And when you look down, you'll see tiny figures pounding corn, laying stripes of venison on the empty car pool lane of some abandoned superhighway." T Durden

You are really grasping. Try to come up with something realistic.

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR

People who use the "states' rights" argument need to be more consistent.

It only works when considering the appropriate balance of power between states and federal powers.

Unfortunately, it is often an argument used by one side to an issue where they think one side, state or federal, is likely to advance their side of the argument. It's a matter of people putting the cart before the horse.

What about homeless people? They aren't allowed to have guns?

It only works when considering the appropriate balance of power between states and federal powers.
Unfortunately, it is often an argument used by one side to an issue where they think one side, state or federal, is likely to advance their side of the argument.

I agree. Seems like kind of a murky area, though. Some individual rights are maintained to be protected against government infringement at any level- federal, state, and local. Others are only said to be protected from federal infringement, and people argue that the states can restrict them. Is there some consistent guideline on that?

As far as CCW goes, I would maintain that as the 2cd amendment is currently understood and enforced, JSA is right- it's a matter left to the states. The SC hasn't said there's a right to carry guns in public, either openly or concealed, so as it stands, allowing CCW is up to individual states. Therefore I don't think the federal government ought to be mandating reciprocity between states that allow it- because what about the states that choose not to allow CCW in the first place?

On the other hand, my own opinion is that the 2cd amendment is an individual right and should apply to both ownership and carrying, so I'm not really sure what grounds the states have to regulate it in the first place. (Other than that it hasn't been ruled on yet.)

---

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

Home is where the heart is. Why do you think the poor have no hearts?

---

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR