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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [Sparticus] [ In reply to ]
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Seriously -- The movies I mentioned were ones in which people were fooled -- the reality they believe existed was a false one.

Orson Well's "War of the World" radio program -- people believed it was true.

As for the Giant Squid -- That was a myth -- scientist said no such creature could exist. We would have found one by now. It was pretty recently (late 1950's ??) that a giant squid was actually found -- my point - what was once thought of as untrue - turns out to be true.

Four minute mile -- impossible -- doctors from all over studied human physiology and said it could not be done. They were afraid a man would die if he tried. Again - a truth found to be not so true.

Math and Physics -- solid, perfect, undeniable -- I think that is what you said. Well, in the 1950's several great mathmaticians said it was immpossible to land on the moon. To many variable - a spinning body with a moving atmosphere that is traveling in a non concentric circle around the sun and trying to hit another moving body in space. I do believe they said "It would take 1000 mathmatitians 100 years to make all the calculations." Wrong again.

"Ray's of light" was the standard view for centuries, until someone figured out light can bend, opps - it acts like a particle, but wait - it's not a particle - change the math models, they are wrong.

The more we (humans) know - the more we realize we don't know.

My position is simple - we don't know and can't prove or disprove much.
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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [Sparticus] [ In reply to ]
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"Math and Physics -- solid, perfect, undeniable -- I think that is what you said."

Nope. Didn't say that. Wouldn't say that. Not even close. And I rarely use the words perfect, undeniable. But I do now understand: You responded to the first post without reading it.

Good night,

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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [vitus979] [ In reply to ]
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Yes, progress has been made without the "abanonment of religious faith", but you asked me to envision a world that relied on empirically tested truth instead of myth. I think that we would be further along than we are had we abandoned myth. You don't.

Regarding dispair: You and I just don't see eye to eye here. I don't see dispair in reality. I find it wonderful. I'm in awe of the physical universe from the most distant star to the smallest strand of DNA. Its all amazing. Things are what they are. We will never know all that is knowable, but we can learn a little more with each generation. Although I wish we understood more, I am content knowing somethings with relative certainty and not knowing somethings hardly at all. I do not need to interject a supreme being into things that I do not understand. If something is not yet known, I simply hope that someday it will be known and move on. I think that if people abandoned myth, they would be more happy, not less. You think otherwise.

Let's just leave it at that.

Dream? Yup, I used the word and you threw it back on me. In a way, I regret that I used it because it suggests something external to the physical world. But you asked me to 'envision' what would happen and I did. I should have used "hope" instead of "dream". I do have great hope for the future.

...One of my hopes for the future is that I hope that I refrain from speculative responses in the future. Somehow, I don't think you really wanted to know what I "envisioned"!

Aloha,

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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
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What if these little green men come back & say (and can prove) "suprise; we dropped off your 100 x great, great ancestors here ohh....about 8000 years ago & wanted to see what would happen.

Kind of would kill the Adam & Eve part of the Bible...rendering the rest moot as a fairy tale don't you think.

Forget about the universe, which everyone is already defaulting to....what about Adam & Eve....which eventually leads to Christ.

No Adam & Eve (biblical version); no Christ......unless you also want to keep believing in the Easter Bunny & Santa Claus?

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"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." John Rogers
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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [mopdahl] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
What if these little green men come back & say (and can prove) "suprise; we dropped off your 100 x great, great ancestors here ohh....about 8000 years ago & wanted to see what would happen.


Are those little green men called Slatibatfast :-))

Cheers Torsten
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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [mopdahl] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
What if these little green men come back & say (and can prove) "suprise; we dropped off your 100 x great, great ancestors here ohh....about 8000 years ago & wanted to see what would happen.

Kind of would kill the Adam & Eve part of the Bible...rendering the rest moot as a fairy tale don't you think.

Forget about the universe, which everyone is already defaulting to....what about Adam & Eve....which eventually leads to Christ.

No Adam & Eve (biblical version); no Christ......unless you also want to keep believing in the Easter Bunny & Santa Claus?
Archeologist pretty much agree -- Jesus did exist.
Last edited by: Sparticus: Jan 27, 05 10:44
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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [Sparticus] [ In reply to ]
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I dont think there's any archaelogical evidence of Jesus.

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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
I dont think there's any archaelogical evidence of Jesus.


And which esteemed University or Museum do you work???
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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [Sparticus] [ In reply to ]
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Hey, if you know something specific, please share.

I'd like to think if there had been any physical evidence of Jesus, I'd know about it. But I don't.



BTW, I work at Northwestern University (though not in archaeology ;)

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Re: What would it take to disprove/abolish God/religion? [Sparticus] [ In reply to ]
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"Archeologist pretty much agree -- Jesus did exist."

*** I'm not sure where you got this bit of info, but you're wrong. An archaeologist would likely not take a position on this, because they tend to study physical artifacts/remains, and no remains purporting to be Jesus the Christ have yet been found ... which begs the question ... if such remains were found, what then the Resurrection and Ascension?

*** What you might have meant, is anthropologists/historians speculate that there probably was a historical figure known as Jesus. There is a fair bit of evidence that such a person lived in or about the same time as the Bibilical Jesus, give or take a few decades. Whether this person was The Christ or not, well that's a matter of faith.

*** Furthermore, anthropology/archaeology don't seek to answer the questions this thread debates. Respectively, they are the study of cultures and ancient people --- how they live, think, feel, communicate, interact, etc, ... and yes, their religious beliefs as well. Social scientists strive to be value neutral, otherwise they are basically politicians or evangelists.

*** In a few of my posts, I've used anthropological terms and analyses, because that's where my training lies: deeply rooted in the social sciences, specifically cultural studies and criminology (not that crim has much to do with this thread). But I've used these techniques to address the social/cultural role of belief, faith and religion ... not objective truth.

*****
"In case of flood climb to safety"
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