To bring the discussion back to the original question - any views on Princeton and Artech disc wheels? The first is expensive and relatively well known, the latter is also expensive but largely unknown.
1 Like
That is bad that the HED website has two different max PSI for the same wheel. If you access via āexploring the Vanquish Pro Seriesā and choosing the disc it shows the 70 psi max reported by @Duncan74. If you choose via shopping disc wheels and choose the Vanquish Pro it shows the 75 max psi reported by @E_DUB.
Additionally, in the Help me choose the best disc wheel thread it was reported by @easyryder that his LBS called HED and āHED confirmed running 80-90 lbs would be no problemā.
For me going over 70 psi would be if I ever raced on course that was classified as ānewā per the Silca calculator, but then only need 73.5 psi. As a Vanquish Pro disc owner I would like to know the real answer.
@E_DUB surely Slowtwitch can get an official stance from HED and at the same time alert them of the conflicting details on their website.
2 Likes
I have the Vanquish Pro 62/84 on my bike, both stickers show max psi of 70 (for a 25mm tire). I also have the Vanquish Disc but must have taken the sticker off. Iāll assume itās also a max of 70 psi since HED just bonds a cover to the 62mm carbon rim.
I agree with you that itās A LOT to look at and learn thatās for sureā¦
Itās getting better though and will continue to do so.
Assuming the person wants to ride Hookless.
One of the three moved over to hooked, so yes, itās getting better
Two to go
6 Likes
I found the sticker on my Vanquish Pro disc, 70 max psi for 25 and 67 max psi for 28. I didnāt recall having a sticker (its not the orange warning type that I most certainly removed if it was that), most likely since at the time of purchase I was planning on using the HED table which has me at 62 psi (below the 67 max for 28s) and promptly forgot about it until now, after switching to the Silca calculator as my guide.
Why the different maximums for different sizes, I suspect it has to do with the greater volume. Any engineer types want to get me up to speed on the physics.
It seems like it would be pretty difficult to read the (several) threads on this topic on this site and think this is actually the case.
If anything, the fact that this is an issue and canāt be ignored has just recently become evident to manufacturers, and that is more confusing for most consumers, who maybe now know that there are potential problems, but have no easy way to identify them, far less rectify them. (Hooked? Hookless? Whatās a bead hook? Which are my wheels? Uhhā¦ carbon?)
Hell, I just - literally five minutes ago - finished a bike fit for someone who rolled in a bike with a set of Zipps with tires that are ātoo smallā. This was a very (relatively) sophisticated customerā¦ running aftermarket tire liners, high volume valvestems, installed these himself, no sweat.
He had no idea at all that this tire size thing was a problem, and never would have known. He was about to buy another set of too-small tires, and there wasnāt a damn thing out there warning him about this. The LBS sure didnāt.
Once you get off Escape Collective Island and the ST archipelago, folks just still have no clue about any of this stuff.
3 Likes
SRAM / Zipp have an entire page dedicated to tire compatibility with their wheels.
If the LBS didnāt know about that, they should.
1 Like
Casing tension increases in more or less direct proportion to tire size increase at any given inflation pressure.
1 Like
Thereās an entire world that exists between āshouldā and āactually doā. And in this case, why would a customer have any reason to buy anything other than a direct replacement for the tire that came on their bike? Is it now the LBSās responsibility to hold a tubeless compatibility intervention for everyone that walks in to buy a set of tires? How much time is that going to take? How many customers are going to simply get frustrated, walk away, and buy an exact replacement online anyway?
Itās. A. Mess.
1 Like
The limit for hookless systems is 72psi. As far as I am concerned, this is quite simple and clear. This system is not for me.
What is much less clear (to me) is why HED has similar limitations on its hooked wheels while other hooked wheels normally work with higher pressures. I find it very unlikely that they would introduce such a crippling limitation (for some riders) only out of an abundance of caution.
Looks like this discussion decided to go into a different directionā¦ 
What are your primary criterias? Price? Performance ? Weight ? Woomp-woomp?
What are your primary criterias? Price? Performance ? Weight ? Woomp-woomp?
[/quote]
Performance, weight within around 1100g is good enough, a reputable brand is a plus, woomp-woomp is a plus.
Side issue is that with āold schoolā (inner tubed), tubeless and hookless tyres, in 21, 23, 15, 28, 30, 32s you canāt really count on the LBS now stocking tyres, so Iāve had to stop trying to buy from my LBSs. And whilst as mentioned above, we live in this world, even good bike shops serve a really diverse clientele of which pointy end triathletes (and roadies) are a minority.
Holding stock of the range of hookless and tubeless (hooked) tyres that nowadays cost more than car tyres is just not viable, and so I donāt think itās fair that LBS should be responsible for this, especially as they may not actually sell hookless.
And even if they did, as per the HED website, how the heck should a mechanic be expected to memorise all this for every manufacturer when those manufacturers are now putting all manner of confusing/confounding info out there - micro hooks, multiple max pressures, ārecommended pressureā, tested to xxx psiā¦
Back to OP. Again I say Cadenā¦
2 Likes
Iām starting to plan my next tri bike purchase, and a set of hooked wheels will be on the list. I absolutely love Princeton, but they are stupidly expensive. I do love the look.
The others on my list, but may not be compatible with your timeline, are ENVEās coming-soon micro-hooked wheels they made for Team UAE and the TdF.
Probably for the exact reason weāre seeing on this thread: avoiding confusion.
And ācripplingā? A couple watts is more like a nuisance.
they are pretty close to launching
1 Like
Havenāt tried the other options, but Iām quite satisfied with the Parcours one. Sound is great, tires installed very easily by hand, feels as fast as you could expect from a disc.
Cons : thatās still a shitload of money for a wheel, and its not that light. Not the best looking either Iād say.
Neutral : the HUB is the loudest thing everyone has ever heard. Iāve been biking for a lot of years, and friends who have done the same confirmed it : its too loud. I mean, rolling in the house when Iām finished riding is just a massive pain in the ears, canāt get out quietly in the morning, everone just jumps scared (Yes, I always ride the disc wheel, given the price no way Iām only riding it in races)
2 Likes
[quote=āspudone, post:59, topic:1291488ā]
Probably for the exact reason weāre seeing on this thread: avoiding confusion.
Confusion on this thread is driven by refusal to acknowledge that all hookless systems are limited at 72psi. HED are hooked, so not sure how introducing artificial limitations would avoid confusion.