School me on changing to tubeless

Triathlon Forum
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With new bike, wheels and tires coming I figured it is time to try a change to tubeless.

  1. Set up race wheels or both race and training wheels?
  2. What’s in your training flat kit? Mini tool, CO2/pump, plugs? Tube for worst case?
  3. What’s in your race flat kit? (I race mainly 70.3 and full distance)
  4. Any maintenance like sealant change, etc?
  5. Airline travel? I understand its safe and recommended to only let a little air out
  6. Any other pro tips?

-Matt

2

Set both race and training wheels as tubeless. That way you can get practice in the setup, gain some confidence in it, and learn how to handle a flat in training if it happens in a race.

Normal flat kit but I added a plug to mine.

Add more sealant every 3-4 months. Clean everything out once a year.

3

Hey Matt,

A few things I’ve learned over the last 12 years running a wheel company.

  1. Tubeless is great but I always say you need to be ready for it. A latex tube is generally as fast a a tubeless tire so if you love tubes you can stick with them. Tubeless shines for puncture protection and for competitive athletes I believe it’s worth it.
  2. If you flat on a tubeless tire it’s likely going to be a large hole so in this case I like to carry the times you mentioned along with a dollar bill. This can be placed between the tube an the tire to get you home.
  3. If you flat in a race a tube is great just know tubeless tires are not designed to work with tubes and you should be cautious if you are going to continue a race with this set up.
  4. Sealant maintenance is dependent on a few factors. One most people do not think about is the humidity of your area. Places like Las Vegas where we are located tubeless sealant dries out really quickly. In humid areas it last a much longer time. If you do let it dry out you will likely only let this happen once. It’s a real pain to clean up when dry.
  5. For airlines just let the air out but don’t break the seal. The lower pressure in the air will cause the tire to expand and you don’t want a bag full of sealant or a damaged tire.
  6. I do not recommend a compressor for set up. If your tape or setup isn’t airtight you can explode a rim. I’ve seen a lot of these. When set up correctly you should only need a floor pump with a well designed internal rim structure.

If you need further help reach out to me on our site and I can send you a tubeless guide.

Ride safe,

Jon

2 Likes
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  1. Generally both training and race. My one exception is I have a rear disc wheel that I use rarely enough that I keep it latex-tubed for most races. I’ll set it up tubeless for absolute A races where I want the extra flat protection. (which paid off for me once big time). In training I’ll throw on the race wheels once in a while to give the sealant a bit of workout…it seems to last longer if it’s not pooled up in one place forever.
  2. Everything you mention. Levers of course. Tube for sure (not latex, as latex can squeeze through small tears in tires extremely well, and that’s the most likely reason you’ll need a tube). Boot. Also if they’re deep wheels, don’t forget to have the tube pre-setup with the necessary valve extender.
  3. I’m a TTer…there is no flat kit! You flat, and you’re done.
  4. Others covered this well. Check on it monthly or so by breaking the bead and peering in to make sure it’s still there and still liquid.
  5. Got nothing there.
  6. Not a huge deal, but after spending years putting sealant in through the valve, I’m now 100% converted to just dumping in while the bead is off, and then pushing bead over. Just easier that way for several reasons. Also if you’re having trouble holding air and you can’t find a leak in the tire 99% of the time it’s the tape. (1% it’s valve related). If you’re installing your own tape, take your time, do not rush it. Make it perfect.
5

Hey Jon, can you expand on this? I can 100% see being careful working with tubes when you’re using hookless, e.g. carefully monitoring pressure as if doing tubeless inflation. But I’ve never heard of an issue with using tubes with hooked rims, e.g. never seen manufacturer’s warnings.

For nearly a decade now I’ve regularly used Vittoria Corsa Speed tires with latex tubes on the track and on the road with zero issue…on Flo, Zipp, HED, and Reynolds wheels…

6

Great question. Yes, primarily in the hookless department it is a no go and unsafe so this needs to be considered and will be based on the wheel being used.

With a hooked rim you are generally fine but your rolling resistance will suffer greatly. Racing in this situation you’re giving up a ton. Obviously a flat in a race likely means you’re out of competition but I’m just pointing out the major issues on the Crr side with tubes in tubeless tires.

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I’m assuming you meant hooked and one is running a butyl tube and not latex?

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Thanks for the catch. Early morning typing. Yes, hooked. My conversations with Continental have led to the issues with tubes in tubeless tires. While I cannot say I have personally tested a latex tube in a tubeless tire I do trust the team a Continental.

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Had tubeless/hookless for 3 months, no disasters yet and some pretty hard riding.

  1. Both
  2. 2 co2, mini tool
  3. Not on my tri bike
  4. n/a
  5. Don’t leave inside a car on a sunny day. Don’t over inflate.
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Jon, can you clarify? You’re saying that even on a hooked rim, a tubeless tire (assuming TLR, not tubeless only) with a tube in it (let’s assume latex), that RR will suffer greatly?

I started a thread on this topic recently and was getting info that basically the difference is negligible.

1 Like
11

That’s my understanding as well. Here’s BRR’s test of tubeless vs. a bunch of different tubes on the 5000S TR.

Tubeless wins by a little bit over latex - but just a few tenths of a Watt @29KPH. That might go out to near a Watt at 40K TT speeds, but that’s still not a lot.

I don’t have links at hand, but I think a few other independent sources have suggested the same thing…that the difference between latex and sealant is not much at all.

1 Like
12

Yes, I have not personally tested this. All of this was based on a conversation I had with Continental. The design of the tubeless tires is not meant for tubes and I was told it impacts the rolling resistance. I would however love to see this tested.

13

Swiss side and DT swiss, which work closely with continental recommend TPU tubes on their wheels. To the point your have the option to buy the already installed in there wheels.

However, I checked with both and they would recommend the non tubeless gp5000 for similar RR and lower weight for that setup.

I guess that has been tested and is coordinated with continental too. For those that do not know, both have hooked wheels.

14

Yes, I would agree with what you are saying. We also use hooked wheels for safety and customer tire selection reasons.

What I am saying is different. I am stating that a tube in a tubeless tire creates an increase in rolling resistance vs. straight tubeless or tires designed by tubeless.

Again, I haven’t tested this, the information was given to me from Continental.

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Check out our YOUTUBE Playlist on this

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I understand you may not be at liberty to share specifics of your conti conversations, but what you’re saying conflicts with BRR and aero coach, who HAVE tested this and said the difference is either negligible or there is absolutely no difference in rolling resistance.

2 Likes
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If this has been studied I’d love to see the link. As I mentioned this was in a conversation and not something I’ve tested.

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So reading this article from BRR it appears to support the conversation I had with Continental. Especially on the butyl side. The conclusion states it doesn’t makes sense to use tubes with a tubeless tire. Am I missing something here?

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I have a set of tubeless wheels that I have not been bold enough to try and set up yet

I did not know about the humidity. I live in a desert where the humidity is around 8% or lower most of the year - can you expand on what I’d need to keep an eye on?

If I am mostly training on a trainer and wheels are sat, how frequently should I ride them, what do I need to do to keep them / sealant in good condition