Hezbollah as an organization is designated a terrorist organization. That designiation does not differentiate between hezbollah the hospital administrator and hezbollah the militant.
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You see no problem with that?
So if Hamas claims Israel is a terrorist organization, they can just blowing up Israeli hospital administrators?
I am sure Hamas would agree with your argument here, but I am comfortable saying I would not agree with you and Hamas.
Part of why we would agree is because Hizbâallah is designated as a terrorist organization by the US, Canada, Australia, the UK, Argentina, Bahrain, Colombia, Germany, Honduras, the GCC, the EU, Israel, Malaysia, Paraguay, New Zealand, Saudi Arabia, and UAE. There is not an equivalency between saying Hizbâallah and Israel. One is a subnational designated terrorist organization and the other is a recognized nation state.
And while you might speak about the separation between their military wing and their political wing, Hizbâallah itself does not seem to make that distinction.
âHezbollah has a single leadership,â according to Naim Qassem, Hezbollahâs second in command. âAll political, social and jihad work is tied to the decisions of this leadership ⌠The same leadership that directs the parliamentary and government work also leads jihad actions in the struggle against Israel.â
I donât care how bad a government or a political party are. I donât think killing civilians is ok just because they are under a government they I disagree with.
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âHezbollahâs 1985 Arabic-language manifesto states that âour struggle will end only when this entity [Israel] is obliteratedâ.â
Why do you defend a terrorist organization?
Yes I do have a problem with it. I also have a problem that hezbollah has purposefully extended their tentacles into the civilian sector. They are not a recognizable military force. They donât play by the rules, so I pin unnecessary civilian casualties on them.
For clarification, I do not think there are necessary civilian deaths. That last sentence just reads weird but hopefully make sense.
Everytime I read about or hear attacks from Israel, I am amazed at their ability to take out targets. And then, I again question that with all their technological ability and what seems a detailed knowledge of their enemies, how on earth they allowed the multi-prong attack on October 7th occurred in the first place.
More fun news:
The doctor said that the injuries were unlike anything they had seen before, mainly wounded eyes and hands, a result of patients looking at their pagers before they exploded. Never do you have eye emergencies at this frequency. Itâs transforming 2,000 people into disabled [people] at the same time,â another doctor at the same hospital said. Human Rights Watch (HRW) said on Wednesday that the attack could be a violation of international humanitarian law, through its use of pagers as booby traps, and that it had put civilians at risk. âThe use of an explosive device whose exact location could not be reliably known would be unlawfully indiscriminate ⌠and as a result would strike military targets and civilians without distinction,â Lama Fakih, the director at HRW, said.
The Likud party charter states their goal is the elimination of a Palestinian state.
If I say âkilling civilian Israeli, even if they are Likud party members is wrongâ am I defending terrorists?
And Likud is actually the ruling party of Israel for the past 20 or so years.
In our case, September 11th, I believe it was a breakdown in collaboration across intelligence agencies.
I am going to disagree with the argument that you and checks notes Hamas make.
Wouldnât Hamas also claim that Israeli civilian deaths are the fault of Israeli government for not playing by the rules?
You see the problem with using the same argument that terrorists use to justify their violence against civilians is bad? That sadly shouldnât be a question, the give away should âsame arguments that terrorists use to justify violence against civiliansâ.
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i guess i have a blind spot in my supposed understanding of geography and world politics. what is the name of that that palestinian state that the likud party wants to eliminate?
âThe US State Department designated Hizballah as a foreign terrorist organization in October 1997. More than 60 other countries and organizations, including the EU, the Arab League, and the Gulf Cooperation Council, have also designated Hizballahâeither in part or in its entiretyâas a terrorist group.â
TMK the Likud party does not have this same designation.
Again I ask: Why do you defend terrorists?
Ok I got it then. So if Palestine, Lebanon, Iran, Syria, etc calls the Likud party a terrorist origination. Then we are good.
Just like Hezbollah, it is designated a terrorist organization by multiple countries. Just like Hezbollah it is not recognized nation state.
Then we would agree that Hezbollah started blowing up a campaign volunteer for Likud party member, it would be bad.
Isnât this the reason the law of armed conflict doesnât say âthey are no longer non combatants if they are trash collectors for a political party that the US has designated a terrorist organization.â
I donât know what you mean by âthen we are good.â Indiscriminate civilian casualties are not ok. Doesnât really matter if youâre a legitimate sovereign nation state or a terrorist organization. Neither one gets a pass. But no, a couple countries canât just desginate Israel as âterroristâ and then all of the sudden they are equivalent to Hizbâallah. I really recommend you read up on Hizbâallahâs history, because itâs not something that puts it on par with any recognized nation state.
The law of armed conflict doesnât apply to terrorists, because they, by design and definition, operate outside of existing law and international norms. The reason we can talk about LOAC with respect to Israel is because we hold them to that standard, because we consider them a legitimate state and a member of the international community, and not terrorists.
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The Likud party charter clearly states that a Palestinian state canât exist and the lands of that state should belong to the Jews.
It is literally the first thing their charter says:
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You keep bringing Hamas into the discussion. This discussion is about Israel targeting Hezbollah. And last time I checked, neither Hezbollah or Hamas have made any attempts to not target Israeli civilians, in fact they have purposely targeted civilians and their sole mission is to eliminate Israel, which is chuck full of innocent civilians.
When evidence is presented that Israel targets Lebanese civilians, Iâll come around your way of thinking. Until the designated terrorist organizations of Hezbollah and Hamas decide to follow the accepted laws of war, I donât place blame on Israel for the deaths of innocent civilians, whom the terrorist purposefully hide behind and within.
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I have seen enough of IDFâs MO to have some confidence that they are fighting fair and do a reasonable amount of effort to avoid civilian casualties. I donât recall that level of effort during the 2003 invasion of Iraq, for example. Like I said, all wars have collateral damage. That does not mean IDF is targeting civilians in spite of the terrorists propaganda that lefties in the western world love to push too.
Also, why would a civilian be using a pager purchased by Hezbollah to itâs militants? The only purpose of a pager is to cheaply get codes to a ton of people. Most civilians I know use cellphones.
Youâve been very busy defending a terrorist organization. Publicly.
Are you sure you want to be using the computer youâre using? What about your phone? The clothes you wear: are you sure theyâre safe? That toilet paper youâre using⌠The door handles you touchâŚ
You might want to think very critically about the organizations you repeatedly and publicly defend.
What sort of military action by Israel against Hizballah would be effective while also meeting your standards of ethics? If it were a traditional military, we would likely agree that Israel needs to focus its actions against military targets, while recognizing that some collateral losses would still be likely. But, given the way that Hizballah operates, that isnât highly practical and effective. The rules of war need to take into account the nature of your enemy.
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