So wondering about how much wetsuit / OWS you should do approaching a wetsuit race, compared to swimming in a pool. Will more swimming in a wetsuit make you faster vs swimming in a pool?
So I’m a 1:30 pool swimmer (no wetsuit) per 100yd (25yd pool) with open turns, but in open water in a wetsuit I’m closer to 1:36. I know the wetsuit makes me about 9 sec faster per 100 in a pool.
My cadence is about 70 if that matters.
Is that split pool vs open water about right, or do I need to work more in open water.
The more - the better. But don´t just float away for endless hours in the OW.
You need to consider and fix that gap, and unless the water is really choppy, then I´d expect you could swim sub1:30 in OW.
Find a buddy or a group and practice drafting on feet, practice sightning and navigation.
Pretty good stroke rate at 70.
I find that I’m roughly the same speed speedo/pool as OWS/wetsuit. The extra floatation compensates for the lack of wall pushoffs.
If you are that much slower OWS, it pays to figure out what the driver is. Is it head/body position? More frequent sighting? Going off course? Pacing? Something else?
Personally, I tend to look forward more in open water (easier to sight and to follow toes) and have been working to maintain the head/body alignment I have in the pool.
That’s not unusual. I check out the results of most folks I know who swim in the Triclub with me and on fairly measured courses they all swim 7-10 sec slower in open water than the pool, even the good ones. I’ve only exceeded my pool times on current assist swims or courses with a run in the middle of two swim laps that I’m not sure are this measured right.
if you are fine with a wet suit, and not panicked swimming in ow, id just do all training in pool.
but you need to be realistic. when you say you are 130 pool swimmer, what is that over, with what rest, is that with a draft, is that day in day out pace?
also dont pay much attention to what your OW pace is. its so variable, was the watch accurate, shit weather? off course? drafting?
go out and do 3x800 on 10 seconds rest (6.5 - 7.5 out of 10 effort) and what would your pace be?
better to just work at getting your 2500-3000 average speed down in the pool, holding shorter intervals, holding faster pace, all different ways to measure it
some times it is good to get a better sensation of what sustainable stroke and pace feels like.
the real comparison is people who you swim with often and youre about the same in the pool, and how they go relatively to you in the open water
So I can hold that 1:30 in a pool on a 1000 for time in my own lane. For open water that is in an ocean bay (back bay in Newport) which is basically a very large salt water pool where 1 lap around the outside is ~1000 yards. I’m measuring that speed off the watch gps so it removes issues with sighting, which I suppose begs the question on how accurate a Garmin 955 is, but I don’t have another way to measure that other than a watch. The nice thing at back bay is it’s dead calm flat so it removes that variable along with currents.
You should definitely still get as much OWS training in addition to the pool.
Major issues that will prop up if unprepared for OWS:
Wetsuit fit issues (you can still avoid this with pool wetsuit swims)
Sighting practice. MAJOR issue. You might be a 1:30/100 pool swimmer, but throw in sighting for an IM distance, and you’re suddenly 7-10sec/100 slower over that long distance.
Choppy conditions
COLD water. Can lead to panic if unprepared. Even ex-D1 pro experienced swimmers have run into this when going into cold water with no prior acclimation or recent OWS training.
I’ve found the more OWS do, the better. Might be something as subtle as learning to glide through the water more effectively with the wetsuit, but I can be not-so-great in the pool but doing ample OWS and I’ll swim my best times in races, vs best-times in the pool with little to no OWS, and I’ll be back to my slower average typical times - which can be a surprisingly amount slower.
Biggest open water simulation you can add to pool swimming, because it’s a breath control skill you essentially practice every single swim session that then only makes you more and more comfortable in the water.
There is no such thing as best times in ow. It’s all just relative to the field and how close you are to your AG first out water or front of field. But if you find the more ows works for you that is great.
The points you raise are very simple to address
I had assumed the op was fine in ow in any events
Wet suit fit Just pull the thing higher up into the groin and higher off the wrists. More movement. Obviously it needs to vaguely fit
Choppy. Yeah you can’t be out for a Sunday stroll when it’s choppy. Got to swing harder and faster above the water with arms.
Sighting. This is easy as anything. Just do one sight per lap in the pool and you’ll learn to get better it. Assuming there is not some complete crazy sighting technique. Monty put this to bed last time. You either sight every 10 or so stokes or you draft and sight every 30-40 strokes.
Cold water panic. The thing is you must forcefully exhale, you need to be mentally present and push the air out. Again pretty easy stuff…
I am starting to regress and do some sets with open turns and no goggles in the pool. Requires way more forceful upper body movements turning around. Trying to hold the same time cycles. Hard work.
You may have to define what OWS training is though. Cus I see a whole bunch of athletes going to their local lake get on their orange float buoy to be seen, and they pick an island that’s 2k away or they swim 1k up and 1k back, and then get in their car and leave. And they’ll do that in a group, it’s like wtf your missing the whole fun of swimming in a group in open water. That’s like only half right. You need to be working up specific skills, go spend 4 mins with your buddy and yall just roll around on one another, figure out how to roll around someone, learn what it feels like to bump, get tugged at, etc. Go swim hard for 6 mins and tread water for 2 mins, do that 8 times, etc. Add specific skills to get the most out of your ows experience, not just “2 mi open water swim”.
Quoted for truth. You never really know how well you have swum in OW until you look at the results. I’ve swum alleged 1500m courses in every thing from 14:00 to 30:00, and the 30 was actually one of my best b/c it was against a strong current.
I disagree with this for most swimmers. Sighting efficiently and effectively takes practice, as is making sure you’re swimming truly straight in between sighting. (Everyone can swim straight in a pool, it’s trickier with chop/current, and other people rolling around you.)
Go into your next race with next to zero or minimal sighting practice, and you’ll suffer from a sore neck that will hurt you on the bike, and you also will likely waste a good deal of energy popping that head up more than you would have given with practice in the wetsuit. The more chop, the more energy-costing the sighting.
I don’t know how people can sight like 30-40 strokes as you mentioned. Even elite OWS in the olympics etc are sighting like every 6th to 10th stroke, even when they are in a tight pack.
A good test to see how straight you swim is to swim a lap in the pool with eyes closed and see how far you get before hitting a lane line. If you know how many strokes you take per length, you can open your eyes a couple of strokes before that so no concern about running into the wall.
In OWS drafting someone helps reduce the need for sighting…assuming they stay on course ;).
If your cadence in the pool and OW are the same, then yes it does matter. It should be much slower in a full wetsuit than a speedo pool swim. And yes to you are doing something wrong too, you should not be 6 seconds slower with a wetsuit in OW, apples to apples at your pace. And all the folks telling you that is what happens to them, well they have problems too. Best not to follow folks with problems advice…
I’m 7-10 sec faster in the pool with the wetsuit than not. Doesn’t matter in the races I do, pace still works out somewhat slower than my pool pace. Again, not just me, all the folks in my triclub are swimming similar paces. I thought 2 guys were beating me in OWS vs the pool but I smoked 'em in the last race!
I’m not talking about wetsuit in a pool swimming, dont think the OP is either. Unless I misunderstood what he was asking, I think it was non wetsuit pool vs OW wetsuit…