Not necessarily out of the sport, some guys just like a new toy every year or two. I wouldn't take the ST classifieds as typical of "triathletes." It's the denizen of the elites (in terms of high-end equipment).

$5,000 to $6,000 is positively CHEAP compared to motorcycles or sports cars or RV's or opiates or mistresses or fine art or any of a thousand other hobbies and diversions. Everybody has their priorities -- and their blind spots.

15-20 bikes at $25k-$40k.... and you are ranting about how others spend their money??? Pure gold!

I guess you can think of it like any other item people collect. I have friends who own several cars, or guitars. I've never understood that. Once I get a car, I drive it until it falls apart or my wife forces me to get another one. To me, it seems crazy to get a car and then go looking for another one in 3-4 years....or to have a second or third one. But, to each their own. If a person wants to do that then I am cool with it.

Sometimes its just fun to have new toys. I love my bikes but do believe in the N+1 concept. If I go somewhere, and rent a bike, I end up wanting that bike. If I am watching the Tour, and I see a really cool looking bike then I want that bike. I don't always buy them but I do (probably) have more bikes than I can actually use right now

I used to wonder about that too.

As I think about it though, if you're the type of person who is willing to spend north of $5k on a superbike, you either have a lot of disponsable income to burn so it literally doesn't matter, or you care enough about the details of aerotribikes that even after a mere 1-2 years, you're trying to move up to the next greatest and latest bike technology to keep that edge.

It's hard for me to imagine the typical person dropping $5k+ on a current-gen superbike, and then actually riding it for 10 years in a row. Those folks DO exist (I still ride my 2008 Cervelo P2c which was a 'low-end-superbike' back in the day) but in order to do so, I have to accept that I'm missing out on all the cool new stuff. Ok, you can upgrade most of the parts to get stuff like Di2, aero brakes, etc., but it does get ridiculous after a point when your upgrades cost 2x your bike frame.

I knew someone would do the math on that. But that is over a 17 year span, and I have sold most of the old (used) bikes, as I buy the new (used) ones.

Hey. I could care less how/when you spend your money. Just pointing out the hilarious hypocrisy.

The fact that you believe what I bolded is funny. There is no way to know the miles on the bike.

Go look at higher performance cars and you will see they drop by more than a few grand in a year and there are a lot of them for sale.

Yea, and totally missing the point that I have been in the sport 17 years, and actually train and race on the bikes.

Got it. So, 15-20 bikes in 17 years? Who is missing then point? This thread is precious!!

I thought this was going to be a thinly disguised sleep thread

"Early to bed and early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise." - Benjamin Franklin

---

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

Guitars? That’s easy! Acoustic, electric, backup electric for shows, electric in open D with higher action for slide playing, maybe another electric in open G. Oh, a 12-string? Acoustic or electric? Don’t even get me started on pickups...you’re really gonna play a bunch of country stuff with humbuckers instead of single-coil Telecaster pickups?

Let alone basses. Or dobros. Or lap steels.

You can most definitely go as deep as you want on just about any hobby!

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Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team

yup...i also race motorcycles. i can go through a pair of $400 tires in 1 weekend. bicycles are cheap and fairly easy to maintain. and motorcycles are cheaper than cars - so everything is relative. if $5k gets you a high end tri bike that can last years and you put in 10+ hours a week training, this is probably one of the cheapest hobbies ($/minute) spent that I've done in my life.

Guitars? That's like food or shelter...it's a basic need.

To the OP: IM has a survey about participants income don't they? Really don't recall the exact numbers but it seemed to indicate that it is, in general, a relatively wealthy crowd. Assuming, I can convince my better half, I might be getting a motorcycle soon, it is somewhat surprising for me how relatively "cheap" they are, i.e. for $10k you get a lot more material (bigger tires, engine, etc. ) than an equivalent bike.

About the wise part, I don't know, considering how much pain and inconveniences we put ourselves through everyday and it costs us a lot of money...;)

Aint that the truth. I collect watches where $8000 can get you, among other things, a watch buckle. Not the entire watch. Not a full bracelet. Just a buckle - ok,it's a platinum deployant, but still....

It's a grim life if one does not indulge in some area or the other.

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--
Those who are slower than me suck.
Those who are faster than me dope

My other sport is yacht racing and triathlon is cheap compared to that.

But in yacht racing I can't believe how many racers out there get these $10 million yachts and then only use them for one or two races. LOL. I've never spent more than $1 million for any of the dozen yachts I've had in the past decade, and I'm a serious hobby racer unlike those rich posers.

Where did this figure come from? I know a lot of triathletes but none of them come close to 6 figure salaries. I’ve just bought my first Tri bike and paid out around 8k, that’s not because I have that money to burn, I just saw little point in getting a cheaper bike I wouldn’t be happy with and end up switching it again in a year or two... and end up with 17 bikes lol. Most people spend quite big on houses and cars so they look cool for the neighbours, whereas my car is a banger as I have no interest in them. Just about where you prioritise your spending really 🤷🏻‍♂️

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

Exactly what I was going to respond.
I too think a lot of you STers are just addicted to spending money and having new stuff (and more stuff). I feel like I've spent a lot of money on cycling and triathlon and I've only ever bought 2 road bikes (first one a cheap second hand alloy bike, second one a Canyon Ultimate) and one triathlon bike (Felt IA), in a 9 year period. I've had one set of deep wheels for the tri bike, one fluid trainer and just in the last month a high end smart trainer. I've bought one power meter, 3 GPS watches, 3 or 4 heart rate monitors. I upgrade components when there's a good reason. I replace them when they need replacing. I go through a fair quantity of bike tyres, running and cycling clothing, bike chains, running shoes, etc, but really can't justify constantly replacing perfectly good equipment. It's not just about expense either - it's morally wrong in my opinion, and it's environmentally irresponsible. No doubt many will disagree with me there, but whatever.

It's not just about wealth. It's about tech lust, self control, and being willing marketing victims.

I am well below average, then

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

Since it is between him and his wife that breaks down to a new bike every two years. And if that is the only bike he is riding for those two years he is probably putting a decent amount of mileage on it. Plus he said he buys used and in the $2000 range

He is comparing this to some people on here that buy themselves a new >$6000 bike each year. If you do that math on that, the difference in a money spent on bike per person per year is $5000. Seems like significant enough difference for you not to be a dick in your response when he’s simply asking a question

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Matt

https://www.teamusa.org/...tisport/demographics: median income is $126k.

I think a lot of the low mileage bikes in classifieds have to do with people only riding their training bikes, something I find ludicrous.

Pretty shocked at that finding I’ll be honest, are US wages high in general? To be on 100k+ in the UK you have to be in a very high end job. I’d also imagine that since 2009 the average triathlete has changed quite a lot with the better access to the sport.


Edit - just read that study and the $126k figure is household income not just their personal income. Safe to assume a fair proportion of them are married/ have partners so that’s a pretty skewed figure that they are using. But at least it kind of makes more sense.

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

a random stranger on the internet is ranting about how others should spend their money and I’m the d—-? Thanks for undescoring my point.

No, I think you're definitely one of those missing the point.

If you start a thread to talk about, essentially, about others spending a lot of money perhaps unwisely or flippantly on bikes and then reveal that you (and/or your spouse) are buying bikes at a rate far above what's necessary to remain competitive, without realising you're in the same category, there is irony.....

See, that's only USAT members


If that included me, it would drop down to $125 or $124K maybe, depending on the size of the sample, and rounding


****

When D'Wife & I were first married, we lived in an apartment complex that rented to pro athletes who had just come to Philly, while they were looking for a "real" home

One of my neighbors was Eagles DB Mark McMillian

Not a tall dude, much like myself. He had some friends from the Eagles come over from time to time: Charlie Garner and Vaughn Hebron ... also challenged in the "Must be this tall to ride" category

Anyway, sometimes we four would play basketball at our complex's court. Four guys, average height: 5'7", average salary: $3M ... when I wasn't playing; average salary: $4M

---

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

This is my neighbor, he has guitars strewn about the house. Some downstairs in the office, some up in the bonus room, random amps so he can play anywhere in the house. But at least with guitars, if you buy right, they CAN maintain their value, or even increase, unlike a bike which is going down only.

As for the bikes, it isn't just rich people, I bought my Madone off a firefighter. Everyone has their hobbies, and you tend to spend your disposable income on things that make you happy. For me, I really enjoy riding good bikes (not great, that doesn't do it). My 9 year old Madone is a BLAST to ride, spirited, quick, light. I don't need a new one, because I like that one. I will happily take a 2-3 year old bike off someone that want's to upgrade to the latest and greatest. I don't need the newest bike to shave the last 2% off my time, I have plenty of low hanging fruit in the engine that needs to be pruned first.

Where are you getting that the average income for a triathlete is in the 6 figures?
But I do agree that there are many other hobbies that are way more expensive that Tri. I came from another hobby of racing drag cars, and let me tell you.... that hobby is expensive as hell.

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- Jordan

My Strava

Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I thought Ironman said the median income of IM athletes was $160k......at the pre race banquets, they'd give info about people who race IM. Now, I know that only involves IM athletes, and not all of triathlon, but I found it interesting (and it counts as a source)

Interesting. I didn't know about that. And 160 is way different than even 100. Crazy

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- Jordan

My Strava

I don't know what average wages are in the US but I do know a lot of folks who make good six figure incomes, performing a variety of jobs:

administrators (for some) medical practices
Nurse practitioners
Physician assistants
Nurse anesthetists
Engineers
Lawyers
Computers (IT, software engineer, etc...)
Insurance agents
Medical device salesman


Notice, I did not mention physicians or CEOs because I wanted to point out more common jobs in the community. So, yes there are a lot of six figure opportunities if you seek them out (choose wisely, career wise)

The only one on that list that surprised me was the nurse practitioner. But sure enough, here in Texas the median is 106k.

Median wage in the US is 30k. Median US household income is 60k. in rough figures.

I’m not saying there isn’t high paid jobs in the community, I’m saying they are most definitely the minority and not typical. For each of those professions you’ve listed there will be many people earning sub 100k in them all. They also tend to work a lot more hours. I’m sure they are far more common in the bigger cities. I’d imagine some very high end salaries are really bumping up that ‘average’ triathlete income.

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

Well most nurses are now classified as non-exempt, so greater than 40 hours in a week (or 8 hours/day in some states) gets them to an OT rate. Holiday and overnight rate offer another pay differential. It can start to add up rather quickly. Having worked with many clients, and seen many types of wages for many jobs/industries, for me, the most surprising was seeing car mechanics pulling in greater than $150k/year (some closer to $200k)....and this was not work on high-end cars.

I know a lot of nurse practitioners and physician assistants, especially because a lot of them used to be regular RNs before obtaining their advanced degrees. They would talk to me about their job offers so I know there's a good number that make $110-130k/year. Most have very good hours too.

A friend has a brother in law who's a PA for a neurosurgery group. He makes close to $250k per year but he works for it

Several really good friends who work as insurance agents. Takes a while to get established, but once they do, it seems to be a really good gig. Make $100-$200k (or more) and make your own hours. My friends seem to be able to go for a ride or run whenever they like.

The report breaks down the ranges and percentiles.

Income
Average income: $126,000

12.9% have incomes under $50K 14.5% have incomes $50-74,999
16% have incomes $75-$99,999
23.4% have incomes $100-$149,999
12.1% have incomes $150-$199,999
8.4% have incomes $200-$299,999
5.5% have incomes over $300K

Many of the professions he listed have medians WELL above the 100k mark. Nurse practioner was the lowest with a median at 106k, with a range of 98 to 123....in Texas. Also, many of those professions are exempt, and not paid by the hour. So working OT doesn't net any more money.

At the beginning of the report they declare it as median... Above the use the word average. Median is the mid-point where half of the population is less and half is more. It is much less sensative to skew like you describe.

Yes I noticed they switched from median in their summary to average in their main report. They also call it household income so I’m assuming partner salaries are also taken into account, which makes the figure more reasonable. I also didn’t mean overtime bonuses is why they earn more, just that higher end jobs which tend to have more responsibility etc tend to over run the standard 37 hour working week, which doesn’t suit everyone, particularly those who train a lot.

I quickly googled nurse practitioner and the first result says “ The average salary for a Nurse Practitioner is £36,779 per year in the United Kingdom.” So I’m guessing it’s a different position over the water. Not that £37k a year is a bad wage either, maybe it’s a regional thing? I mean I know in Wales where I live an average income of 100k is rare, whether that’s personal or whole household. But triathletes are far from rare here!

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

Yeah. I have no idea how to compare data across the pond. But the report was published in US stats, and $126k is roughly 80th percentile for household income here. Obviously, things vary pretty widely across the country with the coastal metroplexes being higher than most of the interior.

That's like the example a teacher friend of mine gave in explaining how statistics can be skewed: There's a bar in a working class neighborhood in Seattle, with a few dozen construction workers hanging out drinking. Average annual income is $40k. Then Bill Gates walks in, average annual income is now $1 million...

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"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"

Wealthy: enough to buy a personal lap pool

Wise: enough to put a wave dampening system in it

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https://www.strava.com/...tes/zachary_mckinney

Worst of the worst are tuning cars, fishing, high end audios and collecting watches.

No one has any opinions nor data on the "wise" part?

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

It is also influenced by upbringing and culture. I grew up in austere environment and very uneasy with spending money. Even though I’m very comfortable in upper echelons of the USAT stats quoted above, I cannot make myself spending almost anything. I have an entry level 5-year old carbon frame and also amazed how people with significantly lower incomes and kids spending 3-4x on bikes!!!

But well, I wouldn’t go as far as judging those people. Severe austerity is also unwise. I’ll probably die with a cheap bike and a very large bank account :)

When did median mean mean?

Math seems off - but ok.

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https://www.strava.com/...tes/zachary_mckinney

It's their money, so be it. But yes, triathlon is a rich persons sport and as technology continues to take over the sport and race fees keep going parabolic, it will become more and more elitist (if that's what you value).

Well I quit triathlon for cycling like 10 years ago, so you're talking to the wrong person.

I disagree and agree with you, though. I disagree in the sense that, no, you don't need to be rich to do triathlon. You can get a $500 used bike, some shoes, etc, and do just fine in lower-cost, local grassroots triathlon.

I agree in the cultural domination of affluence. The IM races resemble catered resort vacations that happen to have a race in the middle. The media coverage centers around all the expensive stuff.

It’s also possible to get into that salary range as a nurse without an advanced degree. Though you typically have to be pretty specialized and not have as great of hours. Completely possible if you’re wise enough though ;-)

One could even feasibly do so with a family while racing professionally.

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Adam Feigh
Pianko Law, Speed Hound, Castelli, Sailfish, Base
Feighathlon.com

Ok lets be real here. Nobody who chooses tri as a lifestyle and main interest uses a 500 road bike and cheaps out on everything else for the long haul.

The cheap stuff is for the newbies and dabblers. Once you are commited to tri for years you will want to do more than the local tri and with bettwr gear.

Tri is definitely for those with assets. If not the equipment and race fees, the time it takes to train 3 sports eliminates most folks struggling to pay all the bills.

This is coming from someone riding a 2008 cervelo as my race and training bike.

I cringe at referring to any sport participation as a "lifestyle." But, sure, fine, the person then upgrades to a $2000 used 2014 Cervelo P3. Good to go. Sure, triathlon takes some expense. There's a good amount of equipment needed. But there's no way around that. In almost any sport. But you don't need to be "wealthy" to do triathlon.

There's no need to fixate on the dude that bought a Dimond last year, and just sold it to buy a P5X. (I have no problem with that guy - he does us a service be letting us buy those bikes at like 50% off!)

I'm posting here after a while but arent you the troll that the new member FAQ warns us about?

/pink

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--
Those who are slower than me suck.
Those who are faster than me dope

Sorry. The conversation at that point had been entirely about money. You quoted a post listing the prices of motorcycles and responded with a post about $8000 watch parts you collect.

I incorrectly assumed were were still talking about money since that was the only context at the time. My bad. Sorry.[/quote]
Ah fair enough, sorry for being unclear.

And I should make it very clear that I most certainly am NOT in a demographic bracket where I could buy a $8000 buckle. Or rather, I can afford the buckle, I suppose.. but the watch it is meant to go on? Nope. :)

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--
Those who are slower than me suck.
Those who are faster than me dope

Clever marketing by Ironman, putting it out there that the average triathlete has a very high income.

"Buy this experience which is going to be very hard and very expensive, like all these other successful people do."

You reckon? I have always thought the nature of the sport lends it self to a certain demographic and personality profile, atleast among the keen enthusiast segment (ie, Slowtwitch, not Pathetic Triathletes group), and the Ironman event costs are more of a filter than enabler.

Grandfondos be similar as well.

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--
Those who are slower than me suck.
Those who are faster than me dope

An ARNP isn't a nurse. They make an easy ~$120k

That too.

But yes I imagine there's some selling going on here . "This is something expensive for life-winners"-bit like how you sell golf.

What if the average competitor worked for minimum wage, had questionable hygeine*, and slept in their car? I doubt Ironman would be quite so keen to broadcast it

* 1 out of 3 I'll own up to

+1 on this! and good marketing too, the 'rich' folk lap it up... the 'poor' folk know differently.

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

Wealthy people want to tick the IM box, buys all the shit complete the IM and realise they dont want to sacrifice that much rime the next year.

And lot of people just like to buy gadgets way above what they need.

Personally my mindset is that i need to earn the right to buy an awesome bike etc. eventhough i could buy a px series I dont feel fast enough for it to matter

Ha, fair point :)

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--
Those who are slower than me suck.
Those who are faster than me dope

What people spend there money on should really never be any of others business.

Couple grand on a bike is cheap especially if that's your only hobby.

I do track days with a car, love scotch, and throw in 5 kids to boot.....hence no $8k bike, but it's all about what I want to spend my money on.

Exactly. But the intimidation of all those fancy bikes contributes to keeping people away. And really there are a lot of people out there with way more bike than ability.

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Pete Githens
Reading, PA

 


Glad I am off the hook for this question since I am not a triathlete. :-)
Otherwise I am guilty as heck for the rest of it though had it been, "how wealthy are recreational cyclist posers and how wise?".

Fun and entertaining thread though. :-)

hand raised high......... Me!!!

But the intimidation of all those fancy bikes contributes to keeping people away.
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Do you people ever go to your local sprints and olys? I ask because out here in my neck of the woods, we have at least 1/3 of the field riding cheapos. I've seen a women on her cruising bike with the baby seat still attached. More mountain bikes than I can count (including complaints that the wheel racks provided by the race weren't wide enough to accommodate... then the race director went out and got a fatter rack for the next race). Lots of entry level aluminum tri bikes as well. I'd say that the number of people riding a super bike is fewer than 5% of the field. I think I saw only 1 disk at my last event.

I really doubt that the quality of bikes is what's keeping people away from tri. But, that's a completely different discussion.

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Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/

I have the exact same experience at my local races. I've even seen somebody with a basket on the front of their bike, and inside the basket was a sandwich!

It's only once you get the IM branded events do you see the vast majority of carbon tri bikes. But IM is a totally different animal and you really have to be committed to the sport in many ways much more than even financial. Think about this, if you want to be "healthy" you could probably get away with working out 5 hours a week or so with a mixture of leisure bike rides, runs, lifting some weights at the gym etc. Then if you assume that typical IM training will take up an AVERAGE of 12 hours per week for the better part of 26 weeks, that means you are spending 182 hours over the typical amount of time you would workout to remain healthy. Multiply that by $15/hr which is what you could make at a part-time job pretty much anywhere around here where I live, and that's $2,730 in cost for your time assuming you take a pretty low wage job. If you're more specialized and could get a side consulting gig, that number climbs quite a bit. And that's just one half-year training block.

Once you start doing that math, you realize that people dropping $10,000 on a bike they use for a couple seasons isn't all that crazy and not even close to the biggest expense you have in the sport.

And this is coming from a cheap-ass who just finally (yesterday) bought my first real TT bike (2019 P2) after riding a frankenbike I fashioned out of an aluminum Caad10.

The first local sprint triathlon that I raced was in a rural town of 25,000 in the midwest. It was a spectacle in terms of a dick measuring contest as any triathlon tends to be. High end bikes, wheels, and discs left and right. You had the odd totally noncompetitive athlete on lesser bikes, but you could tell 9/10 it was a one and done.

I showed up to my first ride with the local cycling club on my $2,500 bike and post ride everyone is telling me I need a power meter (Quarq no less) and di2. I'm like WTF...These people obviously have way more money than me and perhaps less sensibility.

I don’t think anyone is saying you need to be rich to do triathlon. I think he was saying saying (or at least I am saying) that wealthier people do the sport. There’s a difference. I agree with you you can get into this sport for what you consider cheap-$700 or so. But you don’t seem to appreciate that is actually an expensive price entry point that pales in comparison to the inexpensiveness of, for example, soccer or basketball which require nothing more than the shoes on your feet and a ball.

Couldn’t agree more with this. I did my first sprint on a MTB, there was commuter bikes, bikes with panniers and all sorts along with a few IM guys and team GB guys on better bikes, none of which laughed at or intimidated anyone else and we’re more than encouraging. Unsure of some of the communities some people seem to be from on here. I have a lot of Tri friends, many IM/multi IM friends that compete on bikes ranging £500-2.5k, most of whom couldn’t even tell you the names of most super bikes on the market. This sport is pretty much as expensive as you want to make it.

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

Just go into any bike/tri store and ask what a typical entry-level true TT level trike bike costs. It's north of $2k. And looks scary with aerobars, etc.

And in my local tris here in Norcal, $5k bikes are very normal for AGs over 40. I did one 2 years ago where I had the absolute lowest cost bike in all 13 of my AG, and I ride a Cervelo P2c (2008) with race wheels - the next cheapest bike was probably a current-gen Cervelo P2 with 105 components and race wheels better than mine. It was pretty ridiculous, honestly.

Tri is as expensive as you want to make it, but I have no doubt it scares off a lot of people who intend to give it a shot when they see and hear how much the gear costs, and think 'nah, I'll just go do an obstacle course instead of dropping north of $1.5k on a bike I might use for one season.'

Same story, different sport. https://www.golfdigest.com/...oo-poor-to-play-golf

https://www.reddit.com/...oming_too_expensive/

Every year I volunteer at a couple of "intro to tri" clinics held in conjunction with a local reverse sprint. Few, if any, tri bikes, and not that many carbon frames. But lots of mountain bikes, hybrids, lower end road bikes, even once had a woman on an Electra Townie (which she used in the race). The one common denominator is that everyone there is stoked and really looking forward to doing the race. And I've done a few races where my 12 year old QR Lucero with 105 was the closest thing to a superbike...

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"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"

Actually these days I ONLY do local sprints and olympics and am amazed at the expensive hardware I see showing up. My expensive hardware is gone and I'll be racing on my gravel bike from now on.

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Pete Githens
Reading, PA

People are showing up to these things on super bikes left and right. The stories of the field showing up on fattys, mountain bikes and hybrid bikes are a joke. I see 55 year old nurses showing up on their first bike being a P5 and their SO giving them the princess diva treatment. Can't change a flat or oil a chain, but loves to ride. Lmao. That is the new normal in this sport. It's also why you don't see 20 year old bartenders or Walmart workers getting in the mix. The sport is NOT accessible. Nobody wants to join knowing their at a comeptitive disadvantage because they don't have the money to buy the gear. As bike prices continue to skyrocket the sport will continue to diminish. My friend just dropped like $5,500 on his first triathlon bike. Entry level, but with disc brakes and name brand deep section wheels. No power meter or di2. He didn't need the wheel upgrade and I would have recommended against it, but it's his choice. Either way, he easily could have spent near $10,000 with di2 and a Quarq for an entry level frame and components. This sport is becoming more of a joke every day, even though I really do love it. I just hate that the costs are getting out of hand.

I always question the logic in use in these threads. I'm not sure about the validity of using examples of people who HAVE joined Tri and spent $$$$ on a super-ish bike, as "why others are NOT joining." It seems a much better example would be:

I had a friend who wanted to do a tri, but I told him he'd never be competitive if he didn't get at a $10k bike. So he didn't start.



Not really. I always see a ton of them around here at local races (sprints and olys).

It's also why you don't see 20 year old bartenders or Walmart workers getting in the mix.
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Once again, I disagree. The reason you don't see 20 something's in sport is because they are typically going out on Fridays and Saturdays, leaving Sunday morning competitions unwelcoming. When I was in my 20s, I was doing 5ks. The 20-25 AG regularly had a grand total of 4 people (me, my roommate, some dude who worked nights and this was at the end of his shift, and one guy that was trying to lose weight). When we tried to get others involved, they didn't whine about the cost of entry. They just had more fun (in their opinions) things to do.

A vast majority of my tri-circle is inhabited by educators (teachers, TA's, social workers), I.E. not anywhere near the median income as published. We get along in sport quite nicely. The most expensive ride in our mix is a P3.

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Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/

Imo triathlon is a cheap sport, all you need are
1. Tri-suit - about $100
2. Bike - about $500 - $1000
3. Goggles - about $20
4. Running shoes - about $100 - $200
5. Race fee - about $50 - $100 each race
6. Nutrition - about $20 each race

This is not true where I live. Although I don't have many 20s in the club I'm in, there are many in other clubs doing local triathlons as well.

This isn't true. Participation in sports peaks in the teens, and then declines until death. People in their 20's are engaged in more sports than people in their 30's and 40's. And most sports after the teens involve weekend mornings.

IM triathlon is different, like golf.

Edit, just following up with some interesting data from the U.S. gubmint.

Huge correlations to income and age.

Inactivity (in sports) by age:



Inactivity by income:



Total Inactivity by Year:

I seriously challenge you to find me just ONE person who actually did an entire year of triathlon using that budget.

Better yet, you take 10 aspiring new triathletes, give them that budget and list, and tell me hwo many are actually going to stick with it as opposed to going over it by 2-3x. Almost everyone who does tri has two or more of all of the above excluding bike and trisuit - and you forgot to add all the extra clothing expenses for training clothes.

I feel like I do triathlon about as cheaply as you can do it with the except of my pricey YMCA membership that runs $1000+/yr since I've been in it long enough now that I have all the fixed cost stuff (Kickr, TM, Vasa, clothes), and I STILL managed to spend nealry $1.5k last year (excluding the YMCA membership!) for a measly 3 very local races requiring zero hotel or long travel. It's hard for me to imagine anyone who's more than a dabbler doing it on a lot less, honestly, if you realistically track your tri-related expenses - I'm pretty sure I'm on the low end of expenses for a serious triathlete.

Exactly! I have a young friend breaking into the sport, who just bought a pair of goggles. He just bought another replacement pair of high end goggles because they fogged. I was like dude...Baby shampoo...He's $50-100 in one month down with freaking goggles.

Another friend went through two road bikes before buying a nice bike. This happened in one year. I told him buy the nice one out of the gate. He didn't listen and compounded the expense. Two years later it's a triathlon bike. He's over $10,000 in when it could have been around $3,000-$5,000.

These are common things that everyone in the sport experiences. Buying the same stuff more than once. Who buys one pair of running shoes a year? The expense chart above comically understated.

Participation in sports peaks in the teens, and then declines until death.
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Things change drastically once you take school participation, such as high school/ college, out of the picture. Take running, for example.

"Runners on average are getting older - the average age of runners in 1986 was 35.2 and in 2018 it is 39.3. This could be due to the fact, that runners have longer racing careers, and also that people are welcome to start racing at an older age. We can see that in the sharp increase in the average age of 5K participant over the last 7 years. The average age of 5K runners has increased from 32 to 40 (25%), for 10Ks it has changed from 33 to 39 (23%), for half marathons - from 37.5 to 39 (3%) and for marathons - from 38 to 40 (6%)...

...For marathons, there is an increase in participation of the youngest participants (from 1.5% to 7.8%), but also a decline in participation of 20-30-year-olds (from 23.2% to 15.4%). It's noteworthy that 40-50-year-olds participation is on the rise (from 24.7% to 28.6%), which is consistent with people having longer racing careers...

...For 5K's we see that the younger participants are in decline, but more and more participants over 40 are joining in. This is consistent with the fact that nowadays people are free and welcome to start racing at an older age.

The proportion of participants bellow 20 in the 5Ks hasn't changed much, but the proportion of 20-30-year-olds has declined from 26.8% to 18.7%. Also, the proportion of 30 to 40 year-olds is shrinking - from 41.6% to 32.9%. The proportion of participants over 40 has grown from 26.3% to 50.4%"
https://runrepeat.com/state-of-running

Triathlon follows a similar trend:
Age and Gender
Average age: 38
59.6% Male 39.5% Female
7% are Under 25 12.8% are 25-29
15.7% are 30-34
19.9% are 35-39
17.3% are 40-44
12.1% are 45-49
7.5% are 50-54
3.5% are 55-59
1.6% are 60-64
0.6% are 65-69
0.3% are 70+
https://www.teamusa.org/...tisport/demographics

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Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/

I was well under that budget for each of the first two years I did triathlons. Here is how:

In the fall of 2013, I bought a brand new 2009 (NOS) tri bike frame for $750 from bike shop across the country via ebay. I sourced bars, box rims, and 10-speed mechanical group-set via ebay, as well. All in, the total bike cost was just less than $1k.

I bought a dumb fluid trainer at my LBS for about $100, a pair used bike shoes from eBay for $20, and spent the winter riding in the basement, swimming and running at the gym (free membership from work). I've never paid more than $7 for any pair of goggles, and have probably only purchased 3 or 4 pairs total.

I ran 20-30 mpw in a few different pairs of Nike, NB, and Asics shoes that I had lying around.

That next spring, I bought a new sleeveless tri suit (eBay) for $25 and a pair of Zoot running shoes for $30 from Shoebacca.

That summer (2014), I raced 9 sprint tris, each of which had entry fee of about $50. All were within driving distance. None involved any hotel stay.

Nutrition - I'm not counting this, because I just did sprints that year. But, gels are a dollar and a can of powdered Gatorade is about $4 and lasts a long time.

My rough math says that's about $1500 for my first year...and that got me entry into 9 races. I've spent a bunch more money on upgraded equipment since 2014, but none of it was absolutely necessary. Plus, I'm still getting mileage out of that initial $1500. That 2009 bike is still my only race bike. I've changed out every single part on that frame since that first year and bought a road bike to train on and reduce wear on the race bike. To this day, I've never spent more than $75 on a wetsuit or $50 on a tri suit, and I still use that original dumb fluid trainer, too.

I wouldn't consider myself just a casual triathlete. I've spent 10-12 hours per week training year-round for the past six years. I do a mix of sprint and HIM (about 6-8) races every year. I'll contend for the overall win or be in the top five in most local sprints. But, I'm certainly not going to finish that high at AG Nats or in half distance races with fields bigger than 400 or people.

My main point...Triathlon is only as expensive as you want it to be.

Do you realize how expensive even the above “cheap” items are compared to basketball, soccer, tennis, and many other sports??? Yes, you can do this sport for far less than a $10k bike but the entry point is still very high compared to many other sports. The vast majority of sports don’t cost nearly the numbers you quote above for older, used equipment.

That isn’t remotely cheap to do a sport.

I do realize that, but I'm a recovering golfaholic, who once played at least one round a day for 125 consecutive days. So tri expenses, while still pretty significant, pale in comparison.

Well yes, but that is probably the most expensive sport also played by wealthy persons.

Well of course if you remove ways that younger people do sports from the data, you're left with ways that older people do sports.

Here in Utah it seems like things are just fine. There's a solid local racing scene. Some people on superbikes, some people on road bikes, some people on mountain bikes. Collegiate tri clubs at the U of U and BYU, will be a solid number of people in their 20's racing this season. I know so many college kits who saved up and bought a used tt bike, generally a p2c or similar, and are fast on it. Cost doesn't really ever seem to be an issue

You're joking, right?

Nope, you? I mean I’m not taking an exhaustive survey of every sport but, yes golf is absolutely up there for sure.

Auto racing.

Haha right I knew you would say that. Much smaller fringe sport than golf. Again my comment wasn’t mean to cover every sport in the world. But, for main-stream sports (I’m not talking about watching as I realize how popular watching nascar is), golf is probably the most expensive.

For just the equipment, sure. But, like triathlon, the upper limits can be open-ended depending on context. If you want to be a high-level amateur tennis or soccer player, you can end up paying a fortune in travel and club memberships.

One of my friends wrecked his race car into the wall at 130 mph and thought nothing of buying a slightly used BMW M5 with about $52K of engine, exhaust, and suspension upgrades to use on the track the next week.

125 consecutive golf days - that is impressive - well done!

I am a cheapskate and I think I do triathlon about as cheaply as it can be done, but not as a conscious decision. My £700 road bike is 12 years old - and I bought my shoes at the same time - why would they ever need to be replaced?

I can only remember buying 3 pairs of goggles in that time - why do people need to keep replacing them? I bought a wetsuit and a tri-suit about 5 years ago that both still seem fine.

I am mainly a runner and do get a new pair every 5 / 6 months.

But I think it's just like anything in life - you make choices and spend your money (if you're lucky enough to have any) as you see fit. My wife did triathlons for a couple of years and bought a heap of more expensive equipment that will never be used again - she's onto her next thing now.

Similar situation is when I'm riding my bike through some smaller towns nearby, I'll see a $60,000 house/trailer with a $70,000 Ford Raptor or Corvette outside.. And this is a not just a one time sighting, so you know the people are not visitors. I always tell my buddies "I cannot imagine having a car that costs as much as my house". But, some people are "car people" so that's what they want. Again, to each their own

I never understood either

An ex girlfriend explained to me

She told me. I know I’m never going to be rich. But I can afford a monthly car payment on a new car

So when I’m driving to work, the store etc I feel rich

If it flies, floats or f**ks, rent it.

This^^^^ is the answer to the OP's question.

I had a buddy of mine giving me a hard time (jokingly) about my new bike and how much it cost. We were in his front yard and he was doing some chores while we talked. As he went on about the cost of my bike I asked him was he was doing. He didn't understand my question until I point out that he was washing his $37,000 ski boat. (I don't own a boat). He clued in and laughed.

Moral of the story. To each their own. Don't judge or compare people's desires, hobbies, or what drives them. We are all individuals.

Well, you can obviously make any sport expensive. I’m talking about obtaining basic equipment and then going out and playing it, whether for fun (which I would analogize to tri training) or competition. I fully recognize you can get basic, functioning tri equipment for maybe $1,000 or so (and I recognize you can go even cheaper but that is probably a good estimate of old, but still usable equipment). For soccer or basketball, you can spend $10 to get comparable used equipment (a ball). Arguing that tri “only” costs $1,000 or so for bare equipment only supports the argument of just how wealthy the sport really is.

I laugh at guys who are talking about finding some cut rate used frame online and then building and assembling all the components associated with the bike build for $1K. Sure buddy you represent less than 1% of Age Groupers that would know how to go about doing this and then spend the time scouring the internet for a custom build. Can it be done? Absolutley! Do the majority of people who want to race know how to do it? Hell no.

I spent the better part of twelve month looking for my dream bike online in 2013. In shop it was going for about $4,000 new at the LBS. I got mine used as a demo bike for $2,300. The vast majority of people are not doing that kind of thing. They are paying top dollar.

I also laugh at the guy who says he ran in various branded shoes he had laying around. More bullsh#t. As if they were free Asics, Nike, Adidas that were just laying there for use at no cost. People need to be real about the rising cost of this sport and the exclusion aspect. It absolutely pushes a lot of people away. The whole disc brake bike thing is a perfect example. It's a total scam by the bike industry that hurts existing riders that have invested a lot of money in wheels.

I totally agree but my point is also that even if it were “only” $1000-$1,500 to start, for people to say that is cheap and not a hurdle is out of touch with reality.

I know right? What about the cost of a running watch, wireless earbuds, run belt, bike computer, bike pump, co2 cartridges, co2 inflator, trainer (fluid or smart), trainer tire, power meter, wetsuit, entry etc. It goes on and on, and on and never stops.

The worst part is the entry cost. It's huge. Once you get past the entry cost it is more manageable.

College club teams man. See a lot of FAST people on 90s steelies.

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JustinDoesTriathlon

Owner, FuelRodz Endurance.

I haven’t purchased a tri bike in more than 10 years, as the one I have still works fine. It’s probably worth 1k in the used market. After the initial fixed costs, you can easily go through many seasons paying less than 1k, all in, for several local, drive to the morning of, Sprint or Olympic distance races.

One slightly out of town HIM blows the budget.

And even if you put off bike maintenance for like 3-4 years like I did, it'll bite you on the backside when you have to replace a bunch of stuff, possibly even big stuff like rusting components and cockpit. Easily several hundred dollars for bike maintenance alone, and if you do it yourself and have to buy the tools to even do the maintenace, you're looking at $500+ right off the bat.

Serious question

What bike maintenance?

I have approx 24,000 miles (many on the trainer) on a 2011 Cervelo. I oil the chain have changed the rear cassette and chain once and a few new tires and inner tubes



What am I missing?

Something like this will get you started

https://www.bicycling.com/...53/bike-repair-tips/

Cables - but that doesn't require much in the way of tools - a cable cutter ($5-$15?) maybe if you don't already have something suitable.
Brake pads - again doesn't require much in the way of tools, just an allen key that you will surely already have, if only on a multi-tool in your repair kit.
Bar tape - you might need a knife or scissors

In terms of specialised tools, really you just need a chain whip and lockring tool for changing cassettes and everything else short of bearing changes is just simple hand tools you probably have anyway (scissors, allen keys, cable cutter, screwdriver). I struggle to see how he's arriving at anywhere near $500. I'd guess $25-$40 for the tools to change a cassette and $30-$40 for the other non bike-specific items you probably already have. So maybe $80 at a very tenuous stretch. Self maintenance costs time and effort but it's fairly inexpensive in terms of money.

This equals wisdom?

Triathlon is not a cheap sport. Just take a look of the pro fields and even age group fields and you hardly will find africans, southamericans , ... why? they standard of life is low..but they play football or run, because they barely need a pair of trainers...
Apart from this, I have followed the sport for more than 20 years, and the expense in equipment is the part of the game that I like the least. Just recently took up training and bought a 600usd second hand bike... I dont judge anybody on spending their money in whatever they want. Right now, i have no job, but even I were working, I would not spend too much. I think getting older makes oneself less competitive (i am 40) (even I focus in improvements)...anyhow, i respect all the opinions and options, but my choice is training more instead of buying more..
BTW, I could tell you some stories of semi pro triathletes and duathletes with precarious jobs, spending all their savings in trips, equipment, fees,etc and sacrifying their education for triathlon...which is a not very lucrative sport. I just dont get it...but we are all grownups...

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Spaniard. Sorry for my english for the sensitive ones :P

Hah you gotta be KIDDING me. Seriously reality check needed there!

I thought EXACTLY as you did when I first attempted my very own bike maintenace, thinking it the parts tools and everything would come in well under $200. I even had your exact tool estimate, of about $80, given that allen keys, cable cutter, chain tool, don't cost much.

I then first attempted my first must-do repair. Replace rusted front brake. Easy, right? Well aside from the cost of the brake, you need brake cables, brake housing, bar tape to redo the tape after you cable it, grease, allen keys. Then I found I needed a longer front screw for the frame to fit the newer ultegra brake. Not even counting the brake itself, the cost of all that was nearly $80 on Amazon.

That led to what i was alluding to earlier about delayed cost repairs. Turns out my cockpit was rusted and the screws rusted so badly I couldn't even remove them - had to do that before replacing the brake since the cabling goes along the cockpit, which needed angle adjusting. Numerous tries, including electric drill with screw drill-out set didn't work to remove the screws, so new cockpit needed. That costs a lot, but I went budget got a aerobars + base for <$150. Then i needed tweezers to run the internal cabling, and a neodymium magnet to help the internal cable routing (helps a lot on those older bikes.)

Then you find out your stem is totally rusted out as well. Hopefull you've been covering your bike on the trainer, because that happens. New stem and faceplate needed. And then you find you require a torque wrench for the carbon stem+faceplate, it's not optional - it's absolutely required despite what so crazy poster on this forum says - you will definitely break the stem/faceplate without it (I was horrified with how overtorqued my road bike face metal stem faceplate was once I got the torque wrench!).

And while you're redoing your Cervelo cabling, you find on older models (mine is 2008) it's a royal pain to run the internal cabling. So you get the Park Tool Internal Cable routing kit, which turns out doesn't help AT ALL.

And if you're a noob - don't even think you're going to get the cabling and housing all perfect on your first try. You'll probably realistically go through 3 sets before it's actually correct (although you can live with slightly incorrect if you're lazy.) Then you find you have to get extra endpieces for the cut cable ends. And then you find you need extra or different housing caps for your frame contact points

Oh - and that annoying mild shifting problem you've just ignored for years? Turns out the only way to fix it is with the deraileur hanger alignment tool. There is no substitute. It's a great tool, and odds you WILL need if if your bike has been ridden plenty and moved around a lot in 5+ yrs. Goes for $80, I think.

The biggest thing I haven't mentioned though, that dwarfs all the tool and parts bills I accrued - TIME. I had no idea of how many stupid mistakes one can make with doing this stuff. They're not hard to recognize and fix, but man as a noob you will make TONS of them, which costs you tons of time. I'd estimate at my work dollar equivalent, I spent a least $5k in work-hour time learning to do all this stuff on my bike - and far from a stellar job.

It all looks cheap and easy on youtube - until you try it. One stupid thing goes wrong, then the next, and all of a sudden, you're in a money and time pit. Oh, and even after all that hard work and money I poured in to that bike, I STILL had to take it to the LBS because the rusted stem was so stuck it had to be specially removed (LBS even b*ched about how hard it was for them to do it) - $100 for that to be replaced.

I'm glad I learned all that stuff and got enough tools to do it again in the future, but for sure, I felt seriously misled by posters here and on road bike forums who always crow about how much money they've saved by DIYing their own bike. Especially with regards to how low-ball their initial tool and parts estimates always are. And remember - I did it on the CHEAP - no name-brand stuff, all efficiently priced tools and parts (no high-end or cutting edge stuff - I even run 10 speed partly because of being cheap.) Also, there is a cost of delayed maintenance. You might get lucky and get more years, but wear and tear and sweat corrosion (esp on the trainer) will get you at some point.

I get so frustrated at people who default to "Just do it yourself!" to complete newbies asking about a groupset switch or something way over their head. Yeah, they may get it done. Or they may wreck the bike and need to take it into the shop after they fiddle around with it for 40 hours.

I don't even know what to say. You must be the poster child for "people who should not work on stuff..." I've worked on bikes in every imaginable condition. Garage sale bikes, left in the rain for a decade bikes, bikes ridden on trainers and sweated on, bikes found in the trash in an alley, etc, etc. All of my bikes, my kids bikes, the neighbors kids, my friends, etc. I've been doing it since I was 8 or so---43+ years. I cannot fathom the amount of trouble you seem to have had.

Maybe it comes from my mechanical upbringing, but bikes are just about the easiest thing to work on, of all the things I have taken apart over the decades. Even frozen bolts on a bike are quite a bit easier than they are on things like cars.

Yup, I will freely admit - I clearly SUCK at DIY on my own bikes and hardware! I have no background in the stuff, I don't work on cars or woodwork, and have no friends on relatives to teach me stuff or share tools. So yeah, it was hard for me to learn, even though in retrospect all the stuff I did is actually quite easy to do once you know how to do it.

But experience counts, and I would say I am the NORM and all you folks who can do bike repair without any issues on your first try or two, are the rare ones.

Seriously, if it were so easy for everyone, LBSs would not have any business at their service shops. At least where I am Norcal, when I took my bike for a regular easy 'tune-up' of cable change and derailleur adjustment which they charged $75 + parts for (internal cabling on Cervelo P2C), there was a 2 month wait in June since they were so busy with everyone needing their services.

The other catch that bike repair can actually be easy if your bikes are new or well-maintained. No rusty bolts to deal with, no failing parts, no parts so old that they're hard to track down or replace (just try and find the small plastic cable frame entry guide for my P2c - can't find it anywhere online and have to jigger it with a clunky plastic end cap that protrudes!). But if you've neglected bike repair for years, and have been riding and sweating hard on it, things can get ugly and need outright replacing quick. Hence the value of keeping things tip top regularly.

But it doesn't hurt to try. I'll still bet that unless the prior poster has mechanical or tool background, they'll have a similarly costing and somewhat time consuming experience as I had.

Yup. It's like DIYing anything that you see on youtube. On youtube, you can literally make brain surgery look like a super easy, simple, and fast process with only a few steps.

Then you try it on your own and you get the reality check when all those issues you never even imagined start popping out of the woodwork.

For any noob that doubts this, just go watch a youtube video of a aerobar+cable full reinstall online - there are a few where guys do the uncut entire thing in like 20 minutes. And then go try it yourself and see how close you get to that 20 minute mark, especially if you have no experience recabling a bike or installing a cockpit.

Heck, most true noobs to bike maintenance can barely even thread a new chain correctly through the pulleys without screwing it up!

It's like anything - it doesn't have to cost a lot of money to do triathlon. What I have learned though, is that it tends to be people with a lot of money who do it.

Another point - you are literally the poster boy for someone for whom it SHOULD be easy. You've worked on lots of bikes, 'in every imaginable condition' so you've had the chance to make all your mistakes, try out things, try various tools, over, and over again.

That opportunity does NOT arise for a typical new triathlete who has no bike background, and has one, perhaps two bikes to work with. With which they typically do NOT want to do a half-baked job on their race bike (less risk taking for sure.)

Even for me, with my learned experience from that whole cockpit+drivetrain upgrade, I've forgotton at least half of it in the year+ that I've gone without doing it again. I changed a front FD cable for a race this past summer, and it was almost as annoying as the first time around, getting it through the internal cable path, readjusting the FD tension screws, remembering which direction they go, forgetting to put on the anti-chain-drop fangtool and having to redo it all, etc.

It's different when you have to use the stuff on a regular basis like a shop as compared to an AGer who rarely works on their bikes since once is usually good enough for a year+.

I don't disagree. But, that's why I ask the question, "how interested are you in learning to do this?" Before I recommend it to someone. I also tend to coach/teach noobs how to do it...rather than just send them off to youtube. That's also why there's a progression of jobs to attempt. Eg, adjust an RD or replace a chain...rather than starting with an entire group swap.

Give them a tri-wrench and a phillips screw driver, and tell them..."if you can't do it with these...call me first."

You previously stated and it should be reiterated, delayed maintenance, whether it is your bike or your car, costs a lot more than doing it as preventative maintenance.

Corroded hardware is just the tip of the ice berg...

As for the cost of the sport, it is as cheap or expensive as you want it, but a bike is full of wear parts and needs annual maintenance.

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Pactimo brand ambassador, ask me about promo codes

If you believe some of the posts around here, you've missed around 468 chain removals, waxings, and re-installs. (Don't try to make them all up the same weekend.)

To kinda get back on track....maybe....

How many people seriously contemplate taking up tri, but don't own a bike? I don't know any. But, I also don't know anyone who decided not to because of the bike.

Yeah if you don't own a bike, there's a bigger hit on startup cost. But, I see a shit-ton of "starter bikes" at the local sprints. Practically the entire homer-bucket crowd is riding a walmart special. We have a really good local RD that puts on some very fun sprints....these things are packed with these homer-bucket types.

I also don't see people in the USA not doing things that they want to do simply because of cost. People spent all kinds of crazy money (using Credit / Monthly payment plans) to do stupid shit. $70k bass boats, $1000 guns, $100k RVs, $10k wave-runners. If people want to do something they will hock their Mom, or put it on the 21% APR/ minimum payment plan.

All of the athletically oriented people I know that don't want to do tri, they mention the time commitment, and the swim. They all talk about how complicated ith must be to train for 3 sports, and they all express a fear or distaste of/for swimming. Even a 300 yard super-sprint swim is daunting...even to people who run 26.2. I think most normal people would rather run a marathon than swim 300y in a pool. A 750m sprint, or a 1500m Oly...nope. That's where people tell me I'm nuts. They stand on shore and look out at the corner buoy 300y off shore, and they go "nope! not doing that. Good luck!"

I just don't know anyone who has said, "I'd love to do a tri, but I don't own a bike and those things are EXPENSIVE! If the bike were cheaper, I'd be all over that shit." The only people I know that bitch about the cost of triathlon are triathletes (or maybe former triathletes)---but, those costs are largely their own making.

I'm probably guilty of being one of those types...but, that's friggin funny.

It is a sport that rewards the Type A personality. The more you can plan and execute, the better the race experience (kind of). People that can plan and execute a race plan, most likely are doing that in other parts of their lives.

I think I am the only person that does anything approaching athletic endeavors in my company, I am constantly questioned as to why I would spend so much on my last road bike ($10k... It was a big splurge and major upgrade from my caad12) All of these people own $30k or $40k fishing boats, atvs, RVs, $60k trucks to haul them around and god knows what else that get used once or twice a month... I am on my road bike 4 or 5 days a week all summer. I work with people that put less miles on their motorcycles.

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Pactimo brand ambassador, ask me about promo codes

Let's be clear as well though - I do agree with you that SWIMMING is far and away the limiter for most folks to tri.

And swimming in general, is EXPENSIVE. Yeah, I know - you have a free lap pool in your complex, or you have a $2/week super cheap pass to some awesome public noncrowded pool complex, so it costs you nothing. Good on you.

But for most others, pool access is hard, and expensive. I live in Norcal, where tri is really popular compared to most of the country, and I have to shell out $1000+/yr for YMCA pool access for a craptastic circle swim with marked limited hours, and pool temps that I'm pretty sure are in the mid to high 80s all the time.

And logistically, pool time is very tough on the schedule, with all the prep and driving time. If you're a pure swimmer, it works out better, but as a triathlete who's not spending 2 hrs in the pool each session, that 20 min drive to and back from the pool can kill your weekly schedule.

And no, I don't want to hear from all you folks now who want to reply to me saying "my drive is 1 minute", or "my pool is basically free", or "I get free pool access at work", or "I have no kids so going to masters at 6AM before work is no problem". I get it - it works fine for YOU. But for sure, it's a major hurdle for the majority, me included, and I'm way more serious that the average triathlete about it.

Actually, they pay me to swim there...because of my magnetic personality.

This is why I am a one and done IM. It was definitely a fun experience don't get me wrong! I just can't commit to travel to the pool as it wrecks my family's schedule. I really did enjoy learning to swim and improving up until race day, just can't do it long-term any more. Such is life!

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"If it costs you 30 minutes at Maryland so what" -dwreal

LOL!

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"If it costs you 30 minutes at Maryland so what" -dwreal

Ironically, I actually think that swim/pool access for IM is less critical than it is for Sprint/Oly, despite the much longer swim distance, in that you can really suck on that IM swim but still have a solid overall result (due to disproportionate bike/run distance vs swim), whereas in Sprint/Oly, if you are weak on the swim, you really take a hit in the results.

For me, the vast majority of my gains in tri over the past 7 years have been in swimming, at all distances. Running has actually worsened a bit, but was compensated by a small gain on the bike, but those gains are small compared to what I've added on the swim.

I often wonder why I subject myself to swimming just to do this sport, but at this point I've invested so much time and effort into it that I might as well go all in. Part of the things that keep me going in swimming are that it's the only part of tri training I actually do with other people around (even if I don't talk to them - I get lonely otherwise! Darn kids and family schedule....) and the reality that I'm expecting to pivot to more swimming as my already-arthritic ankles eventually give out. Hopefully my shoulders will last...

Swimming will be 100% the reason I leave tris and stick to dus. I'm committed to a 1 and done IM in 2021 but I'm really not sure I'll be signing up for a single triathlon after that. Swimming is a nightmare even for someone who a. has a very affordable ($30 a month), very uncrowded (I get cranky when I have to share a lane with 1 other person), very convenient pool (I literally pass my gym on the way home from work). It adds minimum 20-30 minutes to my training which is killer when you're already cranking out 10-12 hour weeks. Running adds virtually no time to training logistically and cycling slightly more but training mostly indoors cuts that down too.

Perhaps we have different realities.
I wasn't talking theoretically about what I imagined would be needed. I've only brought any of my bikes to a bike mechanic for a couple of spoke replacements, and a BB replacement in 9 years of cycling. I've moved things around, replaced chains, brakes, cables, cassettes, chainrings, fitted power meter, pedals, mudguards, swapped and adjusted the bar, stem and saddle for fit. Fitted clip-ons and forward seatpost to my road bike prior to getting a dedicated tri bike, and plenty other little bits and pieces. The only dedicated tools I recall needing was the chain whip, cassette lockring tool, and a dedicated tool for the a power2max power meter which came with the meter....

Re-cabling can be a bit fiddly and take a couple of hours, not a big deal. I don't remember anything else being the least bit demanding except for one seized pedal.

You've listed a bunch of costs that are parts, not tools. If needed, you'd be paying for those no matter who does the job. You also mentioned tools that you probably didn't need, and in one case didn't even find useful. Maintenace should never require a drill!

Your horror stories puzzle me!

I made my first chain whip from an old chain, a couple of screws and a stick of wood. I used a screw driver and a hammer to remove my first lockring. :-)

Pink, as its meant sorta tongue-in-cheek...because most people won't be that hard core. But, it IS still true.

I fully expect LH to be driven into an apoplectic fit, though. Nay...I might even hope!

So you dont want to hear back from anybody who disagrees with this massively one sided opinion of yours that simply fits your narrative and circumstances? haha classic. Oh and you conveniently put yourself in the majority rather than the minority.

I have no idea of what Norcal is like, but the set up sounds terrible. My £25 per month (which is typical) leisure membership covers gym/classes and a 25m pool to 3 separate leisure centres within 10 minutes drive. The closest one being just 1 mile away. A further 10 minutes and I can pay to use another 3 swimming pools / leisure centres from neighbouring boroughs. They are all public pools, not top of the art performance centres; if I wanted a 50m olympic pool, well thats an hour away in the capital. But the membership to that is about the same price and an amazing deal if you live pretty close to it. I dont even know anywhere which would come close to £1000 per year. We also have several lakes/ponds/rivers nearby which can be used for open water sessions.

Now we've covered off either end of the spectrum, we can probably agree that on average swimming cost/time isn't THAT bad either! Unless you want it to be... like the rest of the sport.

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

My cost estimates were not just for tools, they were tools + parts. Pretty sure I've said that from my initial post. You are the one that limited it to only tools. Although to be totally honest, all the various tools I've purchased for my cockpit + drivetrain overhaul, including the bike stand, exceeded $500.

And I consider that a good result for bike costs, meaning on the low end (I didn't buy anything extravagant, name-brandy, or high end for tools.)

Nope, I still stand by what I said.

Swimming is expensive and time-consuming. Definitely compared to running, and if you live in a not-easy-access area, still expensive even compared to cycling . (I've spent $12kish over 10 years for YMCA pool access - my TOTAL bike expenditures might just exceed half that, and that includes the extravagance of 3 powermeters!)

I know my area really does suck for pool access, but remember - this is Norcal, which has probably an absurdly high # of triathletes compared to the rest of the USA (possibly world). I'll bet a huge percentage of ST forumites live within 2 hrs of me just based on what I see mentioned in posts that a Bay area native would recognize. So even if pool access is not good here, it's the norm for a lot of triathletes and STers.

I had in mind this part of the post by you that I was initially disagreeing with:

"Easily several hundred dollars for bike maintenance alone, and if you do it yourself and have to buy the tools to even do the maintenace, you're looking at $500+ right off the bat...."

You mentioned components and consumables later which was my very point. They're not a cost of doing your own maintenance. They're a cost of maintaining a bike, regardless who does the work. Perhaps we have crossed wires and you're talking about cost in general while I was simply addressing the assertion that you can't do your own maintenance without a fortune in tools.

I don't accept that bikes are necessarily anywhere near as expensive as you suggest. They can be, but it's mostly by choice, whether to achieve the last tiny bit of performance, bling factor, or convenience.

Tom-with all due respect, you live in a bubble. And, the things you state below asr based on a handful of interactions with probably les than 100 people. It's ok, I live in that bubble too. You are using the fact that people show up at triathlons with crappy, "starter" bikes to show that others who don't even own such a bike can afford such a bike, and thus can afford triathlon. The people you see at these races can afford triathlon, at least at a basic level. The people you know can probably afford triathlon at least at a basic level. The average american cannot. The poverty rate is like 12%--those people can't even afford food and clothes. The poeple you and I interact with do not remotely represent what the average American can/cannot afford. Now, I don't know that those people would do triathlon if they could afford it any more than you, but they are much more likely to try basketball or soccer because it requires nothing more than a $10 ball to play those sports. The argument that money is not an impediment to triathlon (even at the cheapest possible equipment) is just insane to me.

Regardless of whether such an impediment actually exists, my bigger point raised above was that triathlon participants consist of wealthier individuals.

Oh, good lord. Poverty rate? Really? You quote the poverty rate, and refer to the average american in the same paragraph. Those are NOT the same two people. The people below (or anywhere near) the poverty line aren't doing endurance sports---at all. Yeah, they might play a pickup game of some ball-sport....but, they aren't going for a long run on Saturday, or to the pool to swim 2500scy....let alone doing a brick or signing up for a Du/Tri---that fact has nothing to do with money, if they had the money they still wouldn't give a shit about tri. That's just a straw man.

The average american DOES spend disposable income on some leasure activity, which could be spent on tri. Some of these average americans even participate in the local fun run/walks, and might go for a family bike ride on Sunday.

There are many, many, many more people out there who CAN affort tri...who are generally interested in endurance sports...who choose not to participate in triathlon. Why? My contention is because its a logistical cluster-fuck of planning, and constant exercise, and most people hate swimming.

Maybe you exist in a bubble. I'm exposed both personally and professionally to a wide swath of demographics...from low-wage, union, hourly employees missing half their teeth because they can't affort to go to a dentist (even though they might own two jetskis)....to VPs. NO ONE ever says, "man that triathlon looks expensive!" They might whistle at a 50mi ride, or a 15mi run. But, you mention 1000y of swimming, and the response is universally "Oh, HELL TO THE NO!"

So, yeah....maybe they can't afford it, maybe they can. But, it never enters the conversation...because they'd never even attempt it.

Ummmmm, no. You don’t even realize you are in a bubble.

"I made my first chain whip from an old chain, a couple of screws and a stick of wood. I used a screw driver and a hammer to remove my first lockring. :-)"

Were we separated at birth?! I took my first freewheel apart when I was 10 using a similar method.

Your cables will eventually get some corrosion within the frame. It's imevitable and when it happens your shifting will go to shit.

For my first triathlon (a sprint with a half mile swim) I wore swim trunks, did the breaststroke the whole way and rode my crappy mountain bike. I was hooked. Probably 2 years later, I bought an entry level road bike and used that. Then, finally, a few years later, I got a legit "mid-level" tri bike. By then I was doing the crawl, picked up a used wetsuit and was racing 70.3's. My point is that ideally, it should be a slow, building process. When I see folks out there on crappy bikes and no wetsuits, plodding along, I applaud them, because that used to be me. How wealthy are triathletes? Well, there are some with spaceship bikes and high end gear, their own personal trainers who race all around the world. But there are also schmucks like me, who started with basically nothing and slowly acquired gear over time, that only race locally a few times a year. I guess I'm middle class, but I don't consider myself wealthy. I've been using the same stuff for years.

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"The first virtue in a soldier is endurance of fatigue; courage is only the second virtue."
- Napoleon Bonaparte

The average IM entry fee is $800 not including any other expenses. The average IM 70.3 is around $300. Obliviously you can race local sprints and olympics, but even most sprints are close to $100 after USAT fees, processing fees and Active fees. The sport is not affordable for most.

I don't want to hear about people racing on rusted out hand me down bikes, used peed in wetsuits, and running in shoes that were laying around as one person said. It's hilarious. Now with the proliferation of disc brakes your average price for a new entry level bike is $2500 to $3500. That's brutal and reality.

You are the exception. Most people that want to be competitive want gear that puts them on a level playing field. I give you credit for this approach and your patience, but it's uncommon in this sport. I see buttloads of people paying $500 for Wattie Tri Suits. The sport caters to the wealthy.

Relatively few cables from 1977 are within the frame. If the shifters are downtube, there most likely won't even be any housing except from the chainstay to the rear derailleur.
If the bike has spent its life clean and stored well, it's not entirely unrealistic that 40-year-old cables would still be more or less functional on a 5/6/7-speed friction setup. Old-school shift cables weren't as precise as the new stuff, but they weren't bad at resisting issues like fraying.

...I'd probably swap out ancient brake cables regardless of their current function, for piece of mind.

Think this is more the norm than you appreciate. Might be the exception for the ST crowd. I fall into this category. Local sprint in just tri shorts, and then mountain bike. Have now down several Olympics on my CAAD12 and clip ons. Have seen all comers at some large races. Would like to do a 70.3 in next few years. Looking forward to the challenge. Am going to be dead weight middle of the pack.

I enjoy having a "healthy" hobby. And I do enjoy coveting gear. Every day is an internal debate of when can I upgrade my road bike (which I love, btw). And reading ST, learning from the discussions, and appreciating all the different approaches folks take.

I'm riding a 2013 Argon 18 e112, which by modern standards is a relic. At all my IM 70.3 races, my bike is the oldest and least expensive of all surrounding bikes. I realize not everyone is on a brand new P5-X, but in my general vicinity on the rack most of the no bikes are legit. Obviously, people breaking into the sport may not have all the bells and whistles, but if you've been doing it continuously a number of years then the level of investment will be higher. Hell at most races I see first timers on much nicer, newer bikes than mine and a lot of them are one and done bucket listers. Smh.

I also fit Don_W's description and every triathlete I know locally does. Multiple IM guys who still ride road bikes with clip-ons etc, which is common around here due to it being hilly everywhere. When my new bike comes im going to be one of the exceptions around here for sure, and whilst its a nice bike which has cost a lot its not because im loaded, its just that I decided to put some money into my hobby and invest in one good bike rather than continually upgrade over years which would end up costing more. My car is a wreck because I have no interest in them, my power pedals cost the same amount. Just because you see someone with one nice thing or fancy gear doesnt mean the rest of their life is the same across all aspects. The vast majority of people arent competitive, if we start talking about how much it may cost to compete on the spiky end of the field, well thats a very different conversation to just people who participate in triathlon in general and their average wealth. Same for maintenance etc which someone was kicking off about earlier with the expense or doing it yourself and making mistakes etc... I just go to the bike shop and get them to do it properly first time, they dont charge much for bike servicing or fitting a part (if something even breaks). Whilst ill fully agree that the sport caters for wealthy people and you can spend some serious money if you are able and want to, you also dont need to be wealthy to participate or compete!

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@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068

I can see the arguement that the entire field is not using top end equipment, but the reality is that the sport is expensive. IM races range from $300 to $800 for entry fees per race. Compare that to running where the average marathon is around $100-$150 and the only equipment you need is shoes and running clothes. Just entry fees alone put it in a class that is different from most sports. Factor in that you're keeping up with the costs of 3 sports in 1 and its relatively expensive. Obviously, there are more expensive hobbies, but no triathlon is not cheap by any means relative to other sports.

Isn’t a lot of the reason that lots of IM triathletes are just older?

I mean im 51. I no longer have any capital expenditures like house, car etc. My earnings are the highest they will ever be. I like doing triathlon.

As some have said it’s one of the cheapest things you can do. I’m not into boats, cars, watches, golf etc. I like triathlon so I just buy the best stuff. After the first year you have almost everything. I don’t need two wetsuits or two TT bikes.

If I was 25, sure, I wouldn’t but I’m not.

I don’t want to die with money.

IM isn't the be-all/end-all of triathlon. I started racing in '86, and still haven't done an actual IM race. I don't think I've ever spent more than $125 on an entry, and most of the races I've done have been less than $100.

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"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"

I can't see if anyone has had a crack at answering the second part of the question: how wise are triathletes?

Pethaps wisdom is a hard attribute to measure. Maybe if you took proxies like educational achievement, IQ? Has anyone actually ever tried to measure that stuff? My guess there is probably a correlation with income, and we are told that is higher than average.

Triathletes choose to spend some of their leisure time involved in enjoyable physical activity which improves health and wellbeing. It will likely reduce their risk of developing hypertension, type 2 diabetes, and if they keep it up probably increase their fitness and independence well in old age. On the other hand there are risks such as fractures, overuse injuries, and maybe sone opportunity cost within other aspects of life like relationships and career.

So I'm thinking triathletes might be 7 out of 10 wise?

On the other hand, I don't recall Socrates or Ghandi doing many triathlons. And Marcus Aurelius said strong arms were wasted on vain dumbbells, better to dig a vineyard.

So maybe 6 out of 10?

The fact that no-one had attempted to provide much of an answer to that one, perhaps provides a suggestion in itself.
There is no useful way to answer that. What is wise? Perhaps not attempting to respond is wisest?
...or maybe that question just doesn't interest anyone. Is that because they're ignorant, or because they see the folly in the question? Both perhaps.
Now I'm bored. Goodbye