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Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!!
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https://www.slowtwitch.com/...Sibbersen__7060.html

I was hoping since this guy was German, Herbert was on it, and here it is!! So he prepped for a couple years to break this record(wonder if he knew the course had been shortened and got motivated). At 43 he is still a dam good triathlete, 1;57 for an olympic in his AG has to be pretty good still. But to have that kind of focus and determination, not really knowing if the day is going to even present itself in a manner where your goal is even possible, that is a tough guy.

And for those of you that understand, 10x400(LCM I presume) and coming in under 4;40 or so, that is a set that most ITU swimming studs would be hard pressed on. I wonder if he shaved down for this too, of course Herbert not being a swimmer, he would not have known to ask that. Maybe he can have a look over here and answer some more questions, that would be fun for the fishes...

And I had no idea he was Patrick's manager, so a lot of records went down to that duo, this year and the past few. That might be a whole different interview, some inside workings on what Patrick's contracts and outside business life is?
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [monty] [ In reply to ]
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10 x 400's on 5:40 holding 4:40s... yeah that is pretty fast.

The picture of him with his arms raised... that is a huge lung chamber.

For someone keenly aware of the accumulation of heat and how it would impact his swim, he sure was lucky his cap fell off...
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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ajthomas wrote:
10 x 400's on 5:40 holding 4:40s... yeah that is pretty fast.

The picture of him with his arms raised... that is a huge lung chamber.

For someone keenly aware of the accumulation of heat and how it would impact his swim, he sure was lucky his cap fell off...

Amazing, isn’t it??

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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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For someone keenly aware of the accumulation of heat and how it would impact his swim, he sure was lucky his cap fell off...
I had that same luck every one of my 15 swims there!!! Just have to remember, goggles on the inside...
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [monty] [ In reply to ]
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I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?

There’s plenty of value in recording performance. The trick is making it accurate and that the performance is relevant. Watch is also distracting for many of us who grew up in a swim environment (and we take a certain pride in being able to read a wall clock to manage out splits)

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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?

My guess would be because it's not how swimming has traditionally been coached. Lanes are split by ability and time cutoffs are appropriately assigned. Also from my experience using a watch in indoor pools can be error-prone and limited in application for tracking full workouts accurately (free vs. pull vs. kick vs. fly, etc. etc.) though I admittedly haven't spent that much time trying to tinker.
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?


They do use a clock. There's one big one that everyone can see. Why is that better?

1.) Easy to see clock on wall versus watch on hand -- especially if the goggles get a bit fogged, and especially when the intervals get more challenging.
2.) Everyone in the workout is syncronized to the exact time.
3.) Watches slow you down.

Edit: I'm also sure that guy remembers all his times for those 400's should he want to inform his coach (if his coach didn't already witness the set).
Last edited by: SH: Oct 23, 18 13:06
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool?
---

Real swimmers are trained from an early stage the the deck clock is more important than the coach. They are also trained to pay attention to, well, everything. Everything includes the minutia of your stroke, kick, head position, flip turn technique... the list goes on. Also on the list is paying attention to your sendoff and arrival times. On that 10x400 set, I'd bet you money that Sibberson could tell you exactly what time he went for each one, assuming you asked him near the time he did the swim (hell, he might still be able to tell you now). Swimmers log that info into a mental database and use it as fuel for their next swims, especially the next time you do the same set. Once you add the watch, you take away the mental game of swimming. You'd think that this would give the swimmer more CPU processing to focus on the other stuff. But, in a sport where the clock is the boss, you'd be wrong.






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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?

Because that's what the wall clock is for. In a swim team environment, you will also have a coach on deck yelling out splits during the main set based off the wall clock or his own stopwatch.

Using a watch on your wrist(specifically starting and stopping each interval) leads to inaccuracies in split times and is very difficult to manage when you are doing intervals with 5 seconds or less rest (eg: 100's on 1:05 coming in at 1:00-1:02). With intervals like this, the watch becomes a distraction/hindrance during very hard sets.

get comfortable being uncomfortable
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [SH] [ In reply to ]
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SH wrote:
Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?


They do use a clock. There's one big one that everyone can see. Why is that better?

1.) Easy to see clock on wall versus watch on hand -- especially if the goggles get a bit fogged, and especially when the intervals get more challenging.
2.) Everyone in the workout is syncronized to the exact time.
3.) Watches slow you down.

Edit: I'm also sure that guy remembers all his times for those 400's should he want to inform his coach (if his coach didn't already witness the set).

4) you can only access the buttons on the watch to the detriment of your streamline and finish.

And he might even know most of his 100 splits!
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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And he might even know most of his 100 splits!



Hell, I wasn't even there and I know his 100 splits,1;10 +/- 1.5 seconds

Perhaps Mike is not from a swim background(almost certainly to even ask this question) but he is like me now, in that I do most all of my swimming in a pool without a pace clock, thus I use a watch. I have a special one with a big face on it, and I have gotten very good at taking a quick look after a flip turn, about a 1 second delay. If I do a 1000, I will check every 200 or so, saves me from missing on my lap counting. Just knowing when I started is all I need, can look at any point and quickly figure out which lap or 100 I'm on. I think perhaps a lot of people are in the same boat, only if they didnt used to swim, they dont realize how important that pace clock is to us.

And Jan not using it in the race makes sense, he might have gotten overconfident at that last turn bouy when he saw a 21 and thought no problem!! But of course he already knew the deception of having a head/tail current, and took full advantage of just pacing according to PE.

I saw a guy in the beginning of the race, maybe 200/300 in, trying to stay on his feet. That's the guy I want to hear from, has to be a great swimmer who was thinking WTF!! He must have thought he was having a horrible day, not knowing he was on the feet of a 46 guy going for the record. I doubt Jan made an announcement at the start line, just blasted off at about 1;06 pace with that tail current and was off to the races!!
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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JasoninHalifax wrote:
Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?


There’s plenty of value in recording performance. The trick is making it accurate and that the performance is relevant. Watch is also distracting for many of us who grew up in a swim environment (and we take a certain pride in being able to read a wall clock to manage out splits)


Other than times, there's nothing of value a "swim watch" can give me (with current tech, anyway). And I haven't seen one that can record pool swims accurately enough to bother wearing.

I have a $25 finger stopwatch that I use to get my times on race pace repeats. For longer swims, I use the clock to count laps, so I'm acutely aware of my intermediate splits/pacing. The only data I'm generally interested in recording is total yardage, and, for the main set(s),
  1. what was the rep distance & interval
  2. what was the race pace target time (and correlating race)
  3. how many reps did I successfully complete at race pace before failing the 1st time, 2nd time, and 3rd time


"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"
Last edited by: gary p: Oct 23, 18 21:57
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?

After a couple of decades of swimming, and many millions of yards, most "real swimmers" could tell you the time they did for every single interval in a workout when they got home. Probably some splits in there, too.

----------------------------------
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [windschatten] [ In reply to ]
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And don’t miss your send off because you’re futzing around with buttons. Red top means red top, not the one or the three.

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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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All of those reasons make sense, I just like to have data in TP. fwiw when i do swim masters, I wear it but don't use it for send off times, i use the big clock and just let my watch record/document the workout.
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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It's funny my athletes will all wear garmins to even sessions i'll coach on the deck. I'll know their splits, and when I check TP to "compare" what garmin had, it's never the same. Also about 1/2s off etc. To the point that I also add in the splits they swam off the pace clock/my clock in the comments section. With having to streamline in, grab the watch, hit the button, etc it just takes time out of hte split. So I guess in that light they are "faster" than the garmin says.

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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Curious, what’s the benefit of having full workouts in TP? I’ve never done it, but then I tend not to look back. I mostly know where I’m at now and have a pretty good idea of what it takes to progress. at the sane time I don’t come anywhere close to maximizing my training, too many things on the go, so it’s really just a matter of fitting in what I can, when I can, and if I’m lacking energy or motivation then I’m going too much. But life stress is the biggest limiter for me, which TP can’t really capture.

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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [monty] [ In reply to ]
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I'm really happy for Jan that he broke the record met him 2002 after St Croix 70.3.

This is a question for him (Jan) in hoping he reads this thread.

How would his traning swim times compared this year to early 2000's when he came in 46:50? Was he swimming 4:40's for his 400's? Or a lot faster? 4:30's...
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [MTL] [ In reply to ]
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For all the swimmers chiming in, I agree with pretty much everything.
Growing up in as an ocean swim er NorCal, my first Hawaiin race was like being in an oven. 76-78 was Soo hot compared to 53-65.
Would never do that with a cap again. Mine might accidentally rip or something.
As for clocks, they must be analog. Screw that digital crap. Big sweep hands on a 24" face, screw those pidfly 16" ones.
And preferably 6 of them around the pool, all synced to less than a tenth of a second. If a coach doesn't spend 10-15 minutes every day doing that, he's not doing his job.
And, every day I knew every repeat and splits every 100 if not every 50.
My high school coach would make us repeat sets if we didn't know. AND HE KNEW FIR ALL OF US.

I have recently started to wear a watch ( yes, the horror) because with a wrist HRM I can get HR data while swimming; something I have not had in 45+ years of swimming.
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Rumpled] [ In reply to ]
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I like to consider myself a real swimmer, no watch, can remember all my splits etc. Only thing I don't get is the analog vs digital clock thing. My pool has both but I'll take the big digital one on the wall any day. It's up high and I can see it from anywhere in the pool so no issues around all clocks being in sync. Since I am near sighted I can be more precise with my split times since I can see big digital numbers but it's hard for me to see which second exactly the pace clock hand is on.
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [monty] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not a Fish, but chime in because of the cap problem.
I also tend to loose the cap, so I have the goggles indeed under my cap lately. Although it seems that goggles hold the cap when you have them over the cap, you're in deep shit when everything comes off.

In a wetsuit race I tend to wear a neoprene cap under my racecap (as I wrote I'm not a Fish so do not perceive any overheating problems, on the contrary).
Goggles in between. Of course I loose the racecap sometimes.

The Big Problem:
One should or must wear the racecap, altough I never heard someone being disqualified after loosing it. So it bothers me when it starts lifting off, and I do not want to be bothered by something like that in a race.

So for my next race in Lanzarote (where the water typically has 17° C) I plan to staple or sew the racecap to an old neoprene cap which I did not throw away yet (neoprene caps have chin straps)

A chin strap would also be an improvement for normal swim caps. In warmer water races I plan to sew a rubber band to the swim cap, as a chin strap.
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [Mike Alexander] [ In reply to ]
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Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?


Same. In all but the minority of explanations given here (like extremely short rest intervals), none of these are logical reasons to not monitor and collect your swim performance with a watch. And they reek of "I just don't really know how to use one or what the benefit would be". I think I'll continue to be a fake swimmer and use my watch.

Edit: My apologies for the "reek of" part of that. It was inflammatory and unnecessary.

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Last edited by: domingjm: Oct 24, 18 7:30
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Re: Ok Fishes, here is the interview we were all waiting for!! [domingjm] [ In reply to ]
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domingjm wrote:
Mike Alexander wrote:
I have heard this before. Why do "real swimmers" not use a watch in the pool? Do they not find value in recording performance or sharing that data with a coach?


Same. In all but the minority of explanations given here (like extremely short rest intervals), none of these are logical reasons to not monitor and collect your swim performance with a watch. And they reek of "I just don't really know how to use one or what the benefit would be". I think I'll continue to be a fake swimmer and use my watch.

So enlighten us, what benefit do they provide?
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