I’ve just starting x-c skiing again this winter after an absence of many years. I used to compete when I was in university, which was right before skate skiing became legit, so I missed that whole era.
I’m skiing at our local place, doing purely classic. Some of my cycling friends are out there doing skating and they are covering a lot more kms than I am. I’ve got an idea of my classic speed now, but I’m curious how classic speed compares to skate skiing?
eg assuming competent/equivalent technique in both disciplines, if you could do 10km in x minutes for classic, how long would it take you to do 10 km in skating?
Secondly, a lot of these guys will take both sets of skis and do a couple of hours skating and then an hour or so classic. What would be the benefits of doing that? Or is it just for variety psychologically?
Having been out of it for so many years, I guess I just assumed that everyone was purely skate skiing these days so I was surprised to find out that my friends switch between the two and have two full sets of equipment.
Yes… I am eyeing the skate equipment that is in my size and now on sale
NB - I classic faster than I skate, and realize that this is fully back-asswards.
In general I think skate is about 10-15% faster than classic. This of course assumes similar technique as well as optimal conditions/wax for both. Most “real” skiers will do both because different muscle groups are used for each technique. Skate emphasizes the quads and glutes more than classic, while classic will place more emphasis on the hip flexors and hamstrings. This goes along with the common notion which states that skate crosses over better to cycling, and classic to running.
In Vancouver, many people will bring both sets of gear and let the conditions dictate which technique they are going to do on a given day. Sometimes the classic conditions are just perfect, and other times the waxing can be a nightmare. Having said that, the general trend is that the majority of people I meet prefer skate. Of course I have to be different, and much prefer classic. I’ve been forcing myself to skate a lot this year though, as I’ll never get better at skating if I’m always classic skiing. It’s working, though my classic is still a fair cry better.
I can’t really comment on differences in speed, except that generally speaking skating is faster. Classic can be way slower if you get your kick wax wrong. In my opinion, when you get kick wax perfect, it is the most fun you can have on skis (I maybe get it perfect 1-2x per season).
Modern collegiate skiing requires both techniques, and some citizen races require both. The Mayor’s cup in the Twin Cities is classic Saturday and skate Sunday with a pursuit start.
I’d say if you’re finding a deal on skating eqpt., go for it! You’ll have a blast.
We have a big ski race every year here in the Ottawa area. There is both classic and skate. Here are the winning avg. speeds for each event (same distance - 49km):
skate: 21.6km/h
classic: 17.2km/h
So… approx. 25% faster for this sample.
Note: It is a very competitive race for both fields - the skate race may be a bit deeper though.
Edit: The year before was:
skate: 25.1km/h
classic: 21.9km/h
Approx. Only 15% faster this year
The year before this turned out to be approx. 15% also…
I’d say if you’re finding a deal on skating eqpt., go for it! You’ll have a blast.
There’s a pair of sz39 skating boots on for half price and I swear they have my name written on the box They look so lonely sitting there week after week…
Ok, so I could call it 20% and be in the range, based on what several of you are saying.
I ask because my cyclist friends (one is an Elite/Cat.1 racer and the other is an M.1) are regularly doing 40km skating on a Sunday morning, while I’m doing 25km, classic. Obviously they are stronger and faster than me, and we’re not out there for exactly the same amount of time, but they are not THAT far ahead of me on the bike, lol!
I know I am totally comparing apples to oranges, but I was getting a bit concerned. This makes me feel a bit better! Thx.
Yeah, there are two things happening here: Skating is generally faster, and they likely have better technique!
As a former college skier Cathy probably has pretty solid classic technique down (if perhaps not the latest race double technique) - but I will say this: I was one of the faster people at dryland training this past fall, and get CRUSHED by a lot of older women who aren’t very fit when we’re skating. Fitness, while a component of speed, isn’t the major limiting factor.
Take the time to learn good skating technique and you’ll be good to go. If your classic tech is sound you should have no problem with this. You’ll pick it up fast.
As to what to do when skate or classic - assuming good technique with both, these days I let the conditions or who I am skiing with dictate which technique I am going to use. For example a few weeks ago we went skiing at our usual place. They had groomed in the morning but had had 10+ cm of fresh snow fall by the time we got there. The skate tracks were really heavy and not in great shape, but enough people had been classic skiing that the classic tracks where reasonably well preserved.
I don’t mind trying to find the right grip wax in tough grip waxing conditions, but if I don’t want to bother, or you don’t want to bother, then you can just skate for the day.
Also if you are thinking of racing - what technique will the races be - skate or classic? Another thing to consider.
Of course then there is the debate about what is better for what? I don’t think about that too much. Both are a great workout and a heck of a lot of fun. Just ski!
Khai I am thinking of coming up to FK for the biathlon WC. Let’s ski!
Dude, I’ll be in FK from the 7th-14th (travel days inclusive) - and I’ve got my skate gear with me. If you’re up, I’m totally in for a ski! (Assuming you can go slow enough… :p)
Dude, two weeks ago I covered ~13.5km classic faster than I went ~10k skating the week prior (same course, similar conditions). It’s well beyond “weird” - it’s close to pathetic…
****Also if you are thinking of racing - what technique will the races be - skate or classic? Another thing to consider.
I was looking at the Fischer Loppet at Hardwood Hills March 5/6 - choice of 20km/40km classic or skate. I would have to put on my stupid toque to do a ski race since I have a half marathon in San Diego the next weekend and, oh yeah, I haven’t ski raced since 1985, but what the heck, eh?
awwww, aren’t you nice? The thank you bacon is in the mail
W00t! Today I had some “happy bacon” c/o my sister. That’s bacon from pigs that live on an organic farm, and are fed scraps from the restaurant. Sounds like a pretty decent life for a meat pig…
The difference is about 10 % under most conditions, skate being faster than classic. This is at the elite level with the same athletes. There are times when classic is as fast or faster such as extreme cold. Under -18C classic is often as fast as skate. The difference can be more than 25% though, for instance on coarse old snow around freezing where it’s hard to get a grip wax right. The big difference in speed is mastering the V2 for the average skier, this give the skaters another gear over the classic guys.
Are you doing the 20 or the 40 at Hardwood?
The difference is about 10 % under most conditions, skate being faster than classic. This is at the elite level with the same athletes. There are times when classic is as fast or faster such as extreme cold. Under -18C classic is often as fast as skate. The difference can be more than 25% though, for instance on coarse old snow around freezing where it’s hard to get a grip wax right. The big difference in speed is mastering the V2 for the average skier, this give the skaters another gear over the classic guys.
Are you doing the 20 or the 40 at Hardwood?
What’s V2???
Oh gosh, I would never undertake the 40 at this point. I only started skiing again this winter, although I’ve got a good fitness base from my other sports. I did 25km this past Sunday so I feel I could definitely manage a 20km classic race with a couple more weeks of training. I might be last but I’m totally ok with that I know Hardwood is a challenging course but it’s so well groomed, which makes a difference.
I did the Gatineau 55km in Gatineau Park back in 1983 and have always dreamed of going back and doing that again, in a more prepared state. At the time I had never skied more than 10km total in a day but I had a boyfriend who talked me into driving there and doing it with him (the fact that I had a car and he didn’t, had a lot to do with his convincing me to do it, lol!). It was a VERY long day. That was in the era where they had oatmeal cookies, chocolate covered Glossette raisins and hot Ribena cordial at the feed stations
I ask because my cyclist friends (one is an Elite/Cat.1 racer and the other is an M.1) are regularly doing 40km skating on a Sunday morning, while I’m doing 25km, classic. Obviously they are stronger and faster than me, and we’re not out there for exactly the same amount of time, but they are not THAT far ahead of me on the bike, lol!
I don’t think you can put any stock into that - I would worry more about how much TIME you spend out there.
