Hi,
One of my first posts and no doubt I am going to get flamed for it!!
First of all I would like to clarify my position, I have never doped or cheated in any of the athletic events I have competed in.
BUT: If I am absolutely honest and look in my heart I can not say that I wouldn’t dope if it were to give me a chance at victory in the TdF or some other big race.
Am I now a pariah for admitting this or does anyone else think the same?
If I had to resort to breaking the law, cheating and risking my reputation and honor in order to achive a goal, I’d have to take a hard look at my career choice. In a word, no.
“If I had to resort to breaking the law, cheating and risking my reputation and honor in order to achive a goal”
The devil’s advocate says that’s a mighty purty glass house…it’s all in how high or low you set your reputation’s bar…
Ever broken the speed limit? Ever run a red light or rolled through a stop sign?
I don’t know if I’d dope for cycling money. MLB money on the otherhand, it would be hard to say no to 100s of millions of dollars. There are a lot of jobs that pay far less where your body is far more at risk.
No! Never would. Wouldn’t you feel like the win meant nothing? Was it you or the drugs? Well, it wasn’t you!
There are a few things in life that are black and white, this is one of them. Do you compete to be YOUR best or THE best? If you need the money and fame, become a rock star, not an athlete.
Now, I will get blasted for not being a mugwump.
The devil’s advocate says that’s a mighty purty glass house
Devil’s advocate needs to come up with some better examples. Traffic infractions are not comparable to doping, and nobody is going to believe they are even remotely equivalent things.
Maybe something like, “Ever take credit for someone else’s work for professional gain?” or “Ever steal from someone for financial gain?”
But probably most people wouldn’t do those things, either.
Human nature is such that under the right circumstances, anyone of us could do ANYTHING in life. Anyone who does not believe this has not read history.
Dave
I will never be in a position where the decision to use PEDs would affect my ability to put food on the table for my family. It’s a pretty hard moral dilemma.
That said, if I was in that position and was able to take something was known to be undetectable, under a doctor’s care, and guaranteed to make beaucoup money it would be hard to pass up. If I looked around and everyone else was doping and I had to make a living, eh, whadda you do? It may take 10 years off my life, but if I could retire at 35 what am I going to do when I’m 65.
Flame away
Interesting. Two posts about doping, and the one who says he would NOT do it is the one who gets flamed.
it’s all in how high or low you set your reputation’s bar
You can set yours as high or low as you’d like. In a competition that is solely about who is the fastest, one who uses illegal and harmful substances to gain that advantage is setting the bar pretty low. How’s Hamilton’s reputation looking these days? Care to trade places with him?
**Human nature is such that under the right circumstances, anyone of us could do ANYTHING in life. Anyone who does not believe this has not read history. **
Not true.
Wasn’t flaming you. (that’s why I wrote “devil’s advocate”)
Just pointing out an inconvenient truth…
We ALL break laws/rules/standards everyday…we just choose the ones that are important to us to uphold.
It’s pretty easy to sit down here in the cheap seats like us and claim we would never be tempted…
How in the world do you REALLY know if you would or wouldn’t?
“But probably most people wouldn’t do those things, either.”
Funny one, vitus…I never took you for an optimist!
“Human nature” does not prescribe us to anything. We have a choice in what we do. Yes, some will choose to cheat, others will not.
What is it that you want from sport? If money and fame is what you want, cheating is an answer. Yes, you also must have incredible genetics and a great work ethic as well as PED’s.
We know that there are athletes in all sports that cheat. So, I try to compare my races to how well I did on that day and less on what place I came in.
Spoken like a true MOPer
Look…
Before anyone gets the wrong idea about me…
I’m not trying to justify doping…
I’m just saying that it’s all too easy to sit back and say NEVER when you’ve never been put in a situation where you’ve been faced with the choice (and that goes for anything…not just doping)…
History shows us differently…
This question cannot be answered until someone is in the actual situation and facing a “dope and compete” or “find an entirely new career” question.
People can only speculate on what they think they would do (or perhaps even what they wish they would do) … which may or not be remotely close to what might actually take place. It’s just another way for people to provide judgements on others that are in a situation we cannot relate to.
So, when folks say “I’d never do that”, they should really be saying “I don’t think I ever would” or “I would hope that I wouldn’t” … but to make a declarative statement on a situation that may be as foreign as a situation could be, is ridiculous. Some might say that it is the height of arrogance and ignorance. I have commented before, so count me in as being one of the arrogant and ignorant … perhaps even more so, b/c I think I said the main thing that would keep me from doping is being “an example for my son” … that I wanted him to think it was possible to excell without drugs (in actuality my example might prove just the opposite to him … if I were drug-free and failed).
Edit: As I have mentioned I have had friends take PED’s before (namely Anavar and Dianabol) because their bodies could not keep up with their desire. They could/would literally work their bodies into breakdown. They found that with drugs they could workout as hard as they possibly could and come back the next day to do it again. You look at the best guys … and they always have a reputation for “working others into the ground” … there may be more to that that just “he’s a really hard worker”.
But, reflecting on the situation more, I can easily see the temptation and the pressure to do so. When “everyone else is doping” (even if just in your mind), you likely feel compelled to just to “keep pace”. A non-doper cannot compete with a doper if all other things are roughly equal (which, at the higher levels, they may be more equal than any other level). We see that example time and time again. We have also seen that a negative test means nothing in regards to doping.
We might as well face it, the chemist are the driving force behind increased performance. You know that going in and make your decisions accordingly.
In short, these questions are not fair, and/or loaded.
When I was in college, they took an anonomyous poll on athlete orientation evening. Something like 90+% of the athletes in the room said that they would take PEDs if it would guarentee them an WC or Olympic medal. 90+% still answered the next question yes for PEDS use which was what if it would kill you within 5 years.
On one hand I’d like to be able to go as fast as possible, to experience the utmost limits, the greatest performance that I could ever do. The only way to do that is through peds. On the other hand I like knowing that the speed I possess is gotten through hard work, consistency, brains, training and no peds.
The bottom line is the majority of us are clean and will remain clean. Human nature is to push the boundary as far as possible, which means as some, maybe even some on this board, that the boundary can and will be pushed further with drugs.
Iwould’nt do it. For the same reason I wouldn’t do a number of other things I know I would not get caught if I did, that is my own personal integrity. I KNOW FOR SURE that I would not do it because to me some things are not negotiable. Cheating is one of those things, speeding is not. Everyone sets the bar for themselves, at the end of the day you only answer to yourself.
There was also a poll in a famous Sports Illustrated article. The question went something like, “Would you take a ‘magic pill’ that would guarantee you a gold medal, but kill you by age 35” … it was at least 80% of the elite athlete polled that said “Yes”. It may very well be the same poll question that was presented to your group. That SI article really shed some light on the real situation with drugs in the Olympics.
To the people reading desert dudes and my comments on the poll and are saying “What? Why the hell? Who would do/say that?” … I think that shows you the completely different situation you and elite athletes are in, despite your previous assumptions.
I keep thinking of Marc Herreman (sp?) when he was paralyzed in the accident and his words to his friends were, “My life is over”. I have yet to read about an elite athlete that did not have a distorted amount of deisre and/or attitude about winning/competing (I am not saying that as a judgement … it may very well be a neccessity for elite athletes). They are a completely different animal.
THe only reason I asked the question was because I was asked it by a friend of mine at a dinner party a couple of weeks ago. They are not athletes but they know that I compete and wanted my point of view.
It is not a statement of intention more the realisation that there is a moral ambiguity within me that would want the victory through whatever means.
It has been written about top sports stars that what seperates them is not just physical prowess and the desire to win but also an absolute need to win. If this is so then doping becomes a means to an end.
Also to be honest if I could get the win by doping and get away with it my thoughts wouldn’t be wracked by guilt at what I had done but by thinking ‘suckers’ for the other guys who didn’t.
But probably most people wouldn’t do those things, either.
I’m gonna disagree on the “take credit for other people’s work” thing … especially if they “never get caught”.