I currently have a 2016 Cervelo P5 with 2x11 SRAM eTap, Enve 7.8 front wheel, and a Zipp disc. I’m trying to determine if bike technology and aerodynamic improvements has changed enough where it’s worth the investment to upgrade. I’m still really pleased with my bike, but the front end with the aduro base bar doesn’t look nearly as clean as the new bikes and I’m wondering if that, plus disc brakes and 12 speed set up is worth it. My fear is that I’m going to spend $10K+ and not see a measurable improvement in speed. Curious to hear people’s thoughts. Thanks
I doubt you will see a measurable performance difference so forget about that.
There are other aspects though-I was in the same position as you with a P5 and got a new Canyon and absolutely love it. No more leaky brakes, the disc brakes are a lot better, much better fit and adjustability, much much better integration etc. Plus I love just looking at it…
It’s def not worth it if you’re looking for bang for buck gains.
It’s worth it if you want a new bike for the fun of it.
I’m on a 2013 Cervelo P3 racing on sew-ups…Zipp F/B 10 speed R2C Shifters/SRAM, aside from rebuild kits & sew ups getting more challenging to find that are good at a reasonable price, it works fine. I do have a creak developing so wondering if my spindle may be wearing a bit. But works fine, goes well on any course & is about 4-5 lbs lighter than the new bikes too. Stick with the Cervelo & put the $10K into a C.D. and make some money on it. I’m looking at a possibly upgrade only because of the above mentioned & the white paint job has a ton of scratches and grease marks/chips…kinda looking like I found it in a dumpster.
Not worth it! Upgrade what you have and you could have the fastest bike out there…
Dan Bighams bike from this years Worlds…
There was this ST thread that tried to answer what is happening in the next generation of super bikes (if anything)
I am a bit in the same situation as you. Answering your question, I would take into consideration.
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What is it that your current bike is NOT giving you. As mentioned, the bike you have is on-par with the best frames today, aero-wise, etc. Are disc brakes important for you? They aren´t for me. Can you get to the desired position?? I really had to stretch my 2016 Argon 18 E119 with custom stuff, but still cheaper than new superbike.
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Would you wait until this next generation of superbikes from Trek, Cervelo, Canyon drops (maybe 2024/2025), lots of things happening now, look at KU Cycles, Cadex, etc.
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Will the price of superbikes drop, now that the whole supply chain seems well restocked. Here in Europe I hear that retailers are having overstock of 2022 & 2023 bikes (as the brands forced them to buy their stock), that means they will need to drop prices and loose money. Prices will drop.
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How long are you willing to wait to actually GET your bike. Despite of pt 3 above, some models (like Canyon Speedmax) is still giving you a 12+ months lead time.
I just went down the same rabbit hole this summer with my 2016 Ceepo Viper with Enve 7.8 wheels. Love the frame, fits me well, but was getting old in the tooth. I looked at new bikes but other than disc brakes they didnt really offer much more my bike didnt so decided to upgrade it. I moved to a 1x GRX set-up and a new cockpit that was more adjustable, cleaner, and comfortable (profile design). I do have to say it was worth the upgrade to me as I can get into a little bit better position now and it feels like a new bike again. Plus I really ended up loving the 1x set-up more than I thought I would. Running it with a 50T crank and a 11-40 cassette so my gearing ratio feels perfect. I have a road bike with disc brakes and they are okay but for my TT bike I see no reason to upgrade to them over the my dura ace rim brakes.
Position>>>>>Bike.
What does you cockpit set up look like? A set of $1,000 super skis vs round extensions probably has around the same watt savings as a 2023 vs 2016 frame. Plus the extra adjust ability can allow you to achieve a faster position, but that needs testing.
If I had 10k to spend to buy some speed it would go, in order: Skinsuit, helmet, calf sleeves, tires, front wheel, aerobar extensions, frame, rear wheel.
The short answer is; No it doesn’t make any sense, but you might want to do it anyway.
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Regarding aero gains, the P5-6 is already one of the fastest bikes out there. The caveat is storage. Modern Tri bikes have built in storage and hydration features that can save a decent number of watts compared to some of the less well thought aftermarket options.
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Regarding 12sp. Shimano’s group is a step backwards. It is a hybrid mix of the old 11sp front end with the new 12sp derailleurs and battery. SRAM has the 10sp cog, 50 tooth big ring, and flat top chain. It works well, but has a high frictional loss. The only advantage is you can run a wider 12 so cassette with 1x.
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Disc brakes are a nice upgrade compared to the old cable rim brakes on a lot of TT bikes. However, I have one disc and one rim brake road bike. The rim brake bike has the HED Jet brake tracks. I never find myself thinking that I really wish I had disc brakes on a that bike. The only difference is maybe a bit better modulation on the disc bike. Your P5 is hydraulic and the Jet Black or Showstopper brake tracks probably give you even better braking than any modern disc brake because the rotor diameter of a rim brake bike is so much better.
So logically, I would stick with the P5 and upgrade the cockpit. That being said, I did talk myself into getting a Hanzo this year. I built from a bare frame with a mix of Ultegra/DuraAce 12sp 1x, AeroCoach bars, a AeroCoach/Revolver wheels and the fancy WattShop aero cranks. I really enjoy riding it compared to my rim brake Speed Concept, but it isn’t noticeably faster, though I have set a couple PRs, and it weights a ton. Long story short. A new bike probably isn’t going to be much faster, but new tools are cool.
Thanks for the feedback. This is what I was thinking as well. I’ll probably look into getting a new aero bar setup from aerocoach or someone similar. I also agree that storage is also not ideal, but I think I’ve convoluted enough solutions to carry everything I want without too much hassle. I’ll also probably convert over to tubeless. Does anyone know if the Zipp super 9 is tubeless compatible?
Thanks for the feedback. This is what I was thinking as well. I’ll probably look into getting a new aero bar setup from aerocoach or someone similar. I also agree that storage is also not ideal, but I think I’ve convoluted enough solutions to carry everything I want without too much hassle. I’ll also probably convert over to tubeless. Does anyone know if the Zipp super 9 is tubeless compatible?
Why would you convert to tubeless?? A new wheelset comparable to yours is going to be $1-2k and it’s a basically a wash on RR and aero.
Thanks for the feedback. This is what I was thinking as well. I’ll probably look into getting a new aero bar setup from aerocoach or someone similar. I also agree that storage is also not ideal, but I think I’ve convoluted enough solutions to carry everything I want without too much hassle. I’ll also probably convert over to tubeless. Does anyone know if the Zipp super 9 is tubeless compatible?
Why would you convert to tubeless?? A new wheelset comparable to yours is going to be $1-2k and it’s a basically a wash on RR and aero.
of everything that’s out there that’s new, i would rank the following in order of importance:
- electronic shifting
- tubeless
- disc brakes
and 2 and 3 are really a tie for second place. these are the biggies. tubeless is just so, so, so much better than tubed in my experience. as in, you just don’t flat. you flat about as often as your car tires flat. again, just my experience. the problem if you flat with a tubed tire is that 50 percent of the time you keep flatting because whatever it was that caused the flat isn’t fixed by just changing the tube. (a breach in the rim tape; a thorn remains stuck in the tire, whatever.) part if the reason you don’t flat with tubeless is… sealant! which doesn’t work as well inside a tube.
the least important new tech is:
- more aero
- lighter
- better handling
- fits better
i say this because bikes since about 2015 all do that stuff pretty well already, if it’s a mainstream tri bike (trek, QR, cervelo, etc.).
the nice thing about getting a new bike nowadays is that you can upgrade it. there’s generally enough tire clearance in new bikes, they’re all thru axle, disc brakes, and as long as the front end can accommodate the aerobar you want (this is still the wild west) you’re good. it’s that last thing - swapping the OE bar for, say, a drag2zero, that’s where i’d say work still needs to be done on the companies making new tri bikes for sale.
That’s a good point about tubeless flats, Dan. I tend to view things from a performance first perspective.
As far as aero bars being the wild west there is a real opportunity for a small company like Wheels Manufacturing. The new bars are drilled in a certain pattern, base bars are all drilled differently. It doesn’t take more than an aluminum plate to mate the two. I’ve made these for myself and friends from spare aluminum stock. Someone paying $1000 for bars would surely pay $200 for a plate with 4 tapped holes in it.
On a TT bike I put tubeless first, by a lot. I’ve had just way to many pinch flats on latex. It’s the single most significant time loss avoidance innovation ever.
I used to want electronic shifting, but that desire went the way of the dodo when I moved to 1x with R2C shifters (yes, 10s, 11-34 and I don’t really wish the gaps were smaller). Electronic shifting is a convenience play. I’d bet more people have had mid run dead batteries since the invention of electronic shifting than broken shifter cables in the whole history of cycling.
I have had noticeable braking issues on one day road races with rim brakes, so I moved on there, but never on TTs, I’m not missing anything.
More aero should be #1, but that ship has sailed, for now. It will be back. There is a couple watts left to harness.
Lighter/handling/fit, yes, that is trivial at this point.