Probably not a good time to post this (late on a Friday afternoon), but what the hell.
I’ve been doing a lot of reading lately on vegetarian and vegan nutrition and recently picked up Rip Esselsytn’s Engine 2 Diet book (recently mentioned in the ST feature article). The benefits for improved cardiovascular health seem to be quite clear. But, up to now, I’ve been of the opinion that these type of diets, while they can be good for overall health, can be problematic for athletes due to the reduced intake of animal proteins and essential animo acids. I realize this is an area that is open for debate, I suspect if you asked 10 nutritionists for their opinion on this subject, you might get 10 answers.
What has intrigued me of late is quite anecdotal really, simply put…reading about athletes like Rich Roll (a vegan Ultraman athlete) and Rip had opened my mind to the fact that plant-based diets can be the basis for superior athletic performance as well as good overall health.
My motivation is two-fold. I have a crap family history when it comes to heart health, particularly on my dad’s side. My dad died at 56 of a heart attack, my uncle just died of a stroke at 61 and grandmother died in her early 60’s as well of a stroke. So, needless to say, any measures I can take to improve my own cardiovascular health, I am willing to consider.
That said, I am very interested in hearing from anyone who has tried eliminating meat and/or all animal products from their diets and how it went for them.
I just made the switch a month ago. Just now I had two gardenburger patties with rice and brown pasta, along with a big glass of chocolate soymilk (I’m not even joking, it’s seriously good) following a 2.5 hr ride and a 2000 yrd swim this morning, plus I have a 22 mi ride in an hour.
I think the recent Eneko Llanos’ ST interview is the greatest support that triathletes can be successful on the diet. I personally switched upon learning of the sustainability and animal cruelty issues (I can’t imagine how anyone could continue eating factory farm meat having watched or knowing about those. If anyone is interested, the “Meet your Meat” video is very graphic but shows you what happens). I’ve decided to no longer support the chicken meat, eggs, dairy, cow, or pig meat industries. They’re incredibly cruel and wasteful. To balance my lifestyle as a triathlete, though, I continue to consume fish (forgive me if that’s hypocritical) and eat a wide variety of foods, along with taking a vitamin to supplement my calcium and certain vitamins not easily encountered in vegetables.
My opinion is that the cardiovascular health alone is worth strongly considering a significant reduction in one’s meat intake. Working in medicine with the elderly and seeing how easily many health conditions can be delayed or eliminated altogether (like diabetes, hypertension, … ) I think the ‘cost’ of a slight inconvenience in finding certain essential amino acids and nutrients is well worth it. Plus, I feel healthier snacking on a carrot.
Also, one final note, I found out yesterday (STOP READING IF YOU LIKE JELLO) that gelatin is made from animal by-products. According to ahem Wikipedia, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatin ) Gelatin’s rocking 44% pig skin, 27% bones, and 28% bovine hides. That is disgusting. No more jello, gummy bears, or marshmallows for me.
I suddenly realize why the Muslim kids at our school cannot have Rice Krispy squares due to the marshmallows.
I am slowly switching to a being vegetarian too. I feel much better when I do not have red meat or pork. I am still eating fish and some chicken for now. I need to find more dinners that I can make that the whole family likes, that do not include meat, poultry or fish, before I can make the switch totally.
FWIW, my coach is a former pro triathlete, who was vegan while competing (and still is vegan). He is not pushing the switch to me at all but is good at sharing information when I ask.
For me, the decision is probably equally due to the health issues, the animal cruelty issues and concerns about the sustainability of our planet.
Also, one final note, I found out yesterday (STOP READING IF YOU LIKE JELLO) that gelatin is made from animal by-products. According to ahem Wikipedia, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatin ) Gelatin’s rocking 44% pig skin, 27% bones, and 28% bovine hides. That is disgusting. No more jello, gummy bears, or marshmallows for me.
Have you checked the ingredients on your fabric softener recently? Seriously.
In general I think that eating less red meat is a good thing, but even more importantly, I think it’s an individual choice.
If it works for you then you should do it.
I made the switch to about 95% vegetarian since living with my fiancee, just out of convenience. I go weeks without meat sometimes.
I don’t make any effort to supplement with anything
I have noticed absolutely no difference in anything in how I feel, recover, or performance.
Probably not a good time to post this (late on a Friday afternoon), but what the hell.
I’ve been doing a lot of reading lately on vegetarian and vegan nutrition and recently picked up Rip Esselsytn’s Engine 2 Diet book (recently mentioned in the ST feature article). The benefits for improved cardiovascular health seem to be quite clear. But, up to now, I’ve been of the opinion that these type of diets, while they can be good for overall health, can be problematic for athletes due to the reduced intake of animal proteins and essential animo acids. I realize this is an area that is open for debate, I suspect if you asked 10 nutritionists for their opinion on this subject, you might get 10 answers.
What has intrigued me of late is quite anecdotal really, simply put…reading about athletes like Rich Roll (a vegan Ultraman athlete) and Rip had opened my mind to the fact that plant-based diets can be the basis for superior athletic performance as well as good overall health.
My motivation is two-fold. I have a crap family history when it comes to heart health, particularly on my dad’s side. My dad died at 56 of a heart attack, my uncle just died of a stroke at 61 and grandmother died in her early 60’s as well of a stroke. So, needless to say, any measures I can take to improve my own cardiovascular health, I am willing to consider.
That said, I am very interested in hearing from anyone who has tried eliminating meat and/or all animal products from their diets and how it went for them.
if you go with the occasional burger, go with grassfed cow or bison. healthier and doesn’t support the bullshit corn industry.
I call it that, because I am specifically referring to the industry that grows bullshitcorn, which is different than real corn. =)
Also, one final note, I found out yesterday (STOP READING IF YOU LIKE JELLO) that gelatin is made from animal by-products. According to ahem Wikipedia, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatin ) Gelatin’s rocking 44% pig skin, 27% bones, and 28% bovine hides. That is disgusting. No more jello, gummy bears, or marshmallows for me.
Have you checked the ingredients on your fabric softener recently? Seriously.
In general I think that eating less red meat is a good thing, but even more importantly, I think it’s an individual choice.
If it works for you then you should do it.
I haven’t eaten walk-meat or fly-meat in 31 years (I’m 57). I do eat swim-meat to get the protein and B vitamins. My family also has a history of heart desease and even with my diet and exercise, my HDL is way too high. I had a scan done two years ago and my arteries are clean. I credit 31 years of excercising and my diet.
Prior to going veggie, I had a bowel movement 3-4 times a week…if I was lucky. Now it’s twice daily and I honestly have not had indigestion or heart burn in 31 years. Indigestion and constipation are a byproduct of walk-meat and fly-meat. You will also not be ingesting all of the hormones, steroids and everything else that is fed to livestock.
I strongly encourage you to make the switch. You will get used to it in a short time and feel physically better for making the switch.
Is a vegetarien diet healthier than a well-balanced diet including eggs, dairy, and meat? Very doubtful.
Some intake of these things adds balance to your diet. Its good to eat a variety of foods. Heme in red meat is far more bio-available than iron in any other source. Getting all your essential amino-acids/balanced proteins much easier if you eat meat. Can’t beat milk/dairy re: calcium. Know how many people have osteoporosis in this country? Fat is good for you - you need it.
Unfortunately the word on the street is that meat is bad for you, fat is bad for you, cholesterol is bad for you, eggs are bad for you, whole milk is bad for you…and its NOT true.
If you want to save animals - don’t eat meat. If you have environmental concerns about animal products - fine. I won’t argue with either - make your own choice. But if you become a vegetarian for health reasons - you’re likely wrong.
Don’t believe me? Thats fine but think about all the sedentary people that live off processed food/meat/junk food…and many of them do o.k. for 50-70+ years even though they smoke, have high blood pressure, and have diabetes. If they exercised they’d probably all make it to 70-90 if they didn’t get cancer. Eating a little meat/eggs/dairy would be a fraction of what they eat + you exercise = you’re safe.
One of the biggest athlete proponents of a veggie diet was Dave Scott. Guess what? He changed his mind and now eats meat. Ask him what he thinks.
Thanks for starting the thread, I’ve been very curious to hear more about this too.
I’ve found a lot of benefits with the new diet. Here are just a few for me personally:
I have desserts less. After I’ve had a spinach salad with pasta, I’m less calorie crazy than if I’d had say a cheeseburger. Having that precedent of actively selecting what I eat for health reasons is helping avoid pitfalls I’ve had in the past. This of course does not in any way include Dark Chocolate Raisinettes, which, if encountered, are immediately purchased and consumed.
On a ride this Monday, we’re coming in from a 2 hour soft-pedal and I decide to have fun with the final few miles of smooth, level road, so I go into TT’ing it back at 32 mph (I think there was a tailwind). When we stopped, one of my main riding partners, Jeff, asked me if I’d lost weight because I seemed more powerful. Also, I noticed that I rode stronger just today. Not conclusive, but it’s a sign that despite the absence of meat I’m improving (though I haven’t had much fish yet, I do supplement with soy and rice milk and protein powder. Plus, Spinach has more grams of protein per calorie than meat , it just takes a lot of spinach to get there). Also of note, after my ride today I weighed 3.2 pounds less than I did after my ride on Monday. I’m probably hitting a steeper drop in body weight / refinement in body composition before I plateau out, but that’s a good trend.
My daily eating pattern is vastly improved. I’ll have a good sized breakfast, then have a big salad w/pasta early afternoon, then some carrots and green tea, then some gardenburgers or what have you. I’ll eat very consistently because the meals don’t seem to fill me up, but then come after 5, I don’t really have a desire for dinner. At all. I’ve just outright skipped it (or any meal of significance, at least) the last 3 days. So having that consistent eating throughout the day that’s frontloaded early on is great. My diet seems to perfectly reinforce the more-or-less optimal eating pattern.
So I would say I’m both losing weight (i.e. fat, I’d suspect. My strength training and endurance performance all seem to be improving, which doesn’t really suggest muscle loss), have equal to or higher energy, eat better in terms of both pattern and quality, and don’t believe my grocery bills have been too greatly affected. Soy milk (which I’m glad you like too. I just finished some Vanilla Silk. Good stuff) is about twice as expensive as dairy, so I have to reduce my intake. I haven’t done a thorough price comparison yet (I intend to), but I can’t really complain about eating so much fresh produce instead of hormone-fed, salt-broth injected chicken breast. I’m only seeing benefits at the moment.
I switched to vegan diet 1,5 years ago. My energy levels are high, recovery times are excellent and I improved my results quite a bit in this time period. I didn’t lose any weight, but I wasn’t overweight in the first place (179 cm and 68 kg). My body composition changed a bit (less body fat). Immune system is excellent, I rarely get sick (actually I can’t remember the last time I was sick).
All this could or couldn’t be related to my diet, but obviously my diet isn’t slowing me down in any sense.
The only negative thing so far has been my ferritin level. I’ve had blood work done last year and it showed low ferritin level and booth hemoglobin and hematocrit were on the low side. Since then I’ve been using Iron supplements, but seems like raising ferritin is a slow process. I would just like to add that I didn’t have any symptoms of iron deficiency so far but I want to be sure that they don’t appear in the future. This also doesn’t have to be diet related since I have up to 28 hours of training per week (not counting bike commuting), and besides that I work full time (40h work week). Also, I’ve noticed that runners are prone to lower iron stores, no matter if they eat meat.
Besides Iron supplements I’ve been taking B complex (because of B12). I didn’t take any other supplements.
I like meat and dairy products way too much to give either of them up, and only the thought of having to give up sugar and chocolate scares me more. I grew up in Southern Germany on a farm with cows, pigs and chickens, so we always had access. But I also enjoy vegetables and fruit very much.
you might want to rethink your soy intake. it is from an article written around 5 years ago and it’s in mothering magazine, but it’s an interesting read anyhow.
and you just found out yesterday that gelatin is made from animals? I remember teasing the other kids that they were eating cow hooves when i was in first grade. of course the knowledge of the hooves doesn’t stop me from enjoying gelatin. I just think of it as using the whole animal.
feel free to eat Gelato as contrary to rumor it should contain no gelatin, it justs sounds like it should (which reminds me of my friend who says i can’t say “kiting checks” because it’s offensive to jewish people).
I don’t necessarily agree with the Vegan thing, but I know several cyclists who are Vegan and do quite well.
However, you have to remember that you will have to make a serious lifestyle change and it is a commitment to the change. Vegan is as much a philosophy as it is a health choice. If you can commit to not wearing leather, using shampoos or soaps that have been tested on animals etc…you can be a Vegan. If you just want to remove meat from your diet, you can be a Vegetarian.
I think if you make an effort to include more fruits and veggies into your diet, less red meat you should be fine.
I’ve been a vegetarian for 13 years and have transitioned to a mostly vegan diet, I would say I am about 90% vegan at this point, having gone from 100% to 90% in the past couple of years. That being said until I make a real dedicated long term effort to be a vegan I can’t really judge it. As for being vegetarian, I would say you cannot judge it until you have taken some serious time as a vegetarian, going back and forth (the occasional burger) isn’t going vegetarian and just throws off the long term effects to make a good judgement.
I have the same issue as the OP, my parents should have in no way ever been allowed to breed with the genetics they bring to the table, diabetes, heart disease, obesity, and cancer all over the place. So I am fighting a uphill battle to make it to 70. A vegetarian diet certainly forces you to think about the food decisions you make and if anything, keeps you out of McDonalds. But I think if you stick to it you will see some serious benefits. Also read the China Study.
Take a look at a book called “Thrive” (previously “The Thrive Diet”) by professional triathlete Brendan Fraser (I may not have remembered that exactly right). Also “Quantum Wellness.”
One of his premises is that eating meat and acidic foods stresses the body, and some foods take more energy to digest and otherwise deal with than you actually gain from the food, whereas fruits and vegetables are easy to digest and don’t stress the body, so the proportion of the food that ends up increasing the body’s energy is much higher.
Without drastically changing my lifestyle, I simply began eating more fruits and vegetables and less meat and dairy, and in general eating higher quality food. In the first month I dropped 10 pounds; since then my weight has remained constant, but I continue to notice changes in my body’s shape (smaller waistline, for example). (I wasn’t trying to lose weight, but definitely had - still have - a few extra pounds of fat hanging around.) I’ve felt much more energetic, and faster, ever since. I’m moving more and more in the vegetarian/vegan direction, both for health and spiritual reasons, but haven’t been too extreme about it (my wife would disagree). All of this started about a year ago, at age 50.
By the way, I just had a complete physical exam, and all of my blood/urine/heart etc. numbers were about as good as they could be - actually better than they were during my last physical (no shortage of calcium, iron, whatever - I’m no expert, but I think there’s plenty of all of that stuff in veggies and fruits, you just have to eat enough of them).
Yes, it has an extensive list of studies at the bottom of the page that backs up their conclusions.
A selected quote:
*Vegetarian diets—naturally low in saturated fat, high in fiber, and replete with cancer-protective phytochemicals—help to prevent cancer. Large studies in England and Germany have shown that vegetarians are about 40 percent less likely to develop cancer compared to meat-eaters.1-3 In the United States, studies of Seventh-Day Adventists have shown significant reductions in cancer risk among those who avoided meat.4,5 Similarly, breast cancer rates are dramatically lower in nations, such as China, that follow plant-based diets.6 Interestingly, Japanese women who follow Western-style, meat-based diets are eight times more likely to develop breast cancer than women who follow a more traditional plant-based diet.7 Meat and dairy products contribute to many forms of cancer, including cancer of the colon, breast, ovaries, and prostate. *
**
(general comment)
I’ve found most meat eaters become defensive of their diet and demand proof that eating meat is less healthy than a vegetarian diet. The studies have shown this to be true and keeping an open mind and not being defensive is the best way to learn something new.
Edit to add that I am a 15 year vegetarian and recently found out I have high cholesterol. When I looked back at what I’d been eating, I’d increased my consumption of dairy and eggs. Still working out regularly but the higher dairy was the biggest change in my diet. I’ve since cut out a lot of it but haven’t eliminated it entirely. I like ice cream too much
Gelatin is in a LOT of pre-packaged foods. Read your labels carefully. I miss smores and am still looking for a vegetarian marshmallow but so far no luck.
Dark chocolate is fine. Just check to be sure there is no milk in it. Usually 70% and higher is safe for vegans.
I grew up in Southern Germany on a farm with cows, pigs and chickens, so we always had access. But I also enjoy vegetables and fruit very much.