I’ve noticed Style A is often advocated for in longer-distance swims, but I’m not sure I really understand why. It looks graceful, but I would think having your arm in the water earlier and longer would create more drag. Style B looks more intense, but each arm movement seems more efficient to me because the entire portion underwater is pulling as much as possible.
I’d also think to some extent how exhausted you get is determined by your stroke rate, which you could just slow down with Style B. I also think that depending on wave action, Style A seems impractical to me.
What am I not understanding? Or does it not really matter in the end?
i don’t know what style A is. the video refers to styles 1, 2, 3, and 4. if you mean style 1, no, that’s not a typical distance freestyle. we have had a lot of recent threads on the forum, and articles on the front page, about what good freestyle looks like for triathletes. have you seen any of them?
For style A, I was thinking of what that video refers to as “arrow” freestyle, and style B what it refers to as “boat” (for some reason the timestamps aren’t working completely from the link).
I have read through many of the articles here, which are great (one of the reasons I posted here), but maybe I missed this. Usually I don’t see discussion of the difference between the forward arm movement difference between “arrow” and “boat” though. I see arrow advocated a lot for distance but I’m not sure what the advantage is, or if it even matters. I can see why, if you were going to hold your arm underwater, you’d want to hold it that way, but I’m not sure why you’d have it underwater to begin with. Maybe with a slower stroke rate you have to put your arm somewhere? I’ve tried both.
For style A, I was thinking of what that video refers to as “arrow” freestyle, and style B what it refers to as “boat” (for some reason the timestamps aren’t working completely from the link).
I have read through many of the articles here, which are great (one of the reasons I posted here), but maybe I missed this. Usually I don’t see discussion of the difference between the forward arm movement difference between “arrow” and “boat” though. I see arrow advocated a lot for distance but I’m not sure what the advantage is, or if it even matters. I can see why, if you were going to hold your arm underwater, you’d want to hold it that way, but I’m not sure why you’d have it underwater to begin with. Maybe with a slower stroke rate you have to put your arm somewhere? I’ve tried both.
boat, horse, arrow, all contain the same important elements. i do think the author of that video is a really, really talented swimmer in a unique way. he’s the rich little of swimmers, and you have to be old to understand that reference. i’ve never seen a swimmer so effectively impersonate other swimmers.
i guess i wouldn’t get too hung up on freestyle types, where you need to choose one. if you look at other videos they’ll ask you to choose between hip and shoulder driven freestyle. now you have an even bigger problem! more choices! at the end of this video you’ve shown us the author discusses what is common among most or all the styles: rotation around a central axis from the waist up. a head that does not veer out of line. small kicks. and then if you look at each of the last 3 styles, a long extend or glide phase after the catch, with the hand remaining near the surface of the water until the pull commences. feet near the surface. toes pointing down. engagement of the core.
how many of us do these important things, regardless of our style of front crawl? i would first just master the elements of front crawl.
finally, this guy is doing almost all-out 50s in each demonstration of a technical style. anywhere from 24 to 29 seconds. he’s kicking like a sonofabitch. are you really going to kick like that? i swim with a 4-beat kick. i can’t swim 2.4mi with a big-time 6-beat kick. i can’t swim 500 yards that way. so, you’ll need to find a way to execute the important themes in the context of a sustainable distance technique.
I’ve seen some of this channel’s videos before and I’m not a big fan of them. This video in particular is a click-baity title that is just re-labeling already established techniques. They don’t teach boat/horse/arrow because there are better names for the actual mechanics.
Style 1 (windmill) is really only for sprinters. this is a high-output shoulder-driven style. See Manadou or Ricky Busquets for examples.
Style 2 (horse) is just a ‘hybrid’ style, or you will hear it referred to as both hip driven and shoulder driven. This style can be effective at all distances-- it can be a high-output 200-ish type stroke (like M Phelps), but you’ll see 1500m guys use the same style, but with the more 2-beat kick of the ‘arrow’ style (style 4). Effortless Swimming had a really good video on Florian Wellbrock with this style-- really this is called ‘front quadrant swimming’ and it’s how he swims a 10k open water race. His other famous videos about the ‘easiest 100m in 1:10’ show Dan Smith with a very smooth front-quadrant stroke.
Style 3 is probably how a lot of distance events start out, nice and balanced, but once you start going hard and breathing more, most swimmers have a natural gallop to their strong/breathing side. Notice that the in the video he isn’t breathing regularly (breathes twice in the last few strokes into the wall).
As to your last question, your hand out front is creating leverage and lift for the rest of your body. Through that extended hand you can set up the rest of your body position. IT gives you something to rotate around and is the first link in the chain, so to speak, to set up the rest (elbow, shoulders, hips, etc). If you have the fitness to maintain a high stroke rate, that’s great, but there is a reason why the stroke rate slows down as the distance gets longer; everyone slows down their stroke at some distance.
Style 3 is probably how a lot of distance events start out, nice and balanced, but once you start going hard and breathing more, most swimmers have a natural gallop to their strong/breathing side. Notice that the in the video he isn’t breathing regularly (breathes twice in the last few strokes into the wall).
Yes, that’s what happens to me, there’s sort of a gallop that starts to become compelling.
Per both of your replies, he is at a fast pace, I was more just wondering about the arm positions
As to your last question, your hand out front is creating leverage and lift for the rest of your body. Through that extended hand you can set up the rest of your body position. IT gives you something to rotate around and is the first link in the chain, so to speak, to set up the rest (elbow, shoulders, hips, etc). If you have the fitness to maintain a high stroke rate, that’s great, but there is a reason why the stroke rate slows down as the distance gets longer; everyone slows down their stroke at some distance.
That’s helpful. After I read your comment, I seem to remember reading that explanation somewhere else too. The lift aspect makes a certain amount of sense, especially if your rate starts to slow.
The swim smooth program has categories of the ways people swim. You have high turnover swimmers with shorter strokes and swimmers with less turnover and longer strokes with more power in each stroke. In each group you have people who swim quite well and use their approach to advantage. Open water swimmers tend to more of a higher turnover. Which can help in rougher water etc. Then you have a bunch of people with quite inefficient strokes like overgliders. You can look it up on the internets.