I barely kick if at all, and been doing a two beat type of kick with my swim. Sometimes its a slight flick, sometimes a harder kick. Since learning, I been able to swim longer.
Sometimes I don’t feel balanced, and when I try a flutter kick, get more balanced.
One coach of mine to do the two beat kick, for several reasons. A coach I got analyzed said not to bother, and work on my balance and basics first.
Said it was inappropriate.
What do you guys use and whats your opinion?
A two beat kick is a flutter kick.
Go with what feels right to you. Though if you need to kick to feel balanced, you’re probably using that kick to prop up hips that are sinking because of bad body position.
I’m thinking the same, but some days I feel level, other days I feel like I’m swimming through sludge.
Try incorporating some band swimming into your workouts. Will sort or your “balance” issues soon enough. Forces you to engage your core to keep your hips and legs up.
In terms of kicking, do what is most comfortable/efficient. Different strokes for different folks.
(Hot tip: if you don’t want to buy a fancy ankle band, just lop the top off of a swim cap. Good luck!)
or cut up an old bike tube.
thanks for the tips.
Or put your speedo around your ankles.
You mean, pull down your speedo down to your ankles? Wouldn’t want to see somebody hopping out of the changing room and heading to the pool with his speedos already around 'em ankles…
Or spare speedo’s if you’re feeling modest.
Seriously though; as said above: a two-beat kick is just a slow version of a flutter kick. Flutter is just a term to differentiate this type of kick from the type used in breast-stroke or butterfly. If you speed it up (4 beat or 6 beat - per armstroke) it will feel more like a flutter. I too kick pretty slowly but I use it to balance in the water and keep my body aligned. I get some propulsion, depending on how much I’m flexing my feet. Often they just trail though. For long distance swimming, I find that balance is as (if not more) important than propulsion from your kick. The exercises with bands above may help. I find using fins and a kickboard also gives a great workout while allowing focus on balance at speed. I often do 5 0r 10 x 100m as a set like this.
A two beat kick is a flutter kick.
Go with what feels right to you. Though if you need to kick to feel balanced, you’re probably using that kick to prop up hips that are sinking because of bad body position.
+1. My thoughts exactly. If the OPs hips are sinking, she might want to adjust her head position too. She could be holding it too far up so her hips are sinking.
You can gain a lot from a two beat kick and may be preferred by some but from your description you appear to gain little from it. On top of everyone else’s suggestions, I would also add some kick sets and ankle stretches - these will help you to build a more efficient kick so that you can gain more from your two beat kick and obtain that desired position.
Q: when you do a pull set, are your times faster or slower than full stroke?
My speed is only slightly faster with a pull buoy than without.
I been told think of the kick not as so much for propulsion, but to help with rotation.
Prior to learning the two beat kick, I’d feel so winded from kicking so hard. After, I was able to swim almost forever. It comes and goes, that ease. Not being someone who grew up swimming, time away from the pool brings a bit of that rust and lack of form, but not as much as when I first started.
Something to work on a bit more. Thanks everyone for the feedback.
An elite swimmer will get some propulsion but mostly gains good position which is what we are all looking for as it frees up the arms a bit and makes you faster. In your case its probably minimal and is demonstrated by the fact that your pull sets are faster than full stroke. The pull buoy gives you a good body position so you go faster. Once you remove that nice body position you move slower. By improving position with a band, flexibility and kick sets you will gain efficiency and swim faster
Excuse my newbie question on this but when does your leg kick in a two beat kick?
On TJ Frys blog he says that the right leg would kick just as your right arm begins the pull. Some other sites on the net say the opposite - that your leg kicks when the opposite hand begins its pull.
Does it matter which?
Excuse my newbie question on this but when does your leg kick in a two beat kick?
On TJ Frys blog he says that the right leg would kick just as your right arm begins the pull. Some other sites on the net say the opposite - that your leg kicks when the opposite hand begins its pull.
Does it matter which?
I’m pretty sure it’s a comfort thing, much like the entire discussion on this thread. You do what feels right and compliments your stroke.
Two beat kick while swimming but when you are about 50m-100m from the finish of the swim start to do a 6 beat kick to get some blood flow in your legs. You will not do the wobble out of the water this way.
Excuse my newbie question on this but when does your leg kick in a two beat kick?
On TJ Frys blog he says that the right leg would kick just as your right arm begins the pull. Some other sites on the net say the opposite - that your leg kicks when the opposite hand begins its pull.
Does it matter which?
The right leg kicking when the opposite hand pulls is a somewhat common description, and an attempt to get the kick timed properly to the arms. Depending on the style of swimming, it can work well or not at all. The thing is, this is approaching the problem in a roundabout way. It doesn’t really matter where the left arm is, as what you really want to sync your dominant right leg kick with is the finish of your right arm stroke. That may or may not happen when the left arm enters.
When the left arm enters is not what you should focus on. The efficacy of proper kick timing is highly sensitive to exactly when that kick is placed. Focusing on the opposite arm entry instead of focusing on the same side finishing the pull does not foster the refinement of kick timing nearly as well. It is that refinement of kick timing that is the primary driver of body position.
So IMO, TJ Frye’s advice is flatly incorrect while the seemingly opposite advice is closer but still misses the mark.
Thanks. I’ll have to give this a try this weekend in the pool.
See what feels best and what gives me the best result.
I barely kick if at all, and been doing a two beat type of kick with my swim. Sometimes its a slight flick, sometimes a harder kick. Since learning, I been able to swim longer.
Sometimes I don’t feel balanced, and when I try a flutter kick, get more balanced.
One coach of mine to do the two beat kick, for several reasons. A coach I got analyzed said not to bother, and work on my balance and basics first.
Said it was inappropriate.
What do you guys use and whats your opinion?
The balanced while swimming free has more to do with your core then it does your kick style. Different coaches with have different things for you to try ut to be honest it depends on so many other factors and without seeing it in person I can’t be much help. That being saw the one issue I have with a two beat kick it your turnover will have to be much higher which can allow for other flaws in your stroke. I come from a swimming past as a 1500 swimmer (PB 15:46) and I use a 4 beat kick with a partial catchup stroke. I will switch to a 6 beat kick in the last few hundred meters or if I want to get away from another swimmer.
Now all that being suit, once you go open water with a wetsuit you will be nice and high in the water so it will be much easy to keep balance.