Training & Mild Insomnia

Triathlon Forum
1

I typically sleep deep/hard for 8hrs each night. Been doing tri’s for 10+years now. Every year when the training starts to ramp up (12+hrs) and I start to add in intensity, I start to have a hard time sleeping, either can’t get to sleep or I wake up in the middle of the night for a few hours. I do try and get the higher intensity workouts done earlier in the day so I have time to settle down before bed time. I also drink tons of fluids to stay hydrated.

Anyone have this problem, and got a solution? Thanks for your time, appreciate it!!

2

insomnia can be a symptom of too much stress.
Training stress, life stress it’s all stress.

You may want to think about increasing volume significantly while adding in intensity.

I’ve written quite a bit on insomnia on here in the past, mostly about tx options. Most of that was 7-10yr ago. Might be worth the search if you’re pondering going down that route at all

3

insomnia can be a symptom of too much stress.
Training stress, life stress it’s all stress.

I’ll second this. I typically notice this when I’m carrying too much of a load. I’ve always found the best long-term success when I take a step back which allows me to continue training. Ignoring this warning sign typically leads to me falling apart.

edit to add: everyone has different warning signs. For some it’s a loss of libido, for others it may be a cranky-attitude. etc. For me it’s waking in the middle of the night.

4

Hard workouts and intensity can raise your cortisol levels. I know after a hard race I will be dog tired, but won’t be able to sleep well for a couple of days. Any little thing wakes me up and then I can’t go back to sleep. An active recovery day or two usually gets me back straight.

5

Read up on magnesium deficiency and see if the signs fit.

I started taking Magnesium for muscle cramping problems (a doctor told me to try it after I got sent by my GP to the ER for visible stomach cramps that would not stop) and man did it help my sleep as well as the other problem.

6

Insulin and a blood sugar drop while sleeping.

My clue was always waking at 3am - i could only sleep by eating more. A cycle I was in for a long time

Started experiencing mental health issues that have never come up for me before - particularly anxiety.

I was able to fix by reducing carbs for dinner and late snack - now eat nuts, cottage cheese, proteins and fats.

No reduction in calories just switching around the source

Has fixed it for me. Great sleeps, have lost excess fat, no more mental health probs

Good luck

7

Insulin and a blood sugar drop while sleeping.

My clue was always waking at 3am - i could only sleep by eating more. A cycle I was in for a long time

Started experiencing mental health issues that have never come up for me before - particularly anxiety.

I was able to fix by reducing carbs for dinner and late snack - now eat nuts, cottage cheese, proteins and fats.

No reduction in calories just switching around the source

Has fixed it for me. Great sleeps, have lost excess fat, no more mental health probs

Good luck

That’s actually pretty cool. Thanks for sharing. Normal carbs the rest of the day?

8

Yep, lots of carbs though I avoid crappy white carbs now permanently
.

9

Yeah, I get it too.
Got a panic attack about 11 months ago when waking up during the night out of nowhere. Which was rather weird because I guess people wouldn’t describe me as the anxious type. I didn’t even know what an anxiety disorder or a panic attack is at that point.
Anyway, seems it was a traumatic experience for me that triggered some anxiety and insomnia. Feelings I wouldn’t have thought were possible to have for me.
Had it figured out over the summer, now I’m training more and it’s worse again. Still don’t know how to get rid of it really. Don’t feel anxious mostly during the day, come bed time I get more and more anxious which leads to insomnia which leads to anxiety which leads to insomnia. It’s a vicious circle so I do understand

The only thing I know is… the more you worry about sleep the more elusive sleep gets. Easier said than done though obviously.

10

Man, thanks for all the reply’s, just bought some magnesium this morning after I got out of the pool.

Years prior, I would just pop a Advil PM, and I would usually get some sleep, I want to get away from doing that.

Mine is correlated to high intensity, I can put in a lot of low intensity hours and sleep hard, but once the heart rate goes up, it all goes to he!!.

Will let you know how the magnesium works…thanks again!!

11

I would just pop a Advil PM

Mine is correlated to high intensity, I can put in a lot of low intensity hours and sleep hard, but once the heart rate goes up, it all goes to he!!.

2 things w/ the first being most important

  1. if it’s correlated to high intensity then that’s a HUGE training plan design cue right there. Probably the most important thing you can think about from this entire thread

  2. The PM part of the Advil M is benadryl, an antihistamine that crosses the blood brain barrier. This can leave you sedated and impaired the next morning. The body also develops a tolerance to benadryl meaning that later or sooner you’ll have to take more to get the same effect.

12

Just a warning- Magnesium can clear you out for a few days as you adjust. You will not be constipated.

13

Thanks Brian, I appreciate your advice, I will readjust my training, and introduce the intensity much slower, or maybe not at all.

Last season I did make it through 2 70.3 races with training with out having issues, but I built up really slow. Guess I have my answer right in front of me.

14

Thanks Moonrocket, will stay close to the facilities :wink:
.

15

Brian - I went back and read some of your comments in prior threads. I’ve historically battled mild insomnia as well, not related to training, as I can remember not being able to sleep 25-30 years ago in middle school. Question is, how does one go about getting a prescription for lunesta (or the like)? Is it a matter of showing up at a GP and saying you can’t sleep? I’ve used various things in the past - melatonin, unisom, excessive booze (sadly), etc.

16

I have the same problem as I did my indoor rides from 8pm - 9.30pm and have dinner after that. I found myself getting really hungry during midnight - this has been bugging me for the past a year or so

17

I’ve historically battled mild insomnia as well, not related to training, as I can remember not being able to sleep 25-30 years ago in middle school. Question is, how does one go about getting a prescription for lunesta (or the like)? Is it a matter of showing up at a GP and saying you can’t sleep? .

When I first started selling Lunesta in Mesa/Gilbert and then Tucson it was pretty eye opening how little the docs I called on understood sleep and how it plays are part in many/most disease states. If I had $100 for every time I heard that insomnia wasn’t a treatment concern I’d have at least $5,000, at least.

Now it seems that sleep is much better understood. Most DOs, MDs, PAs, NPs are much more well versed on sleep issues & comorbidities such as anxiety, depression, stress, pain, metabolic diseases then 8-12 years ago; the hesitation/fear of writing a controlled substance for sleep has also dissipated.

If it were me I’d go into my pcp and explain/list a few things.

  1. These are my symptoms and list them off. Do you have trouble staying asleep if so ~ what time do you normally wake up, how long are you awake before falling back asleep. Do you only struggle with falling asleep. Is it both? How long after you go to bed does it take you to fall asleep?

  2. I’d let them know the negative impact on quality of life - how struggling w/sleep impacts family, work & pleasure/hobbies.

  3. These are the things I’d like a treatment to ideally accomplish

Some things to think about before going in.

Come in with lists. I found it was a lot easier to talk with docs both when I worked in/outpatient cardiac rehab and as a drug rep when things went A,B,C vs meandering around the point.

be specific. You don’t have to be overly specific such as “I wake up 2.58x per week at 0243 on avg and stay awake for 67.45 minutes before falling back asleep”. Just say I usually go to bed around 2230 and find myself struggling 2-3x per week, typically waking ~ 2-3am and it seems to be ~ 60-75 min before I fall back asleep.

You just conveyed a ton of info to help guide your tx options.

PM or email me if you want more specific info. I used to keep up with all the drug tx’s in the sleep market bc insomnia was something I struggled with for > a decade. Still struggle at times, but haven’t kept up with the latest tx options.

Hopefully that helps.

18

I have a fairly accurate and consistent internal clock, and I wake up on my own @5:15-5:30 every morning

Some nights, D’Wife will tell me I tossed around a bunch but I’ll have no memory of it - nor whatever I was dreaming that cause me to ‘flop like a fish’

She has suggested melatonin to ease restless nights , but I’m afraid that will mess up my automatic wake-up time

The last thing I want to do is set an alarm for such an hour, because - as I have posted here before - she has warned me, in no uncertain terms: “I don’t care what the fuck you do when you get up at 5 fucking whatever. Run, ride, knit, it doesn’t matter. Just DON’T wake me the fuck up … for ANY fucking reason!!!”

19

come bed time I get more and more anxious which leads to insomnia which leads to anxiety which leads to insomnia. It’s a vicious circle so I do understand

The only thing I know is… the more you worry about sleep the more elusive sleep gets. Easier said than done though obviously.

I’ve had periods of that in the past

Then I realized, there is nothing worth worrying about at 2AM, if you can’t do anything about it at that time, so get your rest, regroup, and handle it in the morning

That’s a naive solution, I know, but it’s worked for me

20

Read up on magnesium deficiency and see if the signs fit.

I started taking Magnesium for muscle cramping problems (a doctor told me to try it after I got sent by my GP to the ER for visible stomach cramps that would not stop) and man did it help my sleep as well as the other problem.

When I lived in Philly and was running 40-50 miles a week, I used to wake up in the middle of the night with an uncontrollable urge to go for a run, a walk, a ride, anything just to get out of the house.

Of course, it may have had less to do with Restless Leg Syndrome, or over- or under-training, iron / magnesium levels or vitamins, and more to do with trying to escape from the misdiagnosed bipolar coke whore I was living with at the time