I texted a more conservative friends about the Biden Pardons.
He stated:
“ The pardons are ridiculous. A fitting final action by one of the most corrupt presidents in many years.
Sets a horrible precedent. Preemptive pardon just in case someone might unjustly go after them? Ignores whether or not they may have actually broken laws”
I was going to quibble with the most corrupt, but realized he said one of. I think he probably is on this list probably will be Tier 2 with Trump there for now as well.
Rankings are by ChatGPT.
Tier 1: Most Notorious for Corruption
Warren G. Harding (1921–1923)
Rationale: The Teapot Dome Scandal involved high-level officials leasing federal oil reserves in exchange for bribes. Harding himself wasn’t directly implicated but appointed corrupt friends to key positions, known as the “Ohio Gang.”
Ulysses S. Grant (1869–1877)
Rationale: Grant’s administration was marred by numerous scandals, including the Whiskey Ring (tax evasion by distillers) and Credit Mobilier (a fraudulent railroad construction scheme). Grant was personally honest but overly trusting of corrupt associates.
Tier 2: Significant Corruption and Mismanagement
Richard Nixon (1969–1974)
Rationale: Nixon’s involvement in the Watergate Scandal, which included abuses of power, obstruction of justice, and illegal political activities, led to his resignation. The scandal set a new benchmark for presidential misconduct.
James Buchanan (1857–1861)
Rationale: Buchanan’s administration was marked by corruption tied to land speculation and government contracts. His failure to act decisively against secessionist movements also invited allegations of incompetence and cronyism.
Andrew Johnson (1865–1869)
Rationale: Johnson was accused of using his office to shield corrupt allies during Reconstruction. His leniency toward Southern elites raised suspicions about favoritism and contributed to widespread graft.
Tier 3: Lesser Scandals, But Significant Ethical Concerns
Bill Clinton (1993–2001)
Rationale: The Whitewater controversy and his administration’s fundraising practices, such as the Lincoln Bedroom scandal, raised ethical questions. While Clinton wasn’t directly implicated in Whitewater, the perception of impropriety lingered.
Andrew Jackson (1829–1837)
Rationale: Jackson’s Spoils System rewarded political supporters with government jobs, leading to widespread inefficiency and corruption. He was also criticized for his personal financial dealings and relationships with political insiders.
Honorable Mentions: Scandals Without Full Corruption
Ronald Reagan (1981–1989): The Iran-Contra Affair undermined Reagan’s reputation, though he wasn’t directly implicated.
Thomas Jefferson (1801–1809): The Yazoo Land Scandal (post-dating his presidency) and questionable financial dealings during his life raised some ethical questions.
I am not sure what your rationale is for Trump being in the second tier.
He refused to divest his interests. He profited from having foreign government officials stay at his hotels. He profited from having Secret Service stay at his hotels. Basically anyone who wanted to influence him knew they just needed to pump his coffers with overpriced stays at his hotels.
Trump would promote his own resorts by doing official Presidential business at them.
346 executive branch officials made 993 visits to Trump properties during Trump’s term, most often patronizing the president’s DC hotel. Ivanka Trump and Jared Kushner paid the greatest number of visits to Trump properties, 78 and 55, respectively. Vice President Pence visited Trump’s businesses 33 times while in office, including going to his DC hotel 22 times.
143 members of Congress made 361 visits to Trump businesses. Sen. Lindsey Graham made the greatest number of visits, with 28, followed by Rep. Matt Gaetz, who went to one 22 times, and Sen. Rand Paul and Rep. Kevin McCarthy, who visited a Trump property 20 and eighteen times respectively.
Should we discuss that whole “tried to steal the election he lost and caused a riot at the Capitol building” thing?
Now he got $TRUMP coins which he launched right before taking office. Trump can start selling his personal stash of 800 million!!! $TRUMP coins in April.
Sorry dude but Trump is in a class of corruption all by himself.
I don’t love what Biden did with the pardons but with Trump promising to go after Biden and his family, I get it.
So sure, put Biden in tier two. But Trump doesn’t belong in tier two.
They don’t really care about the pardons. Trump just pardoned all of the Jan 6 insurrectionists and they don’t give a fuck. They just care that their guy won.
I think there is corruption with his family. Maybe not criminal. There is a reason he pardoned them. Hunter made a fortune off his name as did his siblings.
People have been saying there’s corruption for years but I haven’t seen it articulated. When do we stop waiting for evidence of this presumed corruption?
Making money off of someone’s name is not corruption.
Just reading, your justifications, How does Nixon, not get Top Seeding? Harding you say, he was not implicated, in Grant you say he was honest but trusted the wrong people.
Nixon" Nixon’s involvement in the Watergate Scandal , which included abuses of power, obstruction of justice, and illegal political activities, led to his resignation. The scandal set a new benchmark for presidential misconduct."
So how can it set a new level and yet not be #1 to those of the past.
Trump well depends on how you want to define corrupt, but he sure made sure to make a lot of money, although someone told me after his 4 yrs his net worth was lower than before (of course at those levels there is so much monkey business on finances who knows - as the trump trial showed, a lot of shit is made up and just agreed to)
But I would say Nixon 1, Trump 2 and then the rest.
They’ve been investigating his family for years and have come up with nothing but Hunter paying his taxes late and lying on a gun form. Sorry, I’m going to need a little more before I can accept he’s at Watergate level.
So if not criminal then why would he pardon them, you kind of lose all credibility with that.
Trump literally makes fortunes off his name. College athletes make millions off their Names, Image Likeness. Make money off who you are is not corruption. Its America capitalism meeting American celebrity love.
Using your position to steer businesses. to your or friends business can be corruption.
Children and relatives of high profile people have been profiting off of their names for a long time. It doesn’t necessarily mean that corruption is involved in all circumstances. I’m sure that Hunter, Eric, Don Jr and Ivanka all benefitted from people/corporations/governments that wanted to win favor with their fathers. But if no favorable policies were traded or granted, there is nothing wrong with that.
As Thom said, Comer and Jordan investigated Biden for years. Their best witness was a Russian who was just sentenced to four years for lying to the FBI. The whole purpose of that investigation was to make Biden look as corrupt as trump so Republicans would say “Screw it, I might as well vote for the corrupt Republican”.
“My family has been subjected to unrelenting attacks and threats, motivated solely by a desire to hurt me. Unfortunately, I have no reason to believe these attacks will end.”- Joe Biden
There are evidently some people on the board who think it’s reasonable and realistic for someone with the privilege to protect his family and vulnerable officials from unjustified reprisals to forego that opportunity, and force them to be the Guinea pigs that get to stress test whether we still have a functioning judicial system. I think that’s more than a bit silly. It would probably be marginally better for the country if Biden did so, especially if the line held, but most of us would put our family ahead of our country, especially when the potential benefit to the country would be so marginal and nebulous and the risk to our family is so crushing.
Trump will seek to punish perceived enemies. I used to think the “Lock Her Up!” chants were a bit of dumb theatre. I no longer do. He promised to punish his political opponents. He is trying to do everything he promised to do, there is zero reason to think this would be any different. Leaving aside the fact he’s done it before (Cohen).
You seem to miss my point, or intentionally trimmed my comment to change its point.
You don’t think it was criminal, than what do you think the point of the pardon is. Since you say there is a point to the pardon, but their actions are not criminal.
Making money off your family name isn’t corruption, and the reason he pardoned his family is obvious. It’s because Donald Trump and James Comer and others in that camp have openly declared their intent to use criminal investigation as a means of political retribution.
You need to really stop trying to put the pardons on the sqme level as some of these other items we’re talking about. You sound silly.
It’s pretty hard to take a list seriously when you declare “most corrupt presidents” and both of the top two are listed as having been innocent of wrongdoing.
It’s not clear that you know what the word “corrupt” means.
The point is to try to protect them from spurious, bad faith investigations that will suck up years of their lives and hundreds of thousands of dollars in the best case and land them in jail in the worst case. In the country in which we now live, neither of those scenarios needs to involve even the vaguest suspicion they did anything criminal.