I’m more confused than before this thread started. For a 2 beat kick, as my right arm is extending towards the catch, should my RIGHT or LEFT foot be kicking DOWN? Thanks.
Top Swimmers do about 30% of their workouts just kicking. This is why they can hold it for a 1500 meter swim. If you do not practice kicking you will not be able to do it in a race.
Do most of your kicking on your back where engage your butt and hamstring muscles. When you turn over your legs will come to the surface easily.
DougStern
It is up to you to see what you prefer. There are examples of both, and all used to good effect. From the videos i’ve seen, Hackett kicks down with his RIGHT foot in the scenario you describe. Dougstern advocates the opposite, and Fulla posted about some guy who held the world record at 1500m by doing what Dougstern advocates.
I personally find that right pull/left kick destabilizes my stroke too much and i prefer a right pull/right kick.
I have a two-beat crossover kick…I know, I know it’s not ideal, but seems to work for me. It’s also a bad habit that started at a young age.
The reason why your legs are crossing is because your hands are crossing over your center when entering the water. Try getting your hands to enter the water directly in front of your shoulders. I started doing this, and my legs instantly stopped crossing.
Just took a cruise through YouTube “Open Water Swim” and it from what I can tell, all the marathon guys kick a whole lot more than 2 or 4 beats…even the women. I’d say they are all doing 6 beat kicks, but it is hard to confirm from the lower quality of the videos on the PC. Suffice it to say that there ain’t no 2 beat cross-overs going on.
My bro-in-law is an open water swimmer and confirms the 6 beat kick seems to be prevalent in open water because it does the most for rotation, which is even harder make/keep happening in the wave action and to keep the body alignment correct for the breath-every-stroke technique they follow. He does allow that it can be tiring to keep it up, however.
A six beat kick and be as hard or as easy as you make it. My distance 6 beat kick is just for rhythm not speed. I use it for open my hips.
DougStern
Actually, that’s not the case - my hands don’t cross over center. Not sure where/how I picked up the two beat crossover (most likely as a kid and it was never corrected as an agegrouper, high schooler or in college). I’m usually in the top 5 out of the water in most races, so there is hope to those with a two beat kick!
A six beat kick and be as hard or as easy as you make it. My distance 6 beat kick is just for rhythm not speed. I use it for open my hips.
DougStern
Yeah, just the mere flutter of a right foot down/right arm out (which your posts clued me into 6 months ago, thank you very much!) seems really helpful for body alignment without taking a lot of effort. Sometimes the 2 key down beats can be a little more than the other 4. Would seem that net result is more economy with a light 6 beat than dragging a 2 beat crossover behind.
what do you think of holding the kickboad underwater to get a body position closer to swimming freestyle? I got the idea from the new finis kickboard demo on insidetri.
NO, NO, No. Tightened your abs as your kick. It will flatten your back and get your legs higher in the water. Also practice kicking on your back with your arms extended overhead in the water.
DougStern
thanks doug. what are some kicksets you recommend ?
I really cannot recommend any because I do not know what kind of shape you are in.
I do 1,000 straight
5 X 200
1,600 IM kick
600 alternating dolphin on stomach and back
10 X 100s
20 X 50s
DougStern
Doug,
Our local master’s team workouts are about 25-30% kick, with Lots of kick/stroke drills mixed into the entire workout. We’ve also completed a few 500 yard straight kicks with 10 second pickups. I think the steady state kicking and short intervals has really helped improve my overall kick speed.
10x100 on 1:45 remains my personal favorite…best done at the end of the practice as there’s little left in the tank afterwards. After a 3 weeks of swimming, I can make 7 out of 10.
Looking forward to Curacao.
Keep on kicking.
-Andy
ndy,
I am really looking forrward to seeing you all.
One of my birthday kick sets was 10 X 200 on 3:20. I managed 3:00 for all of them (I did wear Zoomers for them).
DougStern
Now I’m confused even more.
Doug Stern wrote: “As you kick down with your right leg your right shoulder and arm extend and your left hip opens.”
Then you wrote: “As Doug mentions above, a 3 beat kick gets you in sync with your arms so that you are kicking down as you extend the opposite arm.”
“As Doug mentions above, a 3 beat kick gets you in sync with your arms so that you are kicking down as you extend the opposite arm.”
Sorry, Alzheimers. I lost track of my thought in the middle of writing it. That should read:
as you begin the pull with the opposite arm.
As you kick down with your right leg your right shoulder and arm extend and your left hip opens
I thought your opposite arm extended and the same hip opened. Isn’t that what’s happeing in this picture?
from
http://www.limmatsharks.com/CrawlAnalysis/
“as my right arm is extending towards the catch, should my RIGHT or LEFT foot be kicking DOWN?”
-
- Think of it this way. You are driving your hip down to create power for your opposite arm (pulling). Your foot is connected to your hip and as the hip drives down, the kick should flow out of that movement.
On a 2 or 4 beat kick, the same leg is kicking regardless of which hip is driving down. If your hip and foot are traveling in opposite directions, you have:
a- no power
b- your body is piking so that your flow throgh the water is disturbed
c- you will look like an alligator from above, serpentining through the water.
- Think of it this way. You are driving your hip down to create power for your opposite arm (pulling). Your foot is connected to your hip and as the hip drives down, the kick should flow out of that movement.
So the answer to your question is “no”…
What?
Your opposite leg should be kicking down as an extension of your hip, which is creating power for your pull. This is when you begin the pull, which is after you set your catch. So when you are extending into your catch, you should be getting ready to kick down with the opposite leg.
Cousin Elwood explained it very nicely.
DougStern
Barry,
Put on a pair of fins and play with it. You will get it right away.
DougStern