It’s still a headscratcher to me how Ironman events got so popular in France. Considering there is such a deep selection of quality, non-branded events at all distances. I think we’ve definitly lost something with the demise of triathlon magazines. Nobody spreads out a paper calendar anymore. To get a full overview of the season. And the races on offer.
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Why?
Lots of the costs are fixed no matter the distance (within reason). For example - police generally require a 4 hour minimum. Whether your doing a sprint or 70.3 - you still pay 4 hours…
Porta potties - you pay by the day (or weekend)
Town permits - doesn’t matter the distance
T-shirts - Same
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Pretty easily. Just increase the price of the HIM to make the sprint feel like a better deal.
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Then as what lurker stated, that money can be used to subsidize the sprint races,lowering the rate
I don’t think a $250 HIM is subsidizing a $169 sprint race, when there are <60 HIM racers and hundreds of sprint.
Interestingly, the price premium on 5150 races (non draft Oly) organized under the IM license is about 20% over what independent races charge. At middle distance, it’s closer to 100%… (in both cases, we’re talking about independent races with all the bells and whistles - aid stations, fully closed to traffic, finisher zones, medals, swag, often part of a national race series, etc.).
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Right. I did the Hamburg Olympic Distance in 2023. Organised by Ironman. It was a good inner-city race. But nowhere near as good as my local independent events.
It was certainly fun swimming downtown and flying down the Rieperbahn. But I think the hassles of a huge event in a big city outweighed the possible advantages.
It started really, really early. So there wasn’t much of a spectator atmosphere. And most volunteers had no link to the sport. So were kinda uninvested in the whole day.
I’d still recommend it. And go back if I had a reason to be up there. But your basic German events, still put on by clubs, towns or smaller professional promoters, are much better.
IMO.
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The biggest triathlon in the world, too, in terms of participation. Noosa is bigger if you include the side events.
Apparently. And there was nothing particularly bad about my experience. Only that for the price, it doesn’t really stand out from local races.
I totally undertand why athletes might want to do branded races. Qualify for something. Big event feel. Social kudos. But in terms of slick organsiation. At least in France and Germany. The smaller races certainly compete. And are, of course, much cheaper to enter.
Also. That Hamburg race had a very poor field at the front. The best amateur short-course athletes just won’t do it. They’re more focused on local stuff or the various levels of Bundesliga.
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I’m not sure I can follow. World Triathlon Hamburg is part of the WTCS. In 2023, the usual sprint-distance race was replaced by the Super Sprint World Championships, which were won by Hayden Wilde and Cassandre Beaugrand respectively. How was that ‘a very poor field’?
The amateur race. On Sunday morning. 12,000 people. I won my AG in 2023. 50+. In fact, I win it most weeks. But Hamburg was my worst gun to tape performance of the year. So my AG field in Hamburg was definitely weaker than it is locally.
The best non-elite short distance athletes would be more focused on Bundesliga. A multi-level, multi-division national club competition. Probably 90% of clubs would field a team. 4-6 rounds per season. Entry fees paid by club.
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It’s nevertheless impressive. Congratulations.
Isn’t the Bundesliga exclusively elite (and U23), though? I thought the Masters category only exists from Regionalliga downwards.
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Thanks!
Yes. Correct. Bundesliga 1 is national. Bundesliga 2 is north and south. These are populated mostly by very fast young people, hoping eventually to make national teams.
Under this you have Regionalliga followed by Landesliga. Any age can do these if you’re fast enough. In my area (Bavaria) lots of over 40s race these divisions because we don’t have a Masters Liga yet. And most clubs are not big enough to fill their teams exclusively with young athletes. As you can imagine, the best kids eventually leave the smaller clubs to move up the divisions.
Guessing in Bundeslande with a Masters Liga, the over-40s do that instead. I know that Nord-Rhein Westphalen and Baden-Wurtenburg both have Masters Liga. Here in Bavaria, not enough clubs were interested in raising Masters teams to form another Liga.
Anyway. Like the London Triathlon, the mass-particpation race in Hamburg seems to be a great place for beginners to start. But not really part of the true German triathlon scene for faster or more experienced athletes.
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Remember a few years back they sent out those $75 off coupons, we didn’t realize how good we had it
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I don’t see much of a problem. Anyone seen the price of concerts lately! For something that gives me a whole day of entertainment and, a whole year of something to strive towards and a lifetime of bragging rights it’s cheap…
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It’s a dangerous game to play. This is somewhat what is happening in Vegas. They would rather make 20k on one person than 1k from 20 people. That’s dangerous because all it takes is a small decline in participation for the whole house of cards to come crashing down. I see lots of my older tri friends moving more towards gravel, ultra, aquabike, etc… If these trends tick upward, Ironman could be looking at their races with tiny numbers. Tastes and interests can change and if those tides swing, Ironman will have made their own bed.
Another great example is World of Warcraft. I don’t play, but I knew several friends who were heavily invested in it. In 2010 they had 12 million players, today it’s roughly 2 million. The irony being I can recall a blizzard convention where a developer said something along the lines of, “We don’t foresee the game ever declining in popularity.”
Everything looks great, until it doesn’t.
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Even the local race prices have gotten bad.
I had a similar experience at 5150 here in Italy in 2024. Most entrants were travel mates of folks doing the 70.3, so a relatively weak field. But the race started like 1 hour later than the 70.3, therefore, being close to the lead, I was cheered at like never before, though actually not deserving it that much 
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I train with the local running and cycling clubs. Every one of them I speak to is always absolutely blown away by the cost to enter an Ironman. To them, £100 events seem expensive; £500+ is crazy. Most would not consider paying that much ever. A few might do one as a bucket list challange, but then go back to single sports.
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I don’t have that much of a gripe about pricing - its an expensive sport and all signs point to things getting more expensive for RDs.
Where I do have an issue is that they’re now charging for IronKids. Really? I get that there’s a medal and such, but I always viewed it as a goodwill thing that builds family support and such.
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