I have been doing more runs inside at the moment due to weather and actually find that I enjoy certain types on run, especially Tempo runs.
In my experience, for a given pace, my HR/RPE is lower when using a treadmill, even with a slight incline. So, I was wondering which aspect of the run is the most important. I can either keep the pace as is and have a good, fast cadence with (what I believe is) good form, with a lower heart rate (could be anything up to 15 bpm lower). Alternatively, I can up the pace so that my HR goes up, but then the pace is pretty close to, if not over, what my current all-out 5k would be. However, the latter option does take it out of me a little more, although does not affect my training too much.
While on the treadmill I would use a combination of both RPE/HR as well as the treadmill pace.
I would also check the treadmill pace, if it’s right on I’d stay with your RPE/HR as long as you can complete your planned workouts week in and week out.
While on the treadmill I would use a combination of both RPE/HR as well as the treadmill pace.
I would also check the treadmill pace, if it’s right on I’d stay with your RPE/HR as long as you can complete your planned workouts week in and week out.
jaretj
I use a footpod on the treadmill and although there is a little drift after about 30 minutes (the treadmill that is), it’s pretty close.
I find my HR is lower when I run on the treadmill. I’ve always assumed is because my treadmill speed is out of calibration. For this reason I use HR as my guide.
My footpod speed is pretty close to the treadmill too.
Personally I just use Daniels paces while running on it. My HR varies with my weekly workload so I don’t depend on it for a single session. Others have much better success with HR than I have.
Some days the treadmill feels hard some days not as hard.
I go by HR, at least to ‘calibrate’ the TM against my outdoor paces. If a 7min/mile outdoors = 143 HR for me, I adjust the TM incline and speed for something comparable so I can do shorter intervals without waiting for HR to catch up, but ultimately, it’s all about HR.
Harder is fine for tempo runs - they’re short enough they shouldn’t blow up your training week load, so I err on the slightly harder side for tempo runs.
My footpod speed is pretty close to the treadmill too.
Personally I just use Daniels paces while running on it. My HR varies with my weekly workload so I don’t depend on it for a single session. Others have much better success with HR than I have.
Some days the treadmill feels hard some days not as hard.
jaretj
I am using the McMillan values for mine and that is where the problem lies.
My current, albeit done last year, (outside) 5k time is 22:15. That puts me at 7:35/mile for threshold. At that pace, the effort is more like low endurance. Yesterday I did 5 miles @ 7:10/mile and my HR never got above 155bpm (my max is 175bpm). Perhaps I should use an ‘indoor’ time to calculate my paces for treadmill runs. I recently did a 5k @ 20:04 on the treadmill, which would put my threshold at about 6:50/mile, which might well be about right on the RPE/HR level.
I used to find a difference between treadmill speed and speed as given by footpod, but they almost completely synced up by setting the gradient to 1%. This could very likely solve the HR-vs-speed issue too.
It sounds to me like you are a better runner now and should set your training paces accordingly.
Yes, this is an option, although when I try to run at 22:04 pace outside, I blow up. Trying to find a happy medium
That implies the treadmill is showing a faster than actual pace or else you have it set at too little gradient to compensate for the lack of wind drag and other factors that make running on a tread mill a bit easier. I use ~ 1 1/2 percent grade to account for these. A zero percent grade is definitely easier than running outdoors.
It sounds to me like you are a better runner now and should set your training paces accordingly.
Yes, this is an option, although when I try to run at 22:04 pace outside, I blow up. Trying to find a happy medium
That implies the treadmill is showing a faster than actual pace or else you have it set at too little gradient to compensate for the lack of wind drag and other factors that make running on a tread mill a bit easier. I use ~ 1 1/2 percent grade to account for these. A zero percent grade is definitely easier than running outdoors.
Hugh
Agreed that it is easier. However, the 20:04 was on a 1% incline and the pace was from the footpod, rather than the treadmill. In all honesty, I only tried that pace outside once, and on a Monday after a weekend that included running a half marathon in training for the first time and the normal swim/bike activities. I guess rested I should be in a little better shape
It sounds to me like you are a better runner now and should set your training paces accordingly.
Yes, this is an option, although when I try to run at 22:04 pace outside, I blow up. Trying to find a happy medium
That implies the treadmill is showing a faster than actual pace or else you have it set at too little gradient to compensate for the lack of wind drag and other factors that make running on a tread mill a bit easier. I use ~ 1 1/2 percent grade to account for these. A zero percent grade is definitely easier than running outdoors.
Hugh
Agreed that it is easier. However, the 20:04 was on a 1% incline and the pace was from the footpod, rather than the treadmill. In all honesty, I only tried that pace outside once, and on a Monday after a weekend that included running a half marathon in training for the first time and the normal swim/bike activities. I guess rested I should be in a little better shape
Chris,
It sounds as of you’re putting a lot of faith in the foot pods accuracy and perhaps that’s a bit misplaced. What sort of pace is the treadmill showing that you’re running? As others have said, in this case training by heart rate probably makes more sense.
It sounds to me like you are a better runner now and should set your training paces accordingly.
Yes, this is an option, although when I try to run at 22:04 pace outside, I blow up. Trying to find a happy medium
That implies the treadmill is showing a faster than actual pace or else you have it set at too little gradient to compensate for the lack of wind drag and other factors that make running on a tread mill a bit easier. I use ~ 1 1/2 percent grade to account for these. A zero percent grade is definitely easier than running outdoors.
Hugh
Agreed that it is easier. However, the 20:04 was on a 1% incline and the pace was from the footpod, rather than the treadmill. In all honesty, I only tried that pace outside once, and on a Monday after a weekend that included running a half marathon in training for the first time and the normal swim/bike activities. I guess rested I should be in a little better shape
Chris,
It sounds as of you’re putting a lot of faith in the foot pods accuracy and perhaps that’s a bit misplaced. What sort of pace is the treadmill showing that you’re running? As others have said, in this case training by heart rate probably makes more sense.
Hugh
They actually line up very well for about 30 minutes, then there is a little drift where the treadmill seems to slow down (5-10sec/mile). Agreed, I think I should look more at the HR in this case.
I have been doing more runs inside at the moment due to weather and actually find that I enjoy certain types on run, especially Tempo runs.
In my experience, for a given pace, my HR/RPE is lower when using a treadmill, even with a slight incline. So, I was wondering which aspect of the run is the most important. I can either keep the pace as is and have a good, fast cadence with (what I believe is) good form, with a lower heart rate (could be anything up to 15 bpm lower). Alternatively, I can up the pace so that my HR goes up, but then the pace is pretty close to, if not over, what my current all-out 5k would be. However, the latter option does take it out of me a little more, although does not affect my training too much.
Curious, what do you think?
Thanks
First of all: what is your definition of Tempo run?
I have been doing more runs inside at the moment due to weather and actually find that I enjoy certain types on run, especially Tempo runs.
In my experience, for a given pace, my HR/RPE is lower when using a treadmill, even with a slight incline. So, I was wondering which aspect of the run is the most important. I can either keep the pace as is and have a good, fast cadence with (what I believe is) good form, with a lower heart rate (could be anything up to 15 bpm lower). Alternatively, I can up the pace so that my HR goes up, but then the pace is pretty close to, if not over, what my current all-out 5k would be. However, the latter option does take it out of me a little more, although does not affect my training too much.
Curious, what do you think?
Thanks
First of all: what is your definition of Tempo run?
A combination of a pace defined by what I have done a previous 5k in, with a HR of around 165bpm (my max is about 175bpm) and an RPE that is hard, but sustainable for about 40 minutes without leaving too much residual fatigue that stops me from doing my other training
I have been doing more runs inside at the moment due to weather and actually find that I enjoy certain types on run, especially Tempo runs.
In my experience, for a given pace, my HR/RPE is lower when using a treadmill, even with a slight incline. So, I was wondering which aspect of the run is the most important. I can either keep the pace as is and have a good, fast cadence with (what I believe is) good form, with a lower heart rate (could be anything up to 15 bpm lower). Alternatively, I can up the pace so that my HR goes up, but then the pace is pretty close to, if not over, what my current all-out 5k would be. However, the latter option does take it out of me a little more, although does not affect my training too much.
Curious, what do you think?
Thanks
First of all: what is your definition of Tempo run?
A combination of a pace defined by what I have done a previous 5k in, with a HR of around 165bpm (my max is about 175bpm) and an RPE that is hard, but sustainable for about 40 minutes without leaving too much residual fatigue that stops me from doing my other training
still quite aleatory from your description
I go always by pace, referred in % of my 10k race speed (very recent or a good estimation if not available)
Tempo run=87% (I run the full marathon at this pace or, in training, I run max 100’)
Lactate threshold=90% (I do max 60’ training steady session, quite painful but very rewarding)
It is a matter of 3% as you can see and there is a HUGE difference in RPE between the 2. 60’ max vs. 100’
