…than the organizer should not put a race 6 days after the ironman world champs or put it in the contract if you do nice you cant do ibiza…
they cant be so naive so i guess they dont mind it.//
I dont think it is naive at all, it is a battle for the pros going on here, pretty obvious, no? And I give the win to PTO in this instance, I’m much more interested in watching their race over Nice, may not even watch Nice except for a replay with a ton of fast forward. For various reasons I suppose, but the Knibb factor is a big one, along with some anticipated wild cards and new starts for this race…
…than the organizer should not put a race 6 days after the ironman world champs or put it in the contract if you do nice you cant do ibiza…
they cant be so naive so i guess they dont mind it.//
I dont think it is naive at all, it is a battle for the pros going on here, pretty obvious, no? And I give the win to PTO in this instance, I’m much more interested in watching their race over Nice, may not even watch Nice except for a replay with a ton of fast forward. For various reasons I suppose, but the Knibb factor is a big one, along with some anticipated wild cards and new starts for this race…
well as you have noted the top stars including knibb favored nice… the athletes voted with their feet .
and sponsirship bonuses is the very clear answer to it.
**well as you have noted the top stars including knibb favored nice… the athletes voted with their feet . **
Yes they did, however as it turns out, some low level(maybe the lowest on the T100 circuit)is going to be more exciting than the World Championship for Ironman. This was a huge win for PTO, and a cluster of major proportions for Ironman. It was within their grasp, but as is usual they found a way to screw it up. We shouldn’t even be talking much about the T100 this weekend, and yet it is what I’m most looking forward to watching.
You could say that on this weekend of races, David slayed Goliath for most interesting match ups…The most interesting for me with WTC here is the series match ups and how they will play out going forward.
Ajax_Bay: LCB, Sodaro, Haug, Philipp, Matthews and Lee are racing IMWC Nice 6 days before. //
@monty : It really is kind of a joke to think anyone who drills the ironman will be even remotely competitive 6 days later. I get why all the ladies are still on the list, just in case they pull the plug on the race. And secondly they do get to fulfill an obligation to start in the series, so there is that, **but certainly not what the ****organizers would have hoped for and paid up front to insure **…than the organizer should not put a race 6 days after the ironman world champs or put it in the contract if you do nice you cant do ibiza… [/quote] @pk : they cant be so naive so i guess they don’t mind it.[/quote]
Monty I doubt any of the athletes named think they will be competitive at Ibiza: as soon as the T100 schedule was shared as part of the contract ‘offer’ it was clear that Ibiza and Nice would ‘clash’ as will Las Vegas clash with Kona (for the men). Every athlete signed on that basis, judging that either Ibiza would be one they missed (contract requires 5 of 7 in regular season) or that it would be a (NB proximate) ‘attend’. It’s attractive to PTO to have the IM ‘World Champion’ at a T100 immediately after: all part of the ‘story’. And while one or two women may drop out on 23 September I expect most will participate.
Those who’ve already missed two races are contractually required to race (applies to Sodaro (2), Philipp (2) and Haug (3)).
As @pk implies, neither the PTO nor the athletes are “naive”: there needed to be T100s in September and October and these were bound to clash with the already announced split IMWC dates. That’s an element of the reason for making it 5 of 7: if the PTO hadn’t designed that in, a number of the full distance athletes would not have signed (imho).
I note that both races are on 28 September (was advertised as 28/29th and still is) with starts at 0800 (men) and 1030 (women). The men’s field will all be on the run before the women beach start and the women will all be through T1 and away on the first vuelta of the bike before the men get to their last few miles.
0800-0812-0825 Men’s swim
0827-1027 Men’s bike
1030-1013-1059 Women swim
1028-1140 Men’s run
1100- Women riding . . .
@Monty I doubt any of the athletes named think they will be competitive at Ibiza://
I believe that is pretty much what I said, unless of course something happens, and and they dont either start, or have to pull the plug without much running for some reason. Of the group I would pick Kat to be able to double best of the rest, she seems to have the best recovery powers of the lot…
Poor Monty. I guess sometimes you can’t give the middle finger to a company and expect them to bend over backwards to help you out after? Maybe this will change some of her choices in the future? At least this gives her another week to get back into shape.
Btw, Ibiza wait list with Derron on it (scroll down): https://www.triathlon.org/...cs/Waiting_lists.pdfDrat, it’s a “404” now. Did you by chance copy the wait list before they took the page down?I’ll start by saying that in practice, the waiting list is never used, or at least only maybe the last week when there are late withdrawals.
The start list is filled by (1) Contracted athletes; (2) PTO/WorldTri ‘panel’ picks (I expect they’ll include Derron); and only then (3) Waiting list, in order. https://www.triathlon.org/...ia_2024_20240219.pdf
3.10. Saturday after creation of the start lists, invitations (Wildcards) are awarded by a panel composed by PTO and World Triathlon.
3.11. The start positions not filled by the invitation panel are filled by the next eligible athlete on the sorted Waiting List.
Having said that (with the texts) the PTO presumably want to keep WorldTri ‘content’ so they play the game and Tuesday >30 days out (after early teething problems for Miami/Singapore) produce a start list and populate the waiting list.
The waiting list is ordered by PTO Ranking position (Derron is 81.06 in PTO #36). Derron was only added by SuisseTri on 28 August (late) and is/was the last name.
Commentary:
I note that Pohle jumped to PTO #16 after her amazing run at Tallinn on Sunday: certain to get a wild card.
Visser is racing Nice: I can’t see her racing Ibiza (given she’s not contracted/‘forced’ although maybe Roth > 7 days > Vitoria was a practice!!)
Same for Norden: on IMWC Nice start list.
Madsen’s T100 performances have been underwhelming.
Salthouse rejected a start at San Francisco to race 70.3 Boulder instead (her win paid more).
Chura is #10 in the T100 Standings: I’d be surprised if the PTO don’t give her a wildcard (NB T100 London result hampered by puncture).
Name Country Ranking pts Waitlist Pos’n
Els Visser NED 89,00 Wait 001
Caroline Pohle GER 87,83 Wait 002
Laura Madsen DEN 87,62 Wait 003
Ellie Salthouse AUS 87,23 Wait 004
Haley Chura USA 84,98 Wait 005
Kaidi Kivioja EST 83,54 Wait 006
Grace Thek AUS 83,21 Wait 007
Lisa Norden SWE 82,14 Wait 008
Kate Curran GBR 81,98 Wait 009
Julie Derron SUI Late 28/8 Wait Last
Thanks for the excellent, as always, data and analysis. Friday midday (UK): Waiting list back up: https://www.triathlon.org/...cs/Waiting_lists.pdf
Visser no longer there (as I suggested ^ ^)
As an aside I see that Findlay (CAN) is racing the UCI Worlds ITT the weekend before:
ITT on 22 September: Gossau to Zurich: 30km with 327m climb.
For the men, I note the following (way down) on the Waiting List (which is ordered by PTO Ranking points):
Jelle Geens, Casper Stornes, Hayden Wilde, Jonas Schomburg, Birtwhistle, Hellwig, Riddle
One might assume that if Wilde wants a start he’ll get a wild card (and not be ‘waiting’). Though Wilde and Schomburg are on the WTCS Weihai (same w/e) start list, but Geens and Stornes aren’t.
I’m more interested in the factors to be taken into account if you’re a pessimistic pro and reckon the Grand Final will end up being cancelled (rather than resited from its intended venue). Does that affect whether you miss Ibiza (W) or Las Vegas (M) (if you still have one you can ‘pass’ within contract)? The Tour will be decided on an athlete’s 4 best scores (and one of those is likely to be the GF, until it isn’t). The Olympians (well Duffy and Spivey) are relying on Ibiza, Las Vegas and Dubai for their three (Knibb and Van Riel have one (win) in the bag.
70.3 Bahrain is the same w/e as the scheduled GF. [pink]Just all enter that and use it as a GF.[/pink]
Certainly 4 weeks from Dubai to Taupo would be a deal more civilised.
If the series is coming to an end the athletes can only blame themselves.
Guys and gals pulling out at short notice (often after doing PTO media to hype a race), claiming to be sick or injured and then showing up to some Ironman race a week later, or turning up to T100 races and just jogging it in.
They had a golden opportunity to make triathlon into a proper pro career opportunity, and they should have all bent over backwards to promote and prioritise the T100. Now theyve killed it, and they’ll be back earning a few hundred dollars at Ironman events with no tv coverage. Good job guys.
I agree the athletes ought to be rising to the occasion and putting their best foot forward. They have themselves to blame, as far as it comes to athletes talking about how valuable they are – surely most of them haven’t proven they are worth much at all, assuming the PTO funding dries up with no sustainable business model.
But the fault of management does still have to sit at the feet of the PTO crew. Are they tasked with turning this product into something marketable or is it just to put on some kind of spectacle while they hope a marketable product evolves?
Listening to the interview with Sam, I get vibes of a guy who just talks and tries to be the direct, but agreeable leader who “tells it like it is”. But it feels like listening to a politician to says a lot and leaves you without much action.
Still listening to the interview, so maybe I’ll change my mind by the end, but so far it’s almost like I’m listening to any educated, but random podcaster talking about the PTO rather than the CEO.
Just listened to the episode. I liked that Jack Kelly pushed a bit on why the PTO tied itself to the 100 km distance when a variety of distances would make for better racing and a more well-rounded series overall. I agree with Kelly that the course matters more than the distance.
Renouf fumbled on this question in my opinion. He mentioned something age groupers wanting consistency and a standardized distanced which has made the 70.3 and 140.6 distances recognizable for the IM brand. But this just shows how the PTO has completely turned itself around from being a pro athlete’s organization to a mass participation event organizer. They’re no different from IM or Challenge just with better socials and broadcast. It seems that the sustainability of their business model now hinges on age groupers and not selling a broadcast product.