Curious if anyone has info or insight on what the sugar intake for am endurance athlete in training should be.
As most probably know, sugar, especially extra sugar causes insulin allies and creation of excess fat. Cutting out unneccesary sugars will help in the fat burning process and the leaving out of am endurance athlete. The W.H.O. suggests for a female and male the Mac sugar intake should be 6 teaspoons (25g) and 9 teaspoons (37.5g) respectively. I’m assuming they sty these under the assumption of a sedentary lifestyle.
I’m curious if there are any facts out there showing what an athlete’s intake should be, considering the needs during endurance work. A pack of ShotBlocks for example has 24g of added sugar. A singer waffle carries 18g. Gatorade and other sports drinks, substantially more. So what should we really be taking in to maximize performance AND body composition???
Well, for one thing, success at endurance racing and weight loss tend to be mutually exclusive despite the fact that you can use one to cause the other. Performance is a funny thing and if you try to perform well on a depleted body you will not do as well as you could if you were properly fueled. Those guidelines you mention are written for the generic mostly sedentary person who has no use for “extra fuel”, or more than likely already has “extra fuel” hanging around their bellies. Endurance athletes are not the target for those guidelines.
Don’t trust my ancedote, but I met a really fit looking guy once who was eating this massive ice cream cone. We were talking about nutrition and he said that he was a personal trainer and had just finished working out, then told me you can eat whatever you want in the 30 min or so after a workout. I don’t know how much I trust this advice but if it was a worthwhile workout, short of eating crisco out of the can I doubt you could do too much harm. Obviously there are going to be better/worse things to eat, but it probably makes much more difference right before you lay down to bed or on your rest day.
The point of my question is that larger athletes like myself stand to make major gains through weight loss. While it is not the point exclusively, an improvement in body mass is low hanging fruit and the reality is that when training 12-15 hours/wk, the only way not to lose weight is by sabotaging your diet.
One of the biggest sabotages is consumption of added sugar. Excess sugar is stored as fat, even when operating at q calorie deficit. That is fact. So the concern is that in the majority of our race/training nutrition there is a ton of added sugar. So how do you determine how much is too much? Even in workout, I’d have to imagine that while your body is utilizing those sugars as fuels, there is such a thing as over consumption and as such, excess fat.
While this may not be q problem for most of you, for those of us larger athletes who do want to see an improvement in body composition it is a valid concern, so I’m trying to get some solid info on the subject!
I had a well-respected nutritionist put a plan together for me last year. My key takeaways are as follows:
Following workout, immediately take a 4:1 Carb/Protein (such as endurox) recovery drink, within 30 min of workout to replace glycogen(?) and protein to jump-start recovery. Low fat chocolate milk is an inexpensive alternative.
In a “post-workout window”, which is equal to your workout length, (i.e. 1 hour workout = 1 hour post workout window) eat a balanced meal with carbs/protein/vegetables etc. If you want to lose weight, cut out the carbs. This should be complex carbs (whole grains, etc.) not sugar
Don’t eat refined carbs in a non-workout window, including sugar. Will lead to a spike in blood sugar and lead to weight gain. This means eat LOW GLYCEMIC foods - google this and you will find a wealth of resources. Shortcut is to add protein+fat grams on nutrition label - they should total higher than carb grams.
Eat a lot of colorful vegetables. Snack on tree nuts and good fats.
sugar is fine during workouts as fuel (gatorade, whatever). Pre-workout, light carbs (such as banana, nature valley bar, etc) are ideal if you eat anything (avoid excess protein+fat). Search around here for approximate levels of fueling during exercise.
It really is a simple equation and yes I’m a bigger athlete that was once a very lean 220+ bodybuilder and power lifter. But age tends to slow the metabolism. For me I see a bump in that lost metabolism every five years. All this stuff about certain sugars causing weight gain more than other carbohydrates is bs and sounds more like wishful thinking. What I can tell you is that simpler sugars and good that contain them tend to leave you less satiated and insulin spikes can drive you to eat more on the let down. Protein on the other hand leaves you very satiated but not the easiest calories to assimilate. But at the end of the day calories are calories. If you are having trouble keeping weight down or losing it keep a good log. In the beginning you might be surprised how many calories you are actually consuming I was.
There is no point in not consuming sugar. It does not cause insulin spikes, starches are just as glycemic as sugar, you’re better off watching your saturated fats as those cause insulin resistance while you should actually google high carb diet and insulin resistance on ncbi then google myristic acid, palamitric acid, or any other long chain saturated fatty acid and insulin resistance on ncbi. You’re not going to have success as a triathlete on low carb diet will not gain watts/kg if you lose weight that way. You will improve heart health by removing saturated and trans fats and replacing them with unsaturated… ala and linoleic acid are essential fats you should get those… There is no difference between a starch and a sugar, sugar does not mean it will become blood glucose faster unless you are consuming it in the form of glucose, most sugars present in natural foods are not glucose already. Bread will not be in your blood slower than an apple, a starch will typically enter your blood faster due to less water for right osmolarity. There is no logical reason to remove sugar or carbs from your diet. I would get carbs from natural sources
Excess sugar is stored as fat, even when operating at q calorie deficit. That is fact.
Really?
Yes. Calories in vs Calories out has been proven time and again as a myth. The quality of the calories and how your body can handle them is equally as important. The body does not deal as well with added sugar as it does natural protein. The process for digestion and usage within the body varies based on the chemical makeup. Sugar causes an insulin spike and results in excess being stored as fat cells.
It really is a simple equation and yes I’m a bigger athlete that was once a very lean 220+ bodybuilder and power lifter. But age tends to slow the metabolism. For me I see a bump in that lost metabolism every five years. All this stuff about certain sugars causing weight gain more than other carbohydrates is bs and sounds more like wishful thinking. What I can tell you is that simpler sugars and good that contain them tend to leave you less satiated and insulin spikes can drive you to eat more on the let down. Protein on the other hand leaves you very satiated but not the easiest calories to assimilate. But at the end of the day calories are calories. If you are having trouble keeping weight down or losing it keep a good log. In the beginning you might be surprised how many calories you are actually consuming I was.
I’ve kept a detailed, measured, per calorie log every single day for the last 5 months. I took my time and laid down checks and balances before asking this question. Not in anticipation of asking the question, but I have the personal data, combined with the research, to formulate an opinion. Calories are not all equal. 3000 calories of lean protein, whole grains and veg is not the same as 3000 calories of cake. I’ve experienced weight loss, about a pound a week, but pick up some food packaging and look at how much sugar you consume when you’re eating anything from a box in a grocery store. It’s pretty insane…
There is no point in not consuming sugar. It does not cause insulin spikes, starches are just as glycemic as sugar, you’re better off watching your saturated fats as those cause insulin resistance while you should actually google high carb diet and insulin resistance on ncbi then google myristic acid, palamitric acid, or any other long chain saturated fatty acid and insulin resistance on ncbi. You’re not going to have success as a triathlete on low carb diet will not gain watts/kg if you lose weight that way. You will improve heart health by removing saturated and trans fats and replacing them with unsaturated… ala and linoleic acid are essential fats you should get those… There is no difference between a starch and a sugar, sugar does not mean it will become blood glucose faster unless you are consuming it in the form of glucose, most sugars present in natural foods are not glucose already. Bread will not be in your blood slower than an apple, a starch will typically enter your blood faster due to less water for right osmolarity. There is no logical reason to remove sugar or carbs from your diet. I would get carbs from natural sources
Consuming carbohydrates increases your glycogen recovery rate and your recovery rate is significantly elevated in the four hours post-exercise. It’s also important to note that intramuscular fat is a very significant source of energy in endurance exercise, especially in advanced athletes. I’m not sure if the studies advocating the 4:1 ratio post-workout also looked at the effects on intramuscular fat recovery. I think there’s also some research on how exercising on an “empty stomach” accelerates that adaptation.
Either way, if you need to cut weight while still training, I would pig out post-workout and maintain the caloric deficit at night. Or do what weightlifters do and just pick different times to focus on either.
Excess sugar is stored as fat, even when operating at q calorie deficit. That is fact.
Really?
Yes. Calories in vs Calories out has been proven time and again as a myth. The quality of the calories and how your body can handle them is equally as important. The body does not deal as well with added sugar as it does natural protein. The process for digestion and usage within the body varies based on the chemical makeup. Sugar causes an insulin spike and results in excess being stored as fat cells.
No. “Natural” glucose is the same thing as “artificial” glucose.
Carbs, fats, and proteins have different metabolic costs (i.e., thermic effect of food) to get to the energy in the first place. Ballpark, metabolizing protein consumes ~30% of the energy consumed in the first place. Carbs are ~10%, and fats are <10%.
Exactly the point. I’m not debating sugars vs starches. I’m not debating anything frankly. I posed a question relating to consumption of added sugar. We’re not talking carbs/sugars from an apple, which have find that assists in the breakdown of those sugars. Not talking about natural sugars. We’re talking about a nature valley granola bar that has 18g of added sugar. How much is too much? Because there is such a thing. I agree that consumption of certain fats is certainly impactful as well, but again not the point I’m looking to address. I appreciate the comments, honestly I do, but I asked a straight forward question that I’d like to work towards answering.
It really is a simple equation and yes I’m a bigger athlete that was once a very lean 220+ bodybuilder and power lifter. But age tends to slow the metabolism. For me I see a bump in that lost metabolism every five years. All this stuff about certain sugars causing weight gain more than other carbohydrates is bs and sounds more like wishful thinking. What I can tell you is that simpler sugars and good that contain them tend to leave you less satiated and insulin spikes can drive you to eat more on the let down. Protein on the other hand leaves you very satiated but not the easiest calories to assimilate. But at the end of the day calories are calories. If you are having trouble keeping weight down or losing it keep a good log. In the beginning you might be surprised how many calories you are actually consuming I was.
I’ve kept a detailed, measured, per calorie log every single day for the last 5 months. I took my time and laid down checks and balances before asking this question. Not in anticipation of asking the question, but I have the personal data, combined with the research, to formulate an opinion. Calories are not all equal. 3000 calories of lean protein, whole grains and veg is not the same as 3000 calories of cake. I’ve experienced weight loss, about a pound a week, but pick up some food packaging and look at how much sugar you consume when you’re eating anything from a box in a grocery store. It’s pretty insane…
You had a fine-tuned model for figuring out how much energy you were consuming? The fact that you’re claiming that is indicative of your level of knowledge. Assuming you used one of the BMR regression equations to estimate your base burn (you did, right?), there’s substantial variation in individuals between actual and predicted (since it is a regression) and unless you had real metabolic testing done, there’s already substantial potential variance there.
Assuming you even have a power meter, conversion from work done (kJ) to actual calories burned is also based on an assumption, which varies substantially between who’s calculating (i.e., Garmin units and Strava will have wildly different estimates). If you’re a runner, most of the calories burned data is based on statistical regression of test subjects (the whole METs system) and will vary for individuals. Did you do all your running connected to a mask that measured your oxygen intake?
Add in the fact that your intake calculations are most likely off, and making the claim you can reach any conclusion from your log is simply ridiculous.
**Curious if anyone has info or insight on what the sugar intake for am endurance athlete in training should be. **
Sugar intake should be the same for endurance athletes as it is for everyone else. If you eat well with lots of fruits and vegetables, there is no need to add sugar.
Add in the fact that your intake calculations are most likely off, and making the claim you can reach any conclusion from your log is simply ridiculous.
Why is it that people on this forum love to attack a poster? I asked for help with a specific question. Not a bunch of people telling me I’m an idiot for asking the question. My point was that I’ve tracked my calories and the calorie in/calorie out equation hasn’t been as accurate as it should be. I track everything I consume and generally under estimate my caloric burn to compensate for the fact that I in fact do not have access to such accurate testing measures on a daily basis. I would love two test subjects to eat the same calories for a month, one primarily made up of sugars, the other primarily lean proteins and veg. You’re telling me that all other variables equal, they will have the same body composition at the end of it? I just don’t buy it. Not bc I’m an arrogant asshole, but bc there is just too much research that shows the impacts of sugar consumption at an egregious level.
Lmao nobody is fighting. … I’m stating that the question is redundant. It doesn’t matter how much sugar you’re getting in the bar cause the starch is causing a greater insulin spike most likely. Not that it matters that much anyways cause the extent depends on your fatty acids, water, fiber, and protein mostly not the length of carb chain. You could hypothetically get all refined sugars, a huge portion of your calories from sugar and be very healthy depending on your diet as a whole. I should’ve just left the natural sources thing out, they are better, but it doesn’t matter that much. If you really want me to answer your question of how many carbs do I get in a day, it’s a shit ton lmao like 70-80% of 3-5000cal a huge amount sugar I weigh 140lbs male
Add in the fact that your intake calculations are most likely off, and making the claim you can reach any conclusion from your log is simply ridiculous.
Why is it that people on this forum love to attack a poster? I asked for help with a specific question. Not a bunch of people telling me I’m an idiot for asking the question. My point was that I’ve tracked my calories and the calorie in/calorie out equation hasn’t been as accurate as it should be. I track everything I consume and generally under estimate my caloric burn to compensate for the fact that I in fact do not have access to such accurate testing measures on a daily basis. I would love two test subjects to eat the same calories for a month, one primarily made up of sugars, the other primarily lean proteins and veg. You’re telling me that all other variables equal, they will have the same body composition at the end of it? I just don’t buy it. Not bc I’m an arrogant asshole, but bc there is just too much research that shows the impacts of sugar consumption at an egregious level.
All the evidence you offer is from personal experience. I’m simply demonstrating how your personal experience is most likely inaccurate and, that if you hadn’t considered what I talked about, you probably haven’t really done the research either.
People are thinking you’re an idiot because you made the claim that carbs calories somehow magically make you fat. They don’t. There ARE differences in how many “net calories” that different compounds give you but it has nothing to do with that you’re talking about. I’m explaining to you why a calorie log of how much you eat and burn simply isn’t accurate. Conclusions reached from such a limited size and methodology prone to error aren’t credible.