Does anyone know how the cycling world calculate how stiff a bike is? Just wondering if there is a ranking out there of Stiff yet light triathlon bikes in the market currently…Which Are the top Stiff/Responsive triathlon bikes out there?
It just seems that every review for carbon triathlon bikes says that their bike is stiff and responsive which is probably not true.
I pretty aware that Cervelo P3’s and P4’s are probably on top among stiff bikes. ( I own an 2009 R3)
But how about the Ridley Dean ridden by Robbie McEwen? Felt DA ridden by David Zabrisky? How about the Giant ridden in the Giro d’italia Time Trial on the last day by Menchov (don’t know the name of the bike).
It does not matter. Back when this whole “stiff” thing started in the days of EL-OS, SLX, 70xx/60xx Alu (Klein and Cannonfail)…folks wanted stiff stiff stiff…all while Sean Kelley was winning every sprint on a Vitus 979 (noodle edition). You have an option - stiff or comfortable…for 112mi I pick comfy.
Im looking for a bike that can take the pounding, specially during climbs when I crank out the big gears…
I had a quintana roo lucero 2008, and when I moved to LA I went climbing with it, I felt that thing flex so much. Then I sold it, and now ride a stiff bike (road) and I love how the frame doesn’t bend when Im cranking hard.
So what Tri bike, would give me the same feel and be able to take the pounding?
there are tons of Aero chats out there…just wondering if there are stiffness charts…
look for tri bikes with the bayonet-type fork systems, i.e. Argon E-114, Felt DA, Look 596.
The Kuota Kueen K is also known for BB and HT stiffness, partly because of the asymmetrical headtube design.
if you are close to fitting on a size smaller, do that. i recall some stifness measurements comparing frame sizes of the same bike. going smaller made for huge differences.
Im looking for a bike that can take the pounding, specially during climbs when I crank out the big gears…
I had a quintana roo lucero 2008, and when I moved to LA I went climbing with it, I felt that thing flex so much. Then I sold it, and now ride a stiff bike (road) and I love how the frame doesn’t bend when Im cranking hard.
So what Tri bike, would give me the same feel and be able to take the pounding?
there are tons of Aero chats out there…just wondering if there are stiffness charts…
hope it made a bit clear
I have a 2lb hardtail mtn frame that I can see flex like a noodle when I just stand there and put some weight on one pedal. But the thing climbs like a goat and I’ve won races on it.
I don’t think your stiff frame is faster. I’ll grant you that it feels better and you’re entitled to like that feel and pay for it. I just wanted to voice my opinion that it’s probably not faster - just in case you were under that impression.
Now as to your actual question…I can’t say since I don’t test ride a lot of different bikes. I’m also not aware of any industry standard method for measuring a frame’s stiffness.
Hey man, he knows what he wants and that is to be stiffer. Who cares if there is no gain what so ever with a stiffer frame. At the end of the day folks can ride their super stiff frames - then bitch their backs hurt while they walk thr run course rubbing their spine.
By the sounds of it the OP climbs in his 56x11 standing at a cadence of around 3
Some tests have been done on bottom bracket deflection to measure stiffness. Typically (though there are lots of testing protocols) this is done by clamping the dropouts into a fixture, and applying a static load to one pedal (cranks at 6:00) and measuring the lateral deflection at the BB. Obviously, it’s not just the frame/fork, the cranks, pedal spindle, etc. also factor in.
I don’t know of a test that has been done recently on tri-bikes; but Cannondales and Kuotas are generally known to be designed with a premium on BB stiffness.
BB stiffness has almost no impact on performance (i.e. there is no loss of forward propulsion), except for the rare case where the frame flexes enough that it creates excessive chain rub or unintentional shifts during hard efforts…
“Im looking for a bike that can take the pounding, specially during climbs when I crank out the big gears…”
coupla things. almost all the good tri bikes today are quite laterally stiff.
but, your description above suggests that you ride the bike differently than i do. what i’m trying to achieve when i ascend on a tri bike is:
i’ll stay in the aero position and spin up whenever possible;
i’ll ride close to my average power on the ascents.
if you ride like i do, you never need mega bb stiffness (which turns out, btw, often to not be at the bb, rather with the downtube bending moment of frames not far behind the head tube, that is, the frame is twisting near the front of the main triangle).
but it’s a moot point. if you’re a triathlete, or even a TTer, you don’t want to muscle your machine with big watts and big torque out of the saddle up a climb (regardless of what you see on TV during grand tour TTs). remember, as a triathlete, the bike leg is an exercise in who can whisper the loudest. if you average 240 watts for a ride, maybe ride 270w up the hill, but, if possible, spinning while in the aero position. then you don’t need a bike built specifically for lateral stiffness, and, if you don’t need this, then your bike can be more aero, lighter, whatever it is you get when you don’t require your TT bike to be a tank.
I have no experience on it, but I imagine that the Cannondale Slice with BB30 like Chrissie Wellington rides has a a pretty stiff BB and should lay power down. But if you dont want to buy the Cannondale Hollowgram cranks which are around 735 dont bother with it.
"just curious, people who worry about stifness, what are you really after?"
For me… lateral stiffness in the frame and wheels. Enough so brakes don’t rub when climbing or sprinting. (In truth, I believe this is more a function of lateral wheel stiffness.)
I also like stiffer bikes because of my weight (anywhere from 195 - 225 depending on how much of a lazy-ass I’ve been). Most “stiff” bikes are still a bit flexy for me which provides comfort. A bike that is “soft” for some 160lb dude is really soft for me. I just don’t like the way it feels… sometimes it “feels” really unsafe. (I’m not claiming it is, it’s just a personal preference)
Edited to add…
But then I just answered this question with a road bike in mind, getting OT
I do follow what you are saying. And that is how I usually ride. I try climb on the big gears when I ride on fast group rides, so I don’t get dropped, keeping my cadence at around 70ish… My wattage is around 350watts when I do that…but Im able to keep up with the guys up front…
When I climb on the small chain ring, my cadence is about 85ish, and my watts are around 280, but I also notice that Im going 1-1.5 mph slower on the climb…
On flats my avg wattage is about 230-240 for a 3hr ride…
“When I climb on the small chain ring, my cadence is about 85ish, and my watts are around 280”
are you sitting up, hands on the pursuits? or are you in the aero position? i ask, because if/when i sit up and climb on a tri bike, yes, i’ve got that loss of power. but if i stay aero, and even increase my cadence to maybe 95 or 100, and spin (if it’s not a long climb), then i keep my power and save my legs from high torque exertions that seem to tire them out over the long haul.
on long climbs, like, a mile or more, then i still stay in the aero position, but my cadence is more like 85, not 95 to 105 as they would be on the short climbs of a half mile or less.
I tend to agree with pooks. I am a gear masher too, and my problems are with rear wheels flexing between the brake pads, especially while climbing and even more so with a disc wheel. I am hoping that the Stinger disc will solve this problem.
If stiffness is your main concern, then consider going with a bike that is carbon, aluminum mix. I ride the BMC TT02, the seat airfoil and fork are carbon and the rest of the bike is aluminum. Super stiff. I think in most cases aluminum will be stiffer than a carbon frame.